The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Wangming]

i would expect something to show in midnight. Not only is the plot about elven reunification. The theme of darkness and especially Midnight would be the best opportunity to have the goddess of night to show up.

I know, right? Midnight would be the perfect opportunity to show Elune.

[Xilurm]

I know, right? Midnight would be the perfect opportunity to show Elune.

Praying to the Titans they don't fuck her up.

[Enrif]

Still find it weird how they pushed Jaina do hard at bfa at the time, while we could have had a Tyrande and Azshara face off in bfa.

Their anwser: "there are only so much characters, we cant do all" basically. Jaina was a odd choice. Tho this face off could still be in the cards someday hopefully.

Jaina made absolute sense for BfA, as we knew she was a Kul Tiran. But, they could have delievered a better story in regards to Tyrande, Sylvanas and Azshara.

Imagine the scene where Nathanos brings the dagger to Azhara would have instead be Sylvanas with Tyrande gaving chase, and then Tyrande, instead of Jaina would be part of the Nazjatar story beat. But that is too late.

[Wangming]

Still find it weird how they pushed Jaina do hard at bfa at the time, while we could have had a Tyrande and Azshara face off in bfa.

Their anwser: "there are only so much characters, we cant do all" basically. Jaina was a odd choice. Tho this face off could still be in the cards someday hopefully.

Just another example of Blizzard hating night elves.

[Sondrelk]

1. You barely travel outside of a expansion zone. And if you do, there is ways for travel (see Siren Isle, Undermine, and how we go to the Arathi Highlands for a quest chain). The wish for a seamless world isn't on a technical level possible in the current game.

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If we get a seamless Quel'thalas onto the EK map, it will not be the cataclysm, current, version. It would be more likely, that they prepare Quel'thalas, to expand from there onto the rest of the EK instead. But that will come sometime after the saga, if at all.

A fully seamless world probably isnt possible. But I think players are within their rights to expect that Quel'thalas, which is physically connected to EK by land, should be seamless. Especially when that has been a request by the playerbase for years, especially when it comes to a world revamp.


Making Quel'thalas bigger with a no take backsies, trust us bro, verbal promise to eventually expand the rest of EK to the same size is just setting the playerbase up to hate the developers.
It's not realistically feasible to do so. Even more when you have to consider that most zones in EK and Kalimdor are not as lore dense or interesting as the ones in Northern EK.

[Wangming]

Praying to the Titans they don't fuck her up.

At this point we have to accept that praying to the Titans just makes things worse.

[Raetary]

Praying to the Titans they don't fuck her up.

I mean, SL did that enough with the "whoopsie daisy, i just condemned all my FAVORITE CHILDREN (looks at stonewright, Thiernax and Khaliq) to eternal torment"

[Enrif]

A fully seamless world probably isnt possible. But I think players are within their rights to expect that Quel'thalas, which is physically connected to EK by land, should be seamless. Especially when that has been a request by the playerbase for years, especially when it comes to a world revamp.


Making Quel'thalas bigger with a no take backsies, trust us bro, verbal promise to eventually expand the rest of EK to the same size is just setting the playerbase up to hate the developers.
It's not realistically feasible to do so. Even more when you have to consider that most zones in EK and Kalimdor are not as lore dense or interesting as the ones in Northern EK.

it is the only way to make Quel'thalas big enough for a expansion. And there is time people have to think what they prefer: a expansion area that has the right size for an expansion, or a seamless transition to the old world. You can have one, but not the other with the current technical limitations. And i would prefer for a great expansion area, instead of having the ability to fly from the plague lands to Quel'thalas.

IF, big IF, we every get a seamless world, it will not use the cata map as a starting point. It is more feasible to start Midnight onwards to build the framework that allows a seamless world. And then, when we actually return to the rest of the EK, the cata version can be put in the caverns of time.

And honestly, thinking about how the housing zone apparently isn't part of the open world too, they might be cooking already something. But not on the Cata version of the map.

[Sondrelk]

it is the only way to make Quel'thalas big enough for a expansion. And there is time people have to think what they prefer: a expansion area that has the right size for an expansion, or a seamless transition to the old world. You can have one, but not the other with the current technical limitations. And i would prefer for a great expansion area, instead of having the ability to fly from the plague lands to Quel'thalas.

IF, big IF, we every get a seamless world, it will not use the cata map as a starting point. It is more feasible to start Midnight onwards to build the framework that allows a seamless world. And then, when we actually return to the rest of the EK, the cata version can be put in the caverns of time.

And honestly, thinking about how the housing zone apparently isn't part of the open world too, they might be cooking already something. But not on the Cata version of the map.

It's one of those where you have to weigh up making an expansion just around Quel'thalas, against making a world revamp (partial, but still) that players have wanted for years. You can't realistically have both.

You say "use the cata world" but a world revamp would have to use that as a framework anyways. Unless you mean literally the same sized zones, which I agree on.
We know how the EK looks, so whatever revamp, whether Northern EK or just Quel'thalas will have to follow that rough framework anyways.
Personally I think they should remake Northern EK, same framework, but effectively remade by flattening old zone boundaries and amalgamating smaller zones into bigger ones. Like Silverpine and Tirisfal into one Lordaeron zone. Or the Plaguelands into one Eastweald.

[Wangming]

A fully seamless world probably isnt possible. But I think players are within their rights to expect that Quel'thalas, which is physically connected to EK by land, should be seamless. Especially when that has been a request by the playerbase for years, especially when it comes to a world revamp.


Making Quel'thalas bigger with a no take backsies, trust us bro, verbal promise to eventually expand the rest of EK to the same size is just setting the playerbase up to hate the developers.
It's not realistically feasible to do so. Even more when you have to consider that most zones in EK and Kalimdor are not as lore dense or interesting as the ones in Northern EK.

Which is why what makes sense is to disconnect Northern EK at the Thandole span and make THAT into a proper expansion sized area.

Question/request for someone good at image editing: How big is the playable area in DF (not counting the underground zone and Emerald Dream, compared to Northern EK now in game?

[Enrif]

It's one of those where you have to weigh up making an expansion just around Quel'thalas, against making a world revamp (partial, but still) that players have wanted for years. You can't realistically have both.

That's what i'm saying.

You say "use the cata world" but a world revamp would have to use that as a framework anyways. Unless you mean literally the same sized zones, which I agree on.
We know how the EK looks, so whatever revamp, whether Northern EK or just Quel'thalas will have to follow that rough framework anyways.
Personally I think they should remake Northern EK, same framework, but effectively remade by flattening old zone boundaries and amalgamating smaller zones into bigger ones. Like Silverpine and Tirisfal into one Lordaeron zone. Or the Plaguelands into one Eastweald.

Most people who advocate for a northern EK revamp to be part of the Midnight expansion put everything as part of the cata map (which is also technically the classic map)

But why? Cata has cost us classic zones, and it was one of the biggest mistakes blizz every did. That's why outland wasn't replaced by draenor, but instead we have both.

So, if a revamp comes, it will not be the same instance that the current cata version of EK/Kalimdor use. Like Midnight Quel'thalas will not use the same instance that TBC Quel'thalas uses.

[Xilurm]

Can't they just use mists like they do with delves?

[Darkarath]

I wouldn't drop the possibility that Midnight has a new world map, especially since we got K'aresh short story. We can read there the consequences of a Void Lord consuming your planet and even your suns. Although, to be fair, I don't expect that we would have that kind of Void invasion.

Truly one if not the biggest question of Midnight. How the revamp would work? IMO one thing is looking increasingly certain, more zones besides QT would be revamped.

I'm surprised that the new store mount generated so little debate. A new kind of creature, from Uldum, just when Midnight is around the corner? Why? It's description gives some lore too.

Was Danuser planning a world revamp after TWW to populate the world with his shitty stories so that he became essential for the game? Metzen would have some job to do if that were to be the case.

[Hearthfinder]

I think they would probably build a new continent (easier) inside a new instance, but give each zone a bare bones treatment like Arathi Highlands got for Battle for Azeroth.

A pretty but relatively empty canvas, so to speak.

I think the Thandol Span is perfect for this purpose. When you approach it from the south, you see a vast chasm that divides the two halves of the continent, perhaps shrouded in mist coming in from the sea as well. Maybe a huge dwarven gate, and a much longer bridge than what we have today.

Perhaps you even see dwarves working to repair it within a few years' time.

Maybe there's a bronze dragon giving you the choice to see the new or the old version of the Thandol Span, and by extension the new or old gateway to the northern half of the continent.

Once you're there, like I said it's basically a canvas of beautiful (larger) zones with world content and events on them, with the majority of the campaign taking place up north.

[Enrif]

Which is why what makes sense is to disconnect Northern EK at the Thandole span and make THAT into a proper expansion sized area.

Question/request for someone good at image editing: How big is the playable area in DF (not counting the underground zone and Emerald Dream, compared to Northern EK now in game?

i'm sure there is someone who has made that. but what i quickly found was this, that has all the zones up to shadowlands if they would be places next to each other with their real size



Well, with the above you can guess how big DF would be, as we have a comparison to northrend

[Sondrelk]

That's what i'm saying.



Most people who advocate for a northern EK revamp to be part of the Midnight expansion put everything as part of the cata map (which is also technically the classic map)

But why? Cata has cost us classic zones, and it was one of the biggest mistakes blizz every did. That's why outland wasn't replaced by draenor, but instead we have both.

So, if a revamp comes, it will not be the same instance that the current cata version of EK/Kalimdor use. Like Midnight Quel'thalas will not use the same instance that TBC Quel'thalas uses.

The reason I think we will get everything on the same map is that by having a barrier, your u will always have players either asking to have it removed, or asking to get "X revamped zone".

Having everything on the same map, but with zoning technology like we have seen used since BfA you won't have a giant opaque wall being a reminder forever of what we don't have.

[Khaza-R]

I don't think new world design is at all compatible with cataclysm era design. You would have to downgrade the quality of Midnight zones to try to make a smooth transition even if the older zones got some HD update. So quite frankly it isn't going to happen. Best you can hope for is maybe some airlock tech to not break immersion. But who knows if that will ever be possible between expansion servers.

[Joshuaj]

Praying to the Titans they don't fuck her up.

Why would you pray to the Titans? Elune is your goddess, no?

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I mean, SL did that enough with the "whoopsie daisy, i just condemned all my FAVORITE CHILDREN (looks at stonewright, Thiernax and Khaliq) to eternal torment"

Tbf here, the Kaldorei were probably the only children to possibly take up after her in terms of appearance and whatnot.

[Makorus]

Surely the "issue" of current Quel'thalas being behind a loading zone is a good thing in terms of adding the actual zone to the world?

You can just attach the new zones to the current world map, and remove the portal, and add a person at the Ghostlands to be like "hey can I go to the old place ".

Yeah, the transition between EPL -> Ghostlands will be janky in terms of graphics, but is that really that big of a problem? We'll have portals anyway.

[Sondrelk]

I don't think new world design is at all compatible with cataclysm era design. You would have to downgrade the quality of Midnight zones to try to make a smooth transition even if the older zones got some HD update. So quite frankly it isn't going to happen. Best you can hope for is maybe some airlock tech to not break immersion. But who knows if that will ever be possible between expansion servers.

Zone design is not that different. The visual design has mostly stuck at the same fidelity since WoD, and while noticeable, it's not all that distracting to go between zones like Arathi Highlands and the Hinterlands.

- - - Updated - - -

Surely the "issue" of current Quel'thalas being behind a loading zone is a good thing in terms of adding the actual zone to the world?

You can just attach the new zones to the current world map, and remove the portal, and add a person at the Ghostlands to be like "hey can I go to the old place ".

Yeah, the transition between EPL -> Ghostlands will be janky in terms of graphics, but is that really that big of a problem? We'll have portals anyway.

Yeah, it's really not as complicated as people make it seem.