Bored after 2 months of DF

[Alroxas]

I do agree with them, but also find that kinda sad, only a couple months into a brand new expansion, and even though people are digging it, they feel burned out or just not interested in pushing further. Does that mean WoW in general is finally starting to lose it's luster? Blizzard releases a good expansion in Dragonflight, but still people are fading out and just kinda of bored quickly into it.

Consider the alternative: In legion or BFA you were logging on each day/week to grind AP. You didn't necessarily want to do it but you did it as a "chore".

Fastforward to DF, no "chores" to do. In fact, you have the freedom to do what is of interest to you. And if nothing interests you right now, you can feel free to go do something else (perhaps even play a different game).

Last I checked I think like 75% of WoW players don't even step foot inside a current Raid.

Source?

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- renows in general are a nice idea. But so many things are behind a to big of a rep grind and useless by the time you get it. Per example. By the time you have gotten your renow high enough to get a piece of gear. That grind must mean you have play so much that your standard gear is already as high if not higher. I think all renow gear needs to drop by 5 renow levels at least.

Here's the thing about renown gear - It's not for your mains, it's for your alts. Especially since your alts gain reputation faster when your main hits those thresholds at 10 and 20 renown.

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What do I do now when I log into Dargonflight?

And compare that to SL, BFA, or Legion. Does having "stuff" to do that isn't interesting a good thing for the game as a whole?

In SL, you were grinding renown because renown not only unlocked conduits but also (later) empowered conduits. In BFA, you ran things like Island Expeditions for Azerite Power. In Legion, you ran things for Artifact Power and (until later patches) to build up BLP until your next Legion Legendary.

Yes, it might have kept the wow population "busy" or "engaged" but was any of that truly "fun" or enjoyable? Most players said no. Those kinds of grinds were horrible and for Blizzard to get rid of them. Guess what, they did and DF is what we get.

So you might counter with add in more story/questing... the problem is that kind of content gets consumed rapidly relative to how long it takes to make.

Honestly DF is great. You log in and do what you want then log off. There's no FOMO with power systems that requires daily/weekly grinding. It's refreshing to be able to walk away and do other things beyond WoW.

[Zorachus]

About 10-20% of WOW players are raiding.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...ctive_players/

[Osmeric]

About 10-20% of WOW players are raiding.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...ctive_players/

That's from back in SL.

[Zorachus]

That's from back in SL.

I agree, but I've heard for years, it was less than 25% active players that Raid. My point a vast majority of WoW players do not Raid at all.

[Alroxas]

I agree, but I've heard for years, it was less than 25% active players that Raid. My point a vast majority of WoW players do not Raid at all.

Objection: Speculative

[Mardux]

About 10-20% of WOW players are raiding.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...ctive_players/

Your source is a video of a known WoW hater that was shared on reddit by a deleted user 18 months ago? Jesus...

[SinR]

Objection: Speculative

Objection, Hearsay

[GreenJesus]

I'd be playing more if healer balance wasn't so garbage in PVP. That entire half of the game is basically deleted as a holy paladin since I'm not a disc priest for arena or presevoker for RBG. Just look at the representation charts and it's insane.

[baskev]

Here's the thing about renown gear - It's not for your mains, it's for your alts. Especially since your alts gain reputation faster when your main hits those thresholds at 10 and 20 renown.

Sorry to be clear both on main AND alts.
My main was able to use nothing of it.
By the time my first alt had gotten enough renow. Thanks to all the questing, dungeons, WQ i already had higher item level.

I am also not saying remove the level requierment. But lower the levels a bit. It feels right now, with the content you do ( without farming) you can outgear that gear with ease. Only 1 item was a upgrade. The rest is around the gear level you can get otherways.
So i would say lower it by a few renow levels. It should feel more like the 318 ilevel stuff you can make with proffesions. A great way to improve some drops/quest gear.

And yes even with the 100% and 200% buffs ( main has 1 renow thats not max but 2 levels removed, the rest is max out). Its still possible to out level/gear the renow gear with ease.

[CaptainV]

The raiding scene has been low interest since BFA as I said before.

Theres actual metrics to show this and have been around since after Dazar'alore where the interest really dropped heavily.

Azshara and N'zoth had some of the lowest raid numbers in total and Shadowlands is even lower still, with DF being pretty low aswell.

Raiding is definatley a dead scene compared to what it -was- so to be clear, its not -dead- but if you want to compare it to the glory days of TBC and WOTLK to Legion then its definatley dead.

Realistically this is why I said for a long time they need to go down from 4 difficulties back to 2, Normal and Heroic, this means they can make a 5 patch cycle with more raids rather than a 3 patch cycle with less.

The 3 patch cycle approach generally seemed to do alot of damage for blizzard long term beacuse patches in the ye old were 77 days long and now they're closer to 6 months so half a year of development for what amounts to 4 tiers of difficulty, maybe 1 new zone anda few new farms for what is realistically 1 to 1.5 months of grinding.

This is why its generally not been worth it to people, more content is better than more difficulties, so generally people would rather have 77 day cycles with 2 raid tiers than 4 raid tiers of which 2 are rarley used if ever.

[Alroxas]

The raiding scene has been low interest since BFA as I said before.

Theres actual metrics to show this and have been around since after Dazar'alore where the interest really dropped heavily.

I'd like to see those actual metrics. And by metrics, I mean real numbers and not some BS speculative numbers that various people try to throw up.

Raiding is definatley a dead scene compared to what it -was- so to be clear, its not -dead- but if you want to compare it to the glory days of TBC and WOTLK to Legion then its definatley dead.

Maybe, but it also means you need to look at the relative numbers as well. TBC/WoTLK had much higher total users than later expansions. Additionally, you should also consider the additional content that now exists in the game that further dilute raiding interest. Why bother trying to put together 10 people for a raid when you can get high end-game gear from M+ (where you only need 5 people)?

Realistically this is why I said for a long time they need to go down from 4 difficulties back to 2, Normal and Heroic, this means they can make a 5 patch cycle with more raids rather than a 3 patch cycle with less.

Not sure how less difficulty options would bring in more content. Honestly raid content tuning for the multiple difficulties is probably easier than creating a new raid. All you really need to do is drop a mechanic or simplify mechanics as you go lower in difficulty.

This is why its generally not been worth it to people, more content is better than more difficulties, so generally people would rather have 77 day cycles with 2 raid tiers than 4 raid tiers of which 2 are rarley used if ever.

I mean we all want more content but content takes more time to create, test, and launch than say some tweaks to existing content. Moreover, a 77 day patch cycle means that you're locked into that content roadmap.

Let's say you have a feature X planned for expansion and X is received poorly but the current roadmap for the next content patch is built upon expanding X. Do you push forward with current patch cycle despite the poor reception of X or do you say let's #pullripcord and change scrap planned content for new content that now focuses on Y. However that takes time and now instead of a 77 day patch cycle, you need to restart and maybe (if you're lucky) get it out in 4 months (120 days).

[Zoneseek]

This was me 2 months into SL and why I haven't bothered with DF. First expansion ever I haven't played day 1. I am one of the stats we're seeing on why its not selling like other expensions.

At this point for me to play wow they gotta offer the expansion for free with a 6 month sub or something, or put it on game pass. I don't really see myself paying for an expansion and a sub fee for a game ever again.

[pahbi]

Because it's a shitty expansion.

Blizzard has removed all the fun little things to do: the pet battles, the archaeology, the silly stuff.

Blizzard has removed all the casual content. You can either do boring-ass diablo-style M+ for marginally better gear, or do mythic raids, or do...nothing.

What's ironic about all of this is WoW was created to offer a more casual experience to MMO gamers who didn't want to do the elitist horseshit anymore. Now we ARE the elitist horseshit. I wish a new, upstart game would come along and be what WoW used to be.

Blizz definitely played it safe with DF.

At best its a C+ expansion. There are no new ideas, no risks and not much creativity.

[enigma77]

I'd say with their design since Shadowlands you'll always be bored after about 2 months. Their content simply doesn't entertain you for any longer period of time.

People hated on Titanforging & AP, but guess what? Those things gave you meaningful character progression even late into a patch.

Now? After about 2 months or so, your power progression comes to a virtual standstill. Sure you can repeat the things you've already done on an alt or two, but it's just the same thing you've already done. It's bad design and a snoozefest.


People play for gear and power and the moment people can no longer get gear or power the game dies.

[Yarathir]

I mean, 2 months of gameplay is pretty good, isn't it?

And I say that as someone who quit WoW.

[Sinx]

I'd say with their design since Shadowlands you'll always be bored after about 2 months. Their content simply doesn't entertain you for any longer period of time.

People hated on Titanforging & AP, but guess what? Those things gave you meaningful character progression even late into a patch.

Now? After about 2 months or so, your power progression comes to a virtual standstill. Sure you can repeat the things you've already done on an alt or two, but it's just the same thing you've already done. It's bad design and a snoozefest.


People play for gear and power and the moment people can no longer get gear or power the game dies.

I think it's amazing. I can spend my time playing other games or doing other interesting things between content patches then, instead of farming Korthia rares for 2 hours per day to not fall behind on item progression. The one thing that has killed WoW's subscription numbers these past expansions is forcing people to do a bunch of content they hate, just to have a character that's viable for the content they want to do. And cancerous borrowed power grinds that require daily chores in order to not fall behind on character progression is one of the core issues in that regard.

[RobertMugabe]

Been playing WoW since launch all these years, and it's a fav game of mine obviously. But I've had my off times and addicted times to the game, but all these years I typically still play nightly if just for 30 to 45 minutes.

Use to Raid and play [H]ardcore from MoP through Legion, playing hours a night, but those times are gone.

Anyways, Dragonflight, was so excited to get a new expansion after Shadowlands, which I found depressing and lame, and so far DF is an upgrade and feels fun and looks great. But...2 months later after Dragonflights release, I'm getting bored already. My main is iLvl 391, and I have another at i360+, and several alts in the level 60+ level range. But right now, I just feel stuck in a rut in the game, not interested in getting my main any higher gear at this point, I'm happy enough doing M+10, but not higher, and I stopped Raiding long ago.

My alts, I was progressing getting most of them to level 65 or so, but now it feels like a grind to push them to all to 70.

I know there's the patch today, which will help give something new to do, which is great for WoW, they need mini patches like this often. Because without today's patch I prob would unsub for a bit.

I would say the last expansion I was truly addicted to and LOVED was Legion, that one had so much to do outside of just Raids, the Class Halls, the artifact weapon appearances, the Class mounts, I felt like I always had something to do in Legion.

Thing is, I do like Dragonflight, it's beautiful to look at, and I am enjoying it, but I feel like I hit a wall of boredom quicker than usual in a new expansion.

Getting bored after 2-3 months is pretty normal for me. The same happened to me in every expansion besides Legion where I was consistently invested with the exception of 7.2. I am usually the most active when the expansion is actually finished, because this is the time where it is the best to level up alts and gear those up.

I'd say the main difference between DF and SL is that at least in DF you can quit "in peace" easier, because you know that you're not falling behind on anything when you're bored of playing (and can pick up again later on easily), while in SL many people would continue playing for just a little bit longer, because of FOMO.

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I mean, 2 months of gameplay is pretty good, isn't it?

And I say that as someone who quit WoW.

Yeah that's a very solid time all things considered and money well spent compared to RPG's. For example, I just finished playing Hogwarts Legacy, great game and all that, but I was done with it in like a week of constantly playing it and I don't regret paying 70€ for it. Meanwhile with WoW, if you pay for 2 months and buy DF that's also about the same as a AAA game would cost you, but you actually get so much more playtime out of it, so even when WoW was at a low, I have never really regretted paying for it, because I still got so much out of it.

[Arai]

Main issue atm is the in DF they made gearing fast and predictable with all these options and 0 rng in terms of Legendaries or Titanforging. Well what happens if you have predictable and fast gearing and at the same time it being the only content you have? It gets boring fast and you don't really have much desire to gear an alt.

Legion was 10x better simply because it has 12x class campaigns + 36 Artifact weapons that came with all their different skins you could obtain throughout various different content. Be it one of the hidden transmogs where the community had to find out how to get it or simply long quest chains, world boss rotations, PvP, etc. Those artifacts mogs were mostly really well done and gave people a reason to gear a character and do other content since transmog/style isn't temporary as ilvl is. This is completely missing in DF. You get your underwhelming / bad transmogs from reps and thats about it.

On top of that the gearing system in Legion was simply more fun. People hated the heavy rng with Legendaries and Titanforging but realistically it made ALL content relevant. Even world quests were farmed by me and friends/guildies partially because of potential titanforging stuff and them being so easy to get done (+paragon cache).
Its funny because they only had to reduce the rng impacts on both of those systems and it would have been a good addition to gearing. Legendaries being targetable after farming 2 weeks + the additional rng drop, that way you wouldn't be behind months if you didn't have your bis Legendary. And Titanforging had to be dialed down a bit to not be too extreme or simply make it upgradable in some form as well. I hate to say it but gearing was a lot more fun back then because all content was attractive more or less. The only really bad aspect was the Artifact Power grind. Current classes fair much better in DF.

Then we also had features like Mage Tower + Class Mounts that were again really well thought out because you had a potenital 12x questlines to do if you wanted those mounts which were unique. And the Mage Tower was simply amazing as a challenge on top of a unique prestige reward. Here you got the perfect motivation to gear your characters so the Mage Tower challenge got easier.

We also got 10x NEW dungeons (with M+) at the start of the expansion and on top of that 4 more till the end. Now we get 4 new and 4 rehashed. A really poor downgrade. Then we also had Suramar a well thought out questline and zone. Class Halls that could be upgraded + Mission Tables that were actually decent in comparison to trash Shadowlands tables. It also helped that World Quests and M+ were completely new features.

Now compare all this do Dragonflight. Boring gearing, no purpose to actually gear besides repeating M+ over and over and over with higher levels or raiding. And Mythic raid is still inaccessible with 20m no crossrealm from the start. So whats left? Nothing. No endgame zone, no Artifacts or awesome transmogs to progress for, no Class Halls, far less campaigns (and far less interesting imo). I got my character to 417ilvl and wonder for what? There is nothing to do. I got 2.7k+ score in M+ and am bored to hell with it. Why do more repetetive keys? Its boring. There is no purpose. They removed all content and people are cheering for it. A boring gear treadmill so you can get 1 title and a special effect on your shoulders/helm. Maybe a mount. And the journey is boring and repetetive.
If they don't tune up the content soon ill be gone.

[Osmeric]

On top of that the gearing system in Legion was simply more fun. People hated the heavy rng with Legendaries and Titanforging but realistically it made ALL content relevant.

Titanforging offended the MMO puritans, the people who cannot stand when someone gets a reward they don't deserve.

[Arai]

Titanforging offended the MMO puritans, the people who cannot stand when someone gets a reward they don't deserve.

Yea. And now you just buy a carry to push your rating to 2.4k and upgrade everything with 2s spam.