The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[JohnnyCasual]

Yeah uh... it actually does. Which is why I love choosing the Empire in SWTOR and electrocuting anyone that stands in my way as my Sith Inquisitor. Or mauling people over with a car in GTA. /shrug

I respect video games as a medium that allows you to explore our primate violence in a safe space. But you are choosing to be the villain. It doesnt make your decisions magically morally correct.

[milkmustache]

I wonder if the quest writers for Voidstorm ever thought they'd add 50 pages in a day to a thread on MMO-C off the alpha alone.

[LarryWithTheWeatherReport]

I still consider Cataclysm worse than Shadowlands in terms of what it did to the setting and tone.

I simply cannot forgive so many cool zones and quest chains being changed and removed. Redridge and Uldum being largely dictated by prolonged references to movies, beautiful zones such as Darkshore and Ashenvale being destroyed...the list goes on.

Cataclysm was fricken awesome though and had so many top tier characters in it.

[COBRAstriker]

I still consider Cataclysm worse than Shadowlands in terms of what it did to the setting and tone.

I simply cannot forgive so many cool zones and quest chains being changed and removed. Redridge and Uldum being largely dictated by prolonged references to movies, beautiful zones such as Darkshore and Ashenvale being destroyed...the list goes on.

That's nothing compared to shitting on Arthas, turning the Helm of Domination into a shitty questing green, Sylvanas' 'I will never serve', Nippleman being the mastermind behind everything starting from WC3, the censorship spree, and so on. BfA and Shadowlands pretty much killed an entire community, those that cared about the lore and setting. These 2 expansions also drove away most content creators too, either to classic or other games

[Monkal]

midnight will be worse than shadowlands

I don't know how to make this clear but: Midnight is not going to be bad just because people on this godforsaken forum disagree about the way Turalyon is being written.

[LarryWithTheWeatherReport]

I mean, Shadowlands would have been a top 3 expansion with the current patch cadence so ..... where is the problem?

As long as its not as bad as BfA or WoD.

BFA had the potential to be the best in my opinion if they get rid of the faction war and focus more on Azshara and N’zoth. It already had a solid troll content which is a plus.


Without the faction war stuff, it would have more space for other content.

[JohnnyCasual]

Please don't call Xilurm a fascist. We don't often see eye to eye, but they're a decent person.

That was probably too over the line. its early and I was rubbed the wrong way but thats not an excuse. I rescend that final remark.

[milkmustache]

I don't know how to make this clear but: Midnight is not going to be bad just because people on this godforsaken forum disagree about the way Turalyon is being written.

This genuinely might be the most insane few days I have ever seen on this thread.

[LarryWithTheWeatherReport]

I don't know how to make this clear but: Midnight is not going to be bad just because people on this godforsaken forum disagree about the way Turalyon is being written.

Midnights starting zones already makes it better than the last 3 expansions at the very least and have good potential to be one of the best top 3 ever.

A troll zone check, a badass invasion check, the 3 wind runner sisters check among other cool characters like Valeera and an epic villain and other stuff. Prey seems interesting too.

It’s at least looking to be my top 3 even as someone that don’t care about housing.

[Nymrohd]

I don't know how to make this clear but: Midnight is not going to be bad just because people on this godforsaken forum disagree about the way Turalyon is being written.

Yeah, it will be bad because of the insane prune, class redesign and no addon support

[Lady Atia]

I still consider Cataclysm worse than Shadowlands in terms of what it did to the setting and tone.

I simply cannot forgive so many cool zones and quest chains being changed and removed. Redridge and Uldum being largely dictated by prolonged references to movies, beautiful zones such as Darkshore and Ashenvale being destroyed...the list goes on.

Cataclysm had two big problems - first, they removed any kind of personal cutting edge or server first reward, so as a raider you have nothing that reminds you that you were there, especially if you arent in the guild anymore that did the server first FoS.

2nd, dragonsoul. Abyssal Maw being cut was bad enough, but reworking the war of the ancients raid into (although cool) dungeons but than just having reused bullshit in dragonsoul and a really boring fight for madness .... .... well.

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Yeah, it will be bad because of the insane prune, class redesign and no addon support

All of that is good for the game though??

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BFA had the potential to be the best in my opinion if they get rid of the faction war and focus more on Azshara and N’zoth. It already had a solid troll content which is a plus.


Without the faction war stuff, it would have more space for other content.

Yeah, or just focus on the faction war stuff and say N'zoth was behind it > Old God Expansion next.

But as it stands, BfA shall always be remembered as the expansion were Afrasiabi tried to rape Sylvanas, aswell as the waste of potential for Nyalotha and Nazjatar which should have been both expansions on their own ...

[Nightshade711]

My point is that X'era clearly acted in an authoritarian way which is not how Naaru are supposed to act - I will never agree that Illidan wasn't fully justified blasting that big chadelier

The theory I’ve had for a while is that the reason why Xe’ra acted the way she did was because of Lothraxion manipulating her.
But I’m starting to doubt we’ll ever find out given the Lothraxion stuff in Midnight.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Also, where is this idea that X'era was enslaving Illidan's will coming from? Are we just assuming it is the Lightbound process from AU (which we only know by hearsay and only speculate it is something AU X'era does). It is just as possible she was removing the Fel influence and replacing it with Light. It is still wrong because it was being done against Illidan's will but why are we assuming his entire personality was being overwritten?
Also, was his personality not already influenced by the Fel? Every creature we've seen get Fel infused screams about hatred and destruction. Sure Illidan and the DHs learn to handle it, those that survive, but it absolutely has eroded their sense of self already.

It’s really just fanfic ya. We see the light forging process both done by Xera and without her and there’s no personality overwriting.

As to the effects of Fel, Illidan was such a jackass before he was “fel forged” by Sargaras that who knows if you could even tell the difference if it did effect him.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

I can't deny Voidstorm is funny in the sense that it really showcases our economical problems that the Narrative Team have to deal with in a very poignant and easy to understand manner. The most exciting things about this expansion had to be instead re-routed through Voidstorm to crush those concepts and lose its' potential because of cost issues and resource issues.

Obviously the cherry on the cake is that its' just another Xal'atath swoops in, sucks up energies and leaves scenario that awaits us for the nth time.

[Dracullus]

If WoW wasn't a "replacement life" for so many people in America I guarantee the tone would've remained fairly faithful. Unfortunately bad social climate IRL plus bad social climate ingame = unsubs and I'm sure that BFA + SL's combo of story discourse + unsubs traumatized their shareholders.

Mists, WoD, BFA and SL all have some of the most unsubs and they all are very war-themed.

Well, too bad Blizzard sub graph from two years ago clearly show Legion subs mirror Mists, WoD, BfA and SL cycle. I guess you can fit Legion into war theme. Maybe because almost every WoW expansion is war themed xD.

Only expansion without big drop after release (of course after early era when huge wave of new players replaced unsubing people) is Dragonflight, but I doubt it has anything to do with expac theme. I think its result of many things starting working at same time: patch every 2 month supported with multiple classic releases, trading post, yearly sub bonuses - and people are more confident to take them when patch cycle is predictable.

[Monkal]

Yeah, it will be bad because of the insane prune, class redesign and no addon support

Class design can be tweaked and the pruning seems to be a mixed bag (going from what I read on Wowhead). The addon stuff is just bullshit; this player base created an ecosystem of over reliance on third-party stuff and convinced itself Blizzard has an obligation to keep that stuff on the game.

[Nightshade711]

It’s really just fanfic ya. We see the light forging process both done by Xera and without her and there’s no personality overwriting.

As to the effects of Fel, Illidan was such a jackass before he was “fel forged” by Sargaras that who knows if you could even tell the difference if it did effect him.

If lightforging basically enslaved you Turalyon wouldn’t have gone against Xe’ra when he did & the lightforged warlocks would probably not exist.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

i don't think he is a dumbass here. Faol states, that faith is the focus lense of the light. And if the focus is on aggression, its focal point becomes wrath. This seems absolutely in line with what is said here. The Scarlets, the Arathi and the Army of the Light are very military first approach to the light, smiting down undead, heretics, and demons respectively, which if focused by the lights powers becomes wrath. If the focus would be protection or healing instead of retribution, it might be completely different and the wrath angle never plays into it.

When Arator brings up the light and its wrath later he also says he feels it within him self, his focus isn’t hate so he’s saying the wrath comes from the light not the focus of the person even though Foal tells him flat out that is wrong.

[Xilurm]

Please don't call Xilurm a fascist. We don't often see eye to eye, but they're a decent person.

That's unexpected. Thanks. And sorry if I've ever been too harsh with my opinions over the years.

I respect video games as a medium that allows you to explore our primate violence in a safe space. But you are choosing to be the villain. It doesnt make your decisions magically morally correct.

True, but that's within the confines of the games. It doesn't mean I agree with the choices morally. I often feel bad when playing RPG's like Mass Effect and Fallout and make choices that are bad.

[Ersula]

i don't think he is a dumbass here. Faol states, that faith is the focus lense of the light. And if the focus is on aggression, its focal point becomes wrath. This seems absolutely in line with what is said here. The Scarlets, the Arathi and the Army of the Light are very military first approach to the light, smiting down undead, heretics, and demons respectively, which if focused by the lights powers becomes wrath. If the focus would be protection or healing instead of retribution, it might be completely different and the wrath angle never plays into it.

Is this going to be another example of a character talking figuratively & metaphorically and then people take it to be a literal explanation of how the actual mechanics of the world work?