The War Within 11.X Patches & World Soul Saga Speculation Thread

[Sondrelk]

We could potentially get both. We got new zones alongside the cataclysm revamp.

That's one of the main failings of Cataclysm though. What was the point of revamping zones if all you did with them was have some new levelling?
A world revamp should use the revamped zones to actually have the endgame content in it, otherwise it's just a whole lot of effort for basically no gain.

And that's also not to mention how it's effectively doubling the amount of work you have to do.

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Having BfA end with eternal palace and move on with an expansion where N'zoth attacks would have been the right path. Not that I didn't like 8.3 or shadowlands but nzoth didn't live up to its build up because of this. Let's hope they don't make the same mistake with Xal'atath.

It was too crammed. And the patch just showed all the missed opportunities that came from it. The return of the Mantid for instance, but no time to explore the repercussions of that. Infected Titan facilities, but only for one quick scenario. Travelling around the world to famous Old God locations, but again only for one patch.

[Skildar]

well I'm still hoping against hope that Fyrakk manages to devouer the heart of Amirdrassil and then be infused by galakrond's essence. Because if he gets killed in 10.2 it would have mean that the whole plan of the incarnates up until now was useless thanks to Vyranoth.

Iridikron felt right as an adversary because he doesn't underestimate its foes and he decided to gather power before striking especially for this reason.

I understand that we need to win somehow but we fight Fyrakk when one foe changed team and the other is idling on the sidelines... if we kill the fire guy it would be a very weak victory where they plan ahead a lot and we just wing it without any effort

[Cheezits]

Alright, I'll bite. What makes people think an underground expansion is likely?
Is it the part where the human fights a Kobold in Elwynn? Because that seems like an extremely tenous link.
Would a murloc be a hint at Ankoan being the main ally in an underwater expansion? A picture of booty bay a hint at Nightsquall creating a pirate empire in Pandaria?

Towellie saying people are too focused on "ABOVE the water" (mentioning South Seas), posting a cave and the kobold on twitter all in the same day.

Could be a direct expansion hint, could be that cave exploring is a feature.

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well I'm still hoping against hope that Fyrakk manages to devouer the heart of Amirdrassil and then be infused by galakrond's essence. Because if he gets killed in 10.2 it would have mean that the whole plan of the incarnates up until now was useless thanks to Vyranoth.

He will lose because the Nelves losing the tree again would be insanity.

Iridikron left Vyranoth and Fyrakk in the dust to lose, Vyranoth picked up on this and swapped sides so she wouldn't end up like Fyrakk will.

[username993720]

Yep, this humanization is also what puzzles me most about the theme. While the game itself is super enjoyable and alt friendly and the outdoor zones are well executed the main theme "dragons" could have been implemented a bit better. dragons are f*cking huge, massive, ancient creatures that live long and mostly EAT humans as snacks. Also spit fire and live in caves. What we see experience in those omni observer perspective are dialogues between elves with fancy armor talking about their feelings and the past. As players the dragons shift more often from human to dragon form but while I often fled from elite jarradins in zaralek I never thought "oh shit there is a dragon" while moving outdoor. Never.
Just imagine you go into a dark cave to search for some quest giver/objective. You can barely see anything. Suddenly glowing eyes appear and "DRAGONname xyz is about to spit fire" on the screen. Either you gtfo or you are instant dead. Because eventually dragon fire should burn you to death i guess?
Not that cataclysm would have been any better there but just look at this awesome trailer where this massive deathwing kills all goblins while emerging on azeroth (plus this awesome voice acting )

While shadowlands story logic was very questionable with sylv and the jailor at least sylvanas had some danger vibes. Same as the maw. I died quite often, especially with poor geared/leveling alts.

I hope they find a theme for the next xpac where villiains and danger is easier to excecute

That's what happens when you insert identity politics bullshit into a video game.

[huth]

See, they don't have to live in caves. But they should live somewhere. Valdrakken has all but one indoor space designed for dragons. It seems that WoW dragons are humanoids who can shapeshift into giant lizards instead of the opposite. How many of the buildings in the isles can two dragons fit in when crossing next to each other?

Economics and statics. Since they can do it, it's more economical for them to use buildings in their visage form instead of building them ridiculously huge, which would also make it very difficult to keep them from just toppling over if somebody looks at them funny and lets them build something other than pyramids.

This is something that actually does make sense.

[milkmustache]

We could potentially get both. We got new zones alongside the cataclysm revamp.

This is where the handshake meme comes in. Revamp with Undermine as a zone would be incredible. Undermine as an entire expansion, don't think it's possible.

[Pheraz]

That's what happens when you insert identity politics bullshit into a video game.

I'm not sure what this is. You mean so many females or transgender dragons like chromie?
I'm not a big fan of this trans concept either but it doesn't affect me at all or hurt me or hinders me to play the game so I can totally tolerate it.
(They should just leave this romantic romance stuff out of this game. But I guess they do this because they know that many wow players are women. I'm not sure though if as many women really like romance stories as blizzard marketing thinks. XD I could imagine that most women play video games to play video games and have fun just like men. Brilliant, right? .)

What I mean is rather the missing dragon danger vibes. Dragons shouldn't live in cities, in my opinion.

[Cheezits]

That's what happens when you insert identity politics bullshit into a video game.

No, the devs just aren't interested in making stupidly huge buildings for dragons.

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What I mean is rather the missing dragon danger vibes. Dragons shouldn't live in cities, in my opinion.

They don't, at least not really. Valdrakken is mostly Drakonids and Dragonspawn and designed with them in mind, though some get kicked out.

[milkmustache]

There's no reason to believe Undermine is the entirety of the expansion. Undermine has barely anything in common with the central theme of the Void. At best, it would be a zone we travel through on our way futher down, and perhaps help out the goblins on the way.

Maybe it can serve as a hub of sorts, depending on how fast and easy it is to travel further down. It would be pretty neat to always use some kind of elavator or machine to travel between the surface and the world below.

I guess I should revise that from undermine to underground. I'm sure there would be fun in it, I just cannot see it happening based on the community's response to Zaralek and their approach towards Argus and the Emerald dream.

That being said, I'm sure there will be an inclusion of it in some form. The sword, heart of the world, Earth elemental antagonist, definitely all points to something.

[Shadowferal]

Economics and statics. Since they can do it, it's more economical for them to use buildings in their visage form instead of building them ridiculously huge, which would also make it very difficult to keep them from just toppling over if somebody looks at them funny and lets them build something other than pyramids.
This is something that actually does make sense.

I disagree.
Dragons should have been all about grandeur and mystery...an almost alien presence, with clefthoofs and similar sized beasts and giant plants as food sources.
But...we have humans instead.

[Plehnard]

TBH I liked Oribos more then Valdrakken. I got lost in the dragon city multiple times.

I hate Oribos with passion. Every thing looks the same and navigation was terrible due to that untraversable area in the middle

[Teriz]

That's one of the main failings of Cataclysm though. What was the point of revamping zones if all you did with them was have some new levelling?
A world revamp should use the revamped zones to actually have the endgame content in it, otherwise it's just a whole lot of effort for basically no gain.

And that's also not to mention how it's effectively doubling the amount of work you have to do.

TBF, you're probably not going to want high level players questing in old zones, even if they're revamped. High level players and players in general want new stuff, even if the old stuff has been changed. Also the team is larger now, so a revamp + new zones shouldn't be a huge issue.

[Grazrug]

Revamping old world just for an update on the leveling between 1 and 50. Just like Cataclysm did.

[Teriz]

This is where the handshake meme comes in. Revamp with Undermine as a zone would be incredible. Undermine as an entire expansion, don't think it's possible.

Even Pandaria wasn't the entire expansion. Even if the expansion is literally called "World of Warcraft: Undermine" we're still going to be going to places outside of core expansion location, just like we do every expansion.

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If this was an Undermine expansion, we would have had a goblin, maybe Gallywix, instead of Thrall on the BlizzCon poster
Don't forget that he represents the theme of the next expansion as Illidan, Jaina and Sylavanas/Bolvar were before
You all seem to underestimate him for some reason :/

Not really. While Jaina was a major part of BFA she wasn't the center of the expansion, that would be Anduin and Sylvanas. Now Sylvanas in Shadowlands was very important, but even here, they showcased her and not the Jailer or Bolvar who were also important aspects of the expansion.

It's entirely possible that Thrall plays a huge part in this expansion and we still go into the Undermine. Elemental stuff still relates to underground/center of the planet content. Just like Neltharion was the Earthwarder and he had an underground citadel in Zaralek Caverns.

Blizzard could have viewed Gallywix or Gazlowe on the key art as too much of a giveaway, just like they put Gul'dan on the key art for pre-Legion announcement instead of Illidan who ended up on the cover.

[huth]

That's what happens when you insert identity politics bullshit into a video game.

What, because an intelligent and ancient species that was specificially charged with protecting the planet isn't behaving like mindless animals?

[Shadowferal]

What, because an intelligent and ancient species that was specificially charged with protecting the planet isn't behaving like mindless animals?

Hardly mindless.
Just not behaving like they have brains 5x bigger.

[huth]

I disagree.
Dragons should have been all about grandeur and mystery...an almost alien presence, with clefthoofs and similar sized beasts and giant plants as food sources.
But...we have humans instead.

Well, sure, but i was talking about why they'd build a city like that, not about their dietary habits. As far as can be told, they have to be at least partially sustained by magic anyway.

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Hardly mindless.
Just not behaving like they have brains 5x bigger.

Pheraz description was of rather mindless beings that just kill and eat anything they see.

[Sydrache]

How many pages of undermine expansion are we gonna have lol. It's not happening

[username993720]

I'm not sure what this is. You mean so many females or transgender dragons like chromie?
I'm not a big fan of this trans concept either but it doesn't affect me at all or hurt me or hinders me to play the game so I can totally tolerate it.
(They should just leave this romantic romance stuff out of this game. But I guess they do this because they know that many wow players are women. I'm not sure though if as many women really like romance stories as blizzard marketing thinks. XD I could imagine that most women play video games to play video games and have fun just like men. Brilliant, right? .)

What I mean is rather the missing dragon danger vibes. Dragons shouldn't live in cities, in my opinion.

It's not this. It's the childish and censured nature and story WoW had taken on ever since.

No, the devs just aren't interested in making stupidly huge buildings for dragons.

This isn't what i'm talking about.
Dragons had become humans.

What, because an intelligent and ancient species that was specificially charged with protecting the planet isn't behaving like mindless animals?

Yes, exactly that. Dragons are fearsome creatures and they've been reduced to cuddly teddybears.

[huth]

It's not this. It's the childish and censured nature and story WoW had taken on ever since.



This isn't what i'm talking about.
Dragons had become humans.



Yes, exactly that. Dragons are fearsome creatures and they've been reduced to cuddly teddybears.

Wanting a race to behave in a way that makes no logical sense for them to actually do is childish, if anything. Dragons are still fearsome creatures in WoW; they just aren't primal beasts.

Your problem isn't that dragons are "human", your problem is that they aren't the edgy teenager's idea of imposing creatures.