The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Ersula]

Can they ... please .... stop .... with the .... china only .... bullshit oO???

WoW currently has more subscribers in China than they do in North America, so no.

[Lady Atia]

I'm wondering where the Iron Horde even got Sabers from. Tigers from Stranglethorn would make more sense, but that involves updating tigers which they won't do.

There were tigers on Draenor.

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WoW currently has more subscribers in China than they do in North America, so no.

I mean, even if that would be the case .... there is 0 reason to give region exclusive stuff again outside of netease contract bullshitting.

[Pheraz]

... As for story, Arator is really annoying.

Please tell me he is not another generic weak teenage man with too many emotions sterotype like Anduin or the blue drake?

[Joshuaj]

So, finally got around to playing the beta.
Did the intro, did the Eversong quests, reached Harandar.

The zones are gorgeous and i am perfectly satisfied with how Eversong turned out.
But i ended up agreeing with the few people that criticized how spacious Silvermoon it, particularly Murder Row is just weirdly empty.
Though i take more of an issue with the general bulkiness of Elven buildings, it works at the scale they are working on for the most part, but when you get closer its just a bit much.
Oh, and i would've preferred if they kept more of the park/garden.
The city is very, very white, and could've kept more of the greenery.

As for story, Arator is really annoying.
Turalyons antagonism feels really forced it.
I still love Bob though.
And i really like Liraths demeanor and voice in the dungeon.

As for (priest) gameplay...
Boy, the priest class talents are an absolute mess.
I issued feedback on like half the tree, the entire right half is just all over the place with underwhelming stat buffs that should not be that early, or exist at all, with basic spells being so deep down.
It feels like i have to pick between static healing/damage increases and very milquetoast utility that require 3-5 times as many talent points.
I also don't understand why they felt the need to remove Shadow Word: Pain for Holy/Shadow, the lack of a proper tagging tool is really noticeable.

Unopular opinion apparently, but i don't like the Shadow tentacle either.
I know people hated the reticle, but i would've preferred if they used the directional one like Evokers have instead.
Idk how many times i had to use both my stacks to dot the bunch of mobs (that i ran into to quickly aggro them because there is no SW:P to do it from a safe distance...) because some of them ended up behind the tentacle animation.

There are some nice changes though.
I do like that talent that merges Sanctify into Serenity, Benediction is nice as spell upgrades go.
Moving Restitution next to Guardian Angel is lovely.

Funny you talk about the garden stuff, as there is a whole garden of remembrance area, and the Court of the Sun became a park/residential hangout area (changed from its TBC palace look). I think the city is fine personally, as there are a lot of cramped areas still, with the spacious parts giving the city some nice flare to them (It's also akin to how IRL cities operate, with it being mostly cramped with some spacious areas on occasion, namely regarding city centers and parks).

If I had ONE nitpick, it's the fact we have no fish fountains anymore. Would've loved to see at least one of them, or even a few of them at the Quel'danas fountain, but bigger and golden. Ofc, that's basically me wanting a rainbow on what is essentially platinum perfection imo.

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I do think there could be a few more NPCs in the city, but idk whatcha mean by the city looking "too white". Has a perfect color blend imo. I am slightly upset the indigo curtains are gone, but I think the red and light blue curtains work better (as it fits with the Blood Elf racial logo), and there's still indigo inside the buildings (they're just part of the windows and whatnot now).

Also, some of the buildings have flora around them, which makes the city look extra nice imo.

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Please tell me he is not another generic weak teenage man with too many emotions sterotype like Anduin or the blue drake?

No, he's not...

He's a generic "weak" (Depends on your definition of weak ig) middle aged man (By Human standards ofc. Elf wise? Yeah he's prolly akin to a teen lol) with too many emotions stereotype.

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I'm wondering where the Iron Horde even got Sabers from. Tigers from Stranglethorn would make more sense, but that involves updating tigers which they won't do.

I mean, the SABERON had to come from somewhere, right?

[Vakir]

more effort from netease than from blizzard

the best blizzard could do for the anniversary was giving players a fugly questing set

Isn't Netease publishing, not developing?

That makes them both the problem here for that sweet, sweet China money.

Please tell me he is not another generic weak teenage man with too many emotions sterotype like Anduin or the blue drake?

"Better" in the sense of being seemingly a bit more aggressive in response to martial threats, but still mealy mouthed and apologetic and self-critical because Light forbid we enjoy smiting, and he's worse in the sense that he says some of the dumbest shit imaginable in his questline.

"Uther cast healing spells and didn't just hammer in people's ribcages? WHOOOOOAAAAA"

[Makorus]

There were tigers on Draenor.

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I mean, even if that would be the case .... there is 0 reason to give region exclusive stuff again outside of netease contract bullshitting.

Well that's what it is. It's the same thing with Overwatch. One of the conditions Netease had was that they should get their own marketing, QA and exclusive contents/events. This was non-negotiable, so of course Blizzard had to play ball. None of those items are made by Blizzard, but by Netease. Same with all the realms and all that.

[Sondrelk]

WoW currently has more subscribers in China than they do in North America, so no.

Its also distributed by a third party given carte blanche to make whatever changes they want. So in terms of effort, it's about on the same level as a private server adding a mount because they don't have anything else to do besides host and bugfix.

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more effort from netease than from blizzard

the best blizzard could do for the anniversary was giving players a fugly questing set

I am not sure you have heard. But Blizzard developers are working on this new thing called Midnight that is supposedly in Beta right now.
Might be a bit obscure. Not surprised you have not heard of it.

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Well that's what it is. It's the same thing with Overwatch. One of the conditions Netease had was that they should get their own marketing, QA and exclusive contents/events. This was non-negotiable, so of course Blizzard had to play ball. None of those items are made by Blizzard, but by Netease. Same with all the realms and all that.

Yup. In terms of effort, it's about on the level of a private server making its own mount.

[Cheezits]

I think the mounts are just early access to China, as they aren't explicitly Chinese themed like the Sunhawk and they are too detailed to be used for one region. I think we saw this already with the Nightborne Bull?

Ironically they feel like mounts very closely tied to Tink*rs so maybe they were planned for TLT?

[Ersula]

I think the mounts are just early access to China, as they aren't explicitly Chinese themed like the Sunhawk and they are too detailed to be used for one region. I think we saw this already with the Nightborne Bull?

Ironically they feel like mounts very closely tied to Tink*rs so maybe they were planned for TLT?

The China stuff will definitely come to the rest of the world eventually. Though "eventually" for Blizzard is usually like 5 - 8 years.

But they were undoubtably developed during Undermined.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Please tell me he is not another generic weak teenage man with too many emotions sterotype like Anduin or the blue drake?

He’s not just an Anduin clone, he’s also just stupid in general. To repeat something I prior said to sum it up:

"Golly gee willickers! I never realized I could spec into Prot or Holy, or generally do acts of kindness other than killing baddies even though level 12 paladins did that in Classic. I, a forty year-old man, am flabbergasted by the fact that religious violence exists, and that there are ways to be religious other than religious violence. I have literally never begun to comprehend that the Light is responsive to faith after spending maybe a year or so surrounded by a multitude of paladins of various religions. I guess I just didn't have the single transient moment of downtime needed to overhear anything about other paladins in passing while I was surrounded by other paladins. I am a young soul at heart because half-elf aging is stunted, even though I've acted consistently like a mature adult up until Midnight. I am also absolutely shocked different groups can have animosity between one another over longstanding territorial disputes and centuries of bloodshed back and forth."

More than being a pointy-eared Anduin, he’s also inexplicably a stunted idiot, which is retroactively being made standard for young elves and half-elves even though it’s never been suggested to be the case before. He also is retroactively being turned neutral so he can mediate between the blood elves and Amani instead of a Horde troll.

Honestly, I think he’ll be worse than Anduin if this characterization sticks, since Anduin’s values and personality are at least mostly consistent and he’s not as inexplicably stupid, and he’s never done anything nearly as egregious as inserting himself into a centuries-long race war at the narrative expense of members of another race that are actually meaningfully engaged in said race war.

[milkmustache]

I think the mounts are just early access to China, as they aren't explicitly Chinese themed like the Sunhawk and they are too detailed to be used for one region. I think we saw this already with the Nightborne Bull?

Ironically they feel like mounts very closely tied to Tink*rs so maybe they were planned for TLT?

Eh... I dunno. We'll get this one day, sure, but it'll be a shop mount for the holidays next year, or perhaps to drum up Blizzcon hype via a promotion?

I highly doubt this is Tinker related. The connection is the tech on the panther, more than the panther itself, and there seems to be plenty of other stuff there. That said, I'd love to see a Tinker class with variability in aesthetic based on the race. Mag'har, Goblin, Draenei & Gnome all have their own very specific aesthetic technologically. It'd be really fun to explore that.

I'm anticipating an Articifer class with Titan technology, though. My wounded Spellbreaker heart still bleeds.

[Cheezits]

The China stuff will definitely come to the rest of the world eventually. Though "eventually" for Blizzard is usually like 5 - 8 years.

But they were undoubtably developed during Undermined.

The Iron Horde stuff is extremely random- but it fits a technological theme, as they are one of the more advanced engineers on the Horde (without magic, and ironically thanks to Goblins). AU Maghar have been mentioned as one of the fitting Horde candidates for an Artificer/Tinker type of class. So if TLT has them, it would fit the development of after Undmine but before TLT.

[Makorus]

I think the mounts are just early access to China, as they aren't explicitly Chinese themed like the Sunhawk and they are too detailed to be used for one region. I think we saw this already with the Nightborne Bull?

Ironically they feel like mounts very closely tied to Tink*rs so maybe they were planned for TLT?

It's not up to Blizzard, it's up to Netease, and Netease has no reason to add them to outside of China.

[Cheezits]

It's not up to Blizzard, it's up to Netease, and Netease has no reason to add them to outside of China.

Currently, besides these, China-only mounts are reskins of existing mounts. This is considerably more technical and took more art assets, so I doubt it will remain China-only. But you are technically right so yes.

[Vakir]

he’s never done anything nearly as egregious as inserting himself into a centuries-long race war at the narrative expense of members of another race that are actually meaningfully engaged in said race war.

I mean, that's a LITTLE bit Mists with the orcs and humans, but imagine if he inserted himself in the Pandaren and Mogu conflict.

"They enslaved us, you sanctimonious fool. You're banned from the Vale."

[AOL Instant Messenger]

I mean, that's a LITTLE bit Mists with the orcs and humans, but imagine if he inserted himself in the Pandaren and Mogu conflict.

"They enslaved us, you sanctimonious fool. You're banned from the Vale."

I maintain the probably-unpopular position that Mists Anduin was miles better than Anduin BfA onward. While he facially became “Manduin”, in practice he just became less proactive and more of a reactor. He also was no longer fighting as much of an uphill battle to improve his faction or seek peace against both the standards of his own faction and a ruthless and effectual Horde. BfA onward, he rarely faced meaningful ideological opposition from within his own faction (the closest he got was from victims of a genocide wanting to reclaim the land they lost during said genocide; I think even Genn helping them effectively boiled down to minimal resistance from Anduin with implicit permission, though I may be remembering a beta version or something) and really, outside of a mustache-twirling caricature, never really faced much opposition from the faction he was at war with either.

BfA-SL Anduin (haven’t gone through TWW, so I can’t judge that iteration of him) would never mind control someone to get himself cut loose from his own faction’s protection because he neither acts proactively nor faces enough pushback from his faction that he needs to ever go against their interests for him. That, or his mind control was an ambient effect for BfA.

[Khaza-R]

I maintain the probably-unpopular position that Mists Anduin was miles better than Anduin BfA onward. While he facially became “Manduin”, in practice he just became less proactive and more of a reactor. He also was no longer fighting as much of an uphill battle to improve his faction or seek peace against both the standards of his own faction and a ruthless and effectual Horde. BfA onward, he rarely faced meaningful ideological opposition from within his own faction and really, outside of a mustache-twirling caricature, never really faced much opposition from the faction he was at war with either.

The Anduin of today would never mind control someone to get himself cut loose from his own faction’s protection because he neither acts proactively nor does he face enough pushback from his faction that he needs to ever go against their interests for him. That, or his mind control has become an ambient effect.

Anduin was also like 14 years old in MoP and completely reasonable for him to be naive and idealistic. He also actually suffers the consequences of his naivety in the Divine Bell scenario thinking he can reason with Garrosh. Which is something that doesn't happen in newer characters. They are naive but also right at the same time

[Pheraz]

No, he's not...

He's a generic "weak" (Depends on your definition of weak ig) middle aged man (By Human standards ofc. Elf wise? Yeah he's prolly akin to a teen lol) with too many emotions stereotype.

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oh god no.... not again.... I get it, we don't want to be evil corp anymore but this is really becoming a problem for the game IMO. Stories are just becoming the same story over and over and over again. Its like soap opera meets pocahontas every damn time

[Timester]

It’s funny how essentially every problem of this story, notwithstanding Zul’jin’s treatment and the general softening of the Amani, the latter of which is which is as inevitable as the tide can be readily resolved by just making a Horde troll the protagonist. Now the Amani don’t need to disavow anyone for fighting the elves or get slated for removal for having the temerity to be upset at them (the brother character) and Liadrin doesn’t have to be a nanny to the guys who killed her family and tortured her. It’s not like this has anything to do with her arc and her being the calmer, wiser head is just silly.

I think people are forgetting Liadrin was always the gentle forgiving devout priestess of the Blood Elves and after the Sunwell Plateau raid, she calmed her rage and became the devout of the Light again.

Yes, there is a problem with the Liadrian writing, but it's not her acceptance and guiding of Zul'jarra, they mirror alot her past with what the Amani are dealing with. No, it's mentioning BOTH sides of Liadrin, her reasoning her calmness and devoutness. Even when she was kidnapped, she was the one that asked Halduron to stop torturing Zul'jin.

[Ersula]

It's not up to Blizzard, it's up to Netease, and Netease has no reason to add them to outside of China.

But the assets weren't created by netease; they're part of the huge collection of assets blizzard makes but doesn't make it to retail.