The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Darkarath]

What version of a revamp do you guys prefer and find the most likely?


A - Full revamp of Kalimdor and the Eastern Kingdoms
B - Staggered full revamp of Kalimdor and the Eastern Kingdoms (one continent at a time)
C - Visual refresh of Kalimdor and the Eastern Kingdoms (HD textures etc, same landscape)
D - Slow but steady updates to old zones every now and then (like Arathi Highlands, Darkshore and Silithus)
E - Instead of revamping the old, they give us a "new Azeroth" on the other side of the world
F - We go back in time to a primordial Azeroth, into the future, or to an alternate timeline

Option A would be wonderful but it is just not going to happen. It would be like doing the work of three expansions for one.

Option B is the only possible way in which a world revamp would work. If they keep the content cadence of DF, I think that they are capable of doing a full continent with just one expansion and its patches.

Option C is certainly possible but I do not really see the appeal. Unless it is something easy to do, it is just time spent for nothing, as it would be trivial content anyway that most players would not go back to.

Option D would just not work. Updating a zone and then another one in the next expansion would not make sense. That approach would only cause more bugs and make the game even more confusing.

Option E is what we are probably getting. It could work really well, but they would have to introduce a ton of new an amazing lore for us to give a shit about what is happening there or we could have another SL situation.

Option F... God I hope no. They have damaged the lore almost beyond repair and something like that would be the final nail in the coffin.

[micwini]

I don't see how this "one legion" discussion is contributing to "10.x and 11.0 speculation"

[Lahis]

Not that it was even said the Legion is infinitely large. Just that there's only one across all timelines.

If there is one Legion across infinite number of timelines, it would make the Legion infinitely large. They can always pull more demons in from more timelines.

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I jsut hope it gives a Green recolour of the 10.1 world set. Seems fitting after Forbidden Reach gave the green variant of the Primal Storms set.

Currently it gives the blue one.

[Lahis]

And they likely have. Your point?

Then how could we win against the Legion? Infinity is too big number to beat.

[Well Done Steak]

If the construct of time itself doesn't effect the Shadowlands, then it should straight up not exist. Meaning, no variants for "alternate universes" cause time doesn't exist for there to be any, no flow of anything, no inevitable end or limit, no 3-D nor 4-D constraint, nothing. Hell, because the construct of time doesn't exist, that means time doesn't exist there conceptually either, meaning this is beyond any 4-D ordeal.

Do y'all not know the meaning of the word "construct", or?

The Dream isn't bound to the concepts of space and time either.

And yes, it does? The Legion is a massive threat that's led by a fallen Lord of Order. That shit needs to be scary, especially due to Sargeras' rep across the Cosmos.

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Imma keep it real, neither do I.

So, what do we all think the new zone is gonna be again? The Dream? Amirdrassil? G'hanir (A place within the Dream, not the Artifact)?

...

"Time isnt a construct of death" doesn't mean time doesn't exist in the SL. Just that it isn't a construct governed by death, which is why it behaves differently in the SL compared to reality. This is why thrall, jaina, anduin, and baine all felt like they were trapped for a very long time in the maw.

No it doesn't...

Burning our universe is enough, why the fuck would we care about other universes. The legion is already a massive threat just like that.

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The same way we beat the Mawsworn (Another infinity army that's even bigger than the Legion...don't ask): By destroying their command.

So then you're saying that Zovaal accomplished his goals in other time lines just like sarg and Azewrath.

. If that's the case, then the cosmos is lost, and since each cosmic realms is single in nature then that means he won, but then he didn't cuz we beat him????

Lmao....

Yeah, no.

[Raetary]

The same way we beat the Mawsworn (Another infinity army that's even bigger than the Legion...don't ask): By destroying their command.

The Mawsworn weren't infinite, they were limited to the souls that got stuck within the Maw.
it was just a big army that never actually went anywhere.

The Legion doesn't have that restriction, they have free reign over the twisting nether and the physical universe, including other timelines.
They can pull out any number of demons, from where and whenever, for whatever they need.
Their command structure is then by extension infinite.

Even if we work under the pretense that at least titans don't exist in other realities, there would still be an infinite number of Archimondes and Kil'jaedens, or even Illidans, or even Azsharas, that would be there ready to take command and continue the crusade.

It just doesn't work.

[Cheezits]

Looks beautiful on a surface level. Lacks charm and character. It’s very mid overall.

I'd say it's the best Dragonflight zone for the number of charming characters and cultures it contains. Waking Shores are too empty, the Maruuk aren't interesting and then the dragon culture in Thaldrazzus is interesting but too small.

The Gnolls and Tuskarr are great and the Blue Dragons, while very few, are the best flight by far within DF.

[Cheezits]

Also the "infinite" thing is semantics, and also incorrect. Both the Legion and Mawsworn were a shit load of monsters limited to ONE timeline, not infinite timelines: Alex and Danuser's infinite legion/string theory arguments aren't represented in-game. Danuser saying ULTRA GARROSH doesn't matter nor is it shown ingame when the Garrosh we see is 100% the Garrosh we killed from our timeline.

The only actual infinite army in the game is *drumroll* the INFINITE dragonflight. Because they come from every timeline.

[Raetary]

Also, idk why people are so upset about the time thing.

Warcraft isn't exactly the first franchise to have walkable realms that fall outside of time and space, that people can traverse and experience without any meaningful issue.

[Sondrelk]

Then how could we win against the Legion? Infinity is too big number to beat.

Would be a shame if it stuck to that. We have all the dragonflight variants except the Green one, and I imagine 10.2 will add a new set to collect.

[Well Done Steak]

Danuser actually answers your top question perfectly

It's not that the Shadowlands has a different flow of time there, it's just that mortals perceive things differently. Time just straight up loses its meaning in the Realms of Death, as it's unbound by the influence of Order and its laws (which include time).

Again, that doesn't imply that there's one SL for infinite universes.

Time has to exist is some form in the SL, even if it's "not a contruct of death"...

The 6 cosmic forces are in balance with each other, they can't exist properly without the other 5.

All in all he just talks about perception... But yeah, totally means one SL for infinite universes.

[Fahrad Wagner]

Azure Span surpremacy.

My favourite zone this expansion with Ohn'ahran Plains, loved the Tuskarr and the Blue Dragonflight questlines, it reminded me so much of playing WotLK all these years ago! I don't think it was a poor emulation of Grizzly Hills, it felt similar but also very different, for me it was a toot!

Also, I've just finished all the races of the Kalimdor Cup in gold difficulty, so I've been spending quite some time in Kalimdor and oh my- does dragonriding in the old world feel good! to my own surprise, it also didn't make the world feel smaller at all? I was expecting it to "dwarf" Kalimdor and make it feel like it was basically a minigolf, and it didn't, it just felt great.

The race in the Thousand Needles was an absolute blast! It felt so good to be back in these zones, and it reminded me of how much potential they all have. I really hope we're getting a world revamp now!

[Well Done Steak]

Also, idk why people are so upset about the time thing.

Warcraft isn't exactly the first franchise to have walkable realms that fall outside of time and space, that people can traverse and experience without any meaningful issue.

Because the lore in wow doesn't support that

[Raetary]

Again, that doesn't imply that there's one SL for infinite universes.

Oh no, Danuser actually confirmed that.
Despite how completely lunatic that explanation is.

https://www.wowhead.com/news/shadowl...e-draka-318186

[Well Done Steak]

Oh no, Danuser actually confirmed that.
Despite how completely lunatic that explanation is.

https://www.wowhead.com/news/shadowl...e-draka-318186

The rope analogy is moot.

Nothing in game supports it.

Since that would imply all those infinite drakas meet oblivion since SL Draka is 100% our draka and doesn't talk about any AU adventures her infinite selves had.

[Santandame]

I'd say it's the best Dragonflight zone for the number of charming characters and cultures it contains. Waking Shores are too empty, the Maruuk aren't interesting and then the dragon culture in Thaldrazzus is interesting but too small.

The Gnolls and Tuskarr are great and the Blue Dragons, while very few, are the best flight by far within DF.

See, I’m the opposite. Whilst I’m pretty firm in my belief that that Thaldraszuz is the worst zone, I’d put Waking Shores and Ohnara over Azure Span.

Waking Shores imo truly feels like a primal, prehistoric land and it has the charm of the Dragonscale Expedition dotted about in various camps, researching and cataloging the zones, as well as the Ruby Life Pools and the general slice of life goings on there with the artisan guild, lifetenders and dragon riders.

The DI Centaur are essentially Tauren in all but name and biology, and I agree they’re boring. That said, Marukai and the various Centaur villages make the Plains feel like the just authentic habited zones on the Isles.

Azure Span just feels like an attempt to recreate Grizzly Hills but bigger and better - which it failed at. It’s definitely a beautiful zone and has several landmarks (though I believe those landmarks to be very boring with very little substance to them) but the only part of the zone that has any charm or character is the Tuskaar village. Gnoll’s are fun, but Brackhenhide is not fun and it’s just a very bland subsection of the zone. I think the zone overall is incredibly lacking and is just falling on the crutch of a nice aesthetic.

Blue Dragons are definitely the best flight in DF but outside of Kalec and Sindragosa, they weren’t very present in the zone itself. The meat of the Blue Dragonflight storyline takes place in the old world - with the main Blue Flight base in the zone just feeling pretty meh.

[Cheezits]

Oh no, Danuser actually confirmed that.
Despite how completely lunatic that explanation is.

https://www.wowhead.com/news/shadowl...e-draka-318186

We meet zero AU anything in SL so yeah. Writing team canon maybe, but not to WoW.

[Santandame]

My favourite zone this expansion with Ohn'ahran Plains, loved the Tuskarr and the Blue Dragonflight questlines, it reminded me so much of playing WotLK all these years ago! I don't think it was a poor emulation of Grizzly Hills, it felt similar but also very different, for me it was a toot!

Also, I've just finished all the races of the Kalimdor Cup in gold difficulty, so I've been spending quite some time in Kalimdor and oh my- does dragonriding in the old world feel good! to my own surprise, it also didn't make the world feel smaller at all? I was expecting it to "dwarf" Kalimdor and make it feel like it was basically a minigolf, and it didn't, it just felt great.

The race in the Thousand Needles was an absolute blast! It felt so good to be back in these zones, and it reminded me of how much potential they all have. I really hope we're getting a world revamp now!

I have to disagree. It doesn’t feel similar to Grizzly Hills at all. And I don’t know why people are using the Blue Dragonflight storyline as a reason for the zone being good. The only part of that quest line that takes part in the zone is used as a hub to start most of the quests. It’s not like that quest line spans the entire span (pun not intended). It takes place primarily across greater Azeroth in old zones.

[Cheezits]

See, I’m the opposite. Whilst I’m pretty firm in my belief that that Thaldraszuz is the wurst zone, I’d put Waking Shores and Ohnara over Azure Span.

Waking Shores imo truly feels like a primal, prehistoric land and it has the charm of the Dragonscale Expedition dotted about in various camps, researching and cataloging the zones, as well as the Ruby Life Pools and the general slice of life goings on there with the artisan guild, lifetenders and dragon riders.

I really do not like the Dragonscale Expedition because every character is the same bland, friendly archetype and they all act the same regardless of culture. They are a detractor to the zone experience imo, even if their settlements are well spread out.

They don't even tease any changes to the world post-timeskip (on purpose, likely) so there's no real benefit to combing over their quests.

I like the Red dragons there but I wish they were used more.

[Raetary]

Because the lore in wow doesn't support that

Doesn't support what exactly?
Because the dream is straight up a place where time doesn't mean anything canonically, yet we and other characters walk around it all the damn time