Bored after 2 months of DF

[Grimbold21]

What do you actually need gear for? It is..

1.) A reward
2.) A means to face more difficult content

Gear in world content mainly is a reward for playing. And instead of facing more difficult content gameplay in the world simply gets more easy. If you play against elites with ilevel 320 you struggle alot. If i face them with my ilevel 390 char i do not really have to struggle anymore.

I completely focus on world gameplay in WoW. And as long i have no ongoing progression or any useful reward anymore i do not continue to play.

Why should i? What is my incentive to do play anymore?`

Would a raider continue to raid if he ran out of epics he could acquire? I guess many raiders simply quit if they got all their BIS gear. I literally do the same, and its a legit way to play the game.

Yes, why should you? Why should any of us?

If you reached the end of your particular line, then that's it. If all I do is casually play m+, I can set an arbitary limit for myself - say reach, do and farm all 15s until I have the gear I wanted - and stop when I meet it.

The game is not under an obligation to keep us running on the hamster wheel.

As for the remainder of your post, any form of progressive gameplay provides gear as a reward, and the acquisition of this gear makes it easier to do it. The world in WoW hasn't simply been designed to provide long, vertical and gradually more difficult progression.

[JustaRandomReindeer]

Legion also had significantly higher participation in Antorus than in EN and Nighthold, so it grew over time, suffering much the same effects from WoD on its launch as DF is suffering from BfA/SL. BfA and SL, on the other hand, went rapidly downhill almost immediately.

And you honestly believe the mindless grinds, forced content and half assed catchup mechanics are gonna bring new ppl in or keep existing players ? That worked so well in BfA and SL don't you think ?

Yes, Legion was a great expansion. Now think about why BfA and SL failed where Legion succeeded. Surely people did not hate borrowed power and the grind as much as you'd have us believe, otherwise BfA and SL wouldn't have broken record sales and see increase in player numbers on release when borrowed power and grinds were advertised as the main features of those expansions. If that were the case DF would have smashed every record solely based on the fact that there was no borrowed power and grind advertised. Do you see the logic?

Why then? Perhaps it has to do with Blizzard's inability to meet players' expectations? We went from cool artifact weaopns and class order halls to a necklace and soulbinds. Perhaps it has to do with their incompetence and corporate greed? They released 3 raids and a mega dungeon in the first 5 months of Legion. In the first 5 months of BfA we had Uldir and half-baked island expeditions and warfronts. SL was even worse because in the first 5 months we didn't even know when the next raid is dropping.

So from all of this we come to the conclusion that BfA and SL had insane potential did they not? If they didn't they wouldn't have generated such excitement. Could they have been great expansions if Blizzard cared about making good expansions more than they cared about profits? For sure. Does DF have the same potential to be great? Eh. It doesn't matter how much care they put into it, the casual players(the ones who don't care about mythic raids and high m+) who were excited to play Legion, BfA, and SL, are not gonna return to DF because it has nothing to offer them. Another example of Blizzard's incompetence.. straight up removing and abandoning features instead of fixing them.

[Grimbold21]

For fun. Having proper rewards is part of the fun in every RPG.



There is nothing abritary in not wanting to play raids or mythic+. Why should i play something i (currently) do not like?



I am not under any obligation to continue to play if my gameplay is not rewarding my effort.



I am not interested in progressive gameplay outside of random battlegrounds and world content.

As I said, bait, as you're trying to lead me in circles.

You've had your rewards. The level of your rewards are result of your own choices. You want to only play world content? Then you'll get the level of gear that content has available.

No one is telling you what to do, rather that your choices define your limits, and you have to accept that world content in WoW is limited. You're unhappy with that? As you said, you can stop playing.

[Kharli]

Because it's a shitty expansion.

Blizzard has removed all the fun little things to do: the pet battles, the archaeology, the silly stuff.

Blizzard has removed all the casual content. You can either do boring-ass diablo-style M+ for marginally better gear, or do mythic raids, or do...nothing.

What's ironic about all of this is WoW was created to offer a more casual experience to MMO gamers who didn't want to do the elitist horseshit anymore. Now we ARE the elitist horseshit. I wish a new, upstart game would come along and be what WoW used to be.

Right.

1. Pet battles are still there.

2. Archaeology was not in Shadowlands

3. Silly stuff still here, at least in my opinion, please do clearify what you mean with "silly stuff"

Casual content? you mean..Heroic dungeons? world quests?

also.. that's always been the case doing higher difficulty dungeons and raids to get better gear, so i'm not quite sure what you mean with "casual content"

Wow is a casual game compared to ever quest 1 and 2, Dark age of Cammelot and the games of that era, also.. Final Fantasy is way more grindy than World of warcraft as an example..in which you also need to do raids/dungeons to get good gear.

I've personally shifted to doing some world quests here and there, get my renown up slowly but surely from raiding pretty much every single day, I still have plenty of things to do and I'm sitting comfortably at a fairly decent gear level where I don't feel weak at all, I was extremely lucky the first week of the dragonflight dungeon weekly quest going, where I got my HC 2h axe but still, slowly collecting the mounts from the factions, working on getting my Birb mount from the Centaurs(which has a item that drops in the dungeons sadly)

[Sinx]

Yes, Legion was a great expansion. Now think about why BfA and SL failed where Legion succeeded. Surely people did not hate borrowed power and the grind as much as you'd have us believe, otherwise BfA and SL wouldn't have broken record sales and see increase in player numbers on release when borrowed power and grinds were advertised as the main features of those expansions. If that were the case DF would have smashed every record solely based on the fact that there was no borrowed power and grind advertised. Do you see the logic?

Why then? Perhaps it has to do with Blizzard's inability to meet players' expectations? We went from cool artifact weaopns and class order halls to a necklace and soulbinds. Perhaps it has to do with their incompetence and corporate greed? They released 3 raids and a mega dungeon in the first 5 months of Legion. In the first 5 months of BfA we had Uldir and half-baked island expeditions and warfronts. SL was even worse because in the first 5 months we didn't even know when the next raid is dropping.

So from all of this we come to the conclusion that BfA and SL had insane potential did they not? If they didn't they wouldn't have generated such excitement. Could they have been great expansions if Blizzard cared about making good expansions more than they cared about profits? For sure. Does DF have the same potential to be great? Eh. It doesn't matter how much care they put into it, the casual players(the ones who don't care about mythic raids and high m+) who were excited to play Legion, BfA, and SL, are not gonna return to DF because it has nothing to offer them. Another example of Blizzard's incompetence.. straight up removing and abandoning features instead of fixing them.

What was so cool with the artifact weapons ? That you had to grind daily for what was essentially talents ? Or perhaps it was the introduction of mythic+ and more rapid content deployment that carried Legion ? In the latter case, Dragonflight, judging by their roadmap, is actually closer to Legion's content pacing than Shadowlands and BfA, with delivering content between the raid/m+/pvp seasons. So a clear improvement from what they've delivered these past 5-6 years. Could be better of course, but at least a step in the right direction. Another positive is the fact that they've actually started listening to player feedback when it comes to class and spec designs, and they've taken measures to balance the game far more frequently so far in DF than they ever did in the previous expansions.

I do fail to see your argument that daily grinding and chores is supposed to help retain players and encourage new and returning players though, as it's essentially a concept that makes it a lot harder for those joining (or returning to) the game, considerably increasing their catch up time. It's also a system that discourages playing alts due to increased time requirements, and makes it difficult for players that have limited time to maintain a character viable for end game content. So where's the great advantage of such grinds ? I'm sure there are some that like grinding, but I'd wager that the vast majority of players that do raids/m+/pvp would much rather prefer advancing their character through the content they enjoy doing, rather than being forced to do a whole bunch of things they don't enjoy just to be able to do the content they like. That's just bad design in my book, and something that will push players away more than pulling them in.

[Melius]

i knew this would happen by removing borrowed power and im starting to believe that the loudest folks about it were not in a majority. for some and myself going back to a pre legion type of game after 6 or so years is a downgrade and if i wanted a game like that i would be playing wotlk classic. and stop blaming shadowlands for this mess, wod was also devoid of content and lost a shitton of subs but legion brought players back. why? because it was so fudging good compared to this shallow and souless expac.

[janeSmith]

Then play a different game. Take a break.

[Glorious Leader]

As I said, bait, as you're trying to lead me in circles.

You've had your rewards. The level of your rewards are result of your own choices. You want to only play world content? Then you'll get the level of gear that content has available.

No one is telling you what to do, rather that your choices define your limits, and you have to accept that world content in WoW is limited. You're unhappy with that? As you said, you can stop playing.

The level of reward is a result of developer choices not his.

[FelPlague]

DF is nowhere near Legion levels of excitement. If anything it's more similar to WoD

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA omfg.

- - - Updated - - -

Well, i really like world content in DF, but unfortunately i hit a brick wall where my gear does not get better anymore from world gameplay. If i can progress again i continue to play.

can you post an image of your gear?
Might be able to help you figure out where you can get upgrades in the world.

[Sylv_]

So quit and come back some other time?

I made 25 tokens within a month just playing, having fun and being an orb farmer.

I bought d4 giga for myself, my cousin, a token left to resub, a server transfer for 3 toons, 160 in bnet balance left. that'll get me the next xpac or any other games that get released.

Take a break, I did when I was bored.

[FelPlague]

Because it's a shitty expansion.

Blizzard has removed all the fun little things to do: the pet battles, the archaeology, the silly stuff.

Blizzard has removed all the casual content. You can either do boring-ass diablo-style M+ for marginally better gear, or do mythic raids, or do...nothing.

What's ironic about all of this is WoW was created to offer a more casual experience to MMO gamers who didn't want to do the elitist horseshit anymore. Now we ARE the elitist horseshit. I wish a new, upstart game would come along and be what WoW used to be.

1- this expansion has THE MOST fun little things to do of all time, hunts, sieges, races, climbing, photography, soup making. and... pet battles have not been removed, what?

2- archaelogy was never fun, that is why it is on hiatus, it was fucking boring and awful, its being reworked but that takes time.

3- What in the past could you do to get end game gear that was not M+, mythic raid, or PVP?
Cause you can do all of those now, and more. and the game has always required you do the hardest content to get the best gear.
but please inform me.

- - - Updated - - -

Two months ur lucky. I got like 4 weeks.

U do all the Mythic 15's once, the raid heroic and than idk. It's not the same as old days. Unless u raid mythic there is nothing really going on outside of small side stuff. Gear farming means nothing with patch resets and no need for it (if u don't do mythic raid).

smh people out there doing months of M+ for minor gear upgrades to do the exact same content 0.1% faster, than a new patch comes out and makes their effort trivialized (wasted)

basically all comes down to if you mythic raid or not

I am reading this but I am confused.
Are you talking about Dragonflight?
or Shadowlands?
or BFA?
Or Legion?
Cause that has been true for all of those expansion EXCEPT dragonflight, cause dragonflight goes to 20, not 15.

but seriously your entire complaint here applies to literally every wow expansion ever.
"People play the game to get stronger gear that makes their dps 0.1% faster to do the same content over again only to replace it next patch."

Yeah... welcome to world of warcraft, you only almost 20 years late to realizing that?

[crusadernero]

No, i enjoy world gameplay. But only if the rewards do matter.

As like you probably would not play raids if the rewards would not matter.

Having great rewards is a fun incentive for all gameplay.

You get world rewards from doing world content. OK gear, rep and stuff like that.

[JustaRandomReindeer]

What was so cool with the artifact weapons ? That you had to grind daily for what was essentially talents ? Or perhaps it was the introduction of mythic+ and more rapid content deployment that carried Legion ? In the latter case, Dragonflight, judging by their roadmap, is actually closer to Legion's content pacing than Shadowlands and BfA, with delivering content between the raid/m+/pvp seasons. So a clear improvement from what they've delivered these past 5-6 years. Could be better of course, but at least a step in the right direction. Another positive is the fact that they've actually started listening to player feedback when it comes to class and spec designs, and they've taken measures to balance the game far more frequently so far in DF than they ever did in the previous expansions.

I do fail to see your argument that daily grinding and chores is supposed to help retain players and encourage new and returning players though, as it's essentially a concept that makes it a lot harder for those joining (or returning to) the game, considerably increasing their catch up time. It's also a system that discourages playing alts due to increased time requirements, and makes it difficult for players that have limited time to maintain a character viable for end game content. So where's the great advantage of such grinds ? I'm sure there are some that like grinding, but I'd wager that the vast majority of players that do raids/m+/pvp would much rather prefer advancing their character through the content they enjoy doing, rather than being forced to do a whole bunch of things they don't enjoy just to be able to do the content they like. That's just bad design in my book, and something that will push players away more than pulling them in.

Read my post again. There is a flaw in your logic if your logic states that players hated borrowed power and grinds so much that yet Legion, BfA and SL broke previous records even tho borrowed power was advertised as the main feature of those expansion, and DF is a flop even tho the removal of systems was heavily advertised.

And, as I said, borrowed power is not the reason BfA and SL failed to retain players. If that were the case they wouldn't have seen record number of players returning. It's Blizzard's incompetence, greed, and lack of care that sunk both expansions.

It's simple logic really.

[Gorsameth]

Read my post again. There is a flaw in your logic if your logic states that players hated borrowed power and grinds so much that yet Legion, BfA and SL broke previous records even tho borrowed power was advertised as the main feature of those expansion, and DF is a flop even tho the removal of systems was heavily advertised.

And, as I said, borrowed power is not the reason BfA and SL failed to retain players. If that were the case they wouldn't have seen record number of players returning. It's Blizzard's incompetence, greed, and lack of care that sunk both expansions.

It's simple logic really.

Where is DF a flop other then in failing to break SL's Covid fuelled record?

[NordWitcher]

So quit and come back some other time?

I made 25 tokens within a month just playing, having fun and being an orb farmer.

I bought d4 giga for myself, my cousin, a token left to resub, a server transfer for 3 toons, 160 in bnet balance left. that'll get me the next xpac or any other games that get released.

Take a break, I did when I was bored.

How did you make 25 tokens?

[Glorious Leader]

Where is DF a flop other then in failing to break SL's Covid fuelled record?

Properly restated this question is tautologial. I.e How is df a flop other than df is a flop..

[Space Troll]

How did you make 25 tokens?

Orb farming.

[Hobbidaggy]

Been playing WoW since launch all these years, and it's a fav game of mine obviously. But I've had my off times and addicted times to the game, but all these years I typically still play nightly if just for 30 to 45 minutes.

Use to Raid and play [H]ardcore from MoP through Legion, playing hours a night, but those times are gone.

Anyways, Dragonflight, was so excited to get a new expansion after Shadowlands, which I found depressing and lame, and so far DF is an upgrade and feels fun and looks great. But...2 months later after Dragonflights release, I'm getting bored already. My main is iLvl 391, and I have another at i360+, and several alts in the level 60+ level range. But right now, I just feel stuck in a rut in the game, not interested in getting my main any higher gear at this point, I'm happy enough doing M+10, but not higher, and I stopped Raiding long ago.

My alts, I was progressing getting most of them to level 65 or so, but now it feels like a grind to push them to all to 70.

I know there's the patch today, which will help give something new to do, which is great for WoW, they need mini patches like this often. Because without today's patch I prob would unsub for a bit.

I would say the last expansion I was truly addicted to and LOVED was Legion, that one had so much to do outside of just Raids, the Class Halls, the artifact weapon appearances, the Class mounts, I felt like I always had something to do in Legion.

Thing is, I do like Dragonflight, it's beautiful to look at, and I am enjoying it, but I feel like I hit a wall of boredom quicker than usual in a new expansion.

There is nothing wrong with this and you’re allowed to step away from it. You’re also a lot older now and your priorities in life are different. You had patience when you were younger and did what you needed to do to get better gear etc, but now you look at stuff differently and you feel like you’re wasting your time and what you’re doing is not worth your time and effort anymore. This is normal and just means you’re human.

No longer playing a game you used to like as much anymore is a normal thing

[Sinx]

Read my post again. There is a flaw in your logic if your logic states that players hated borrowed power and grinds so much that yet Legion, BfA and SL broke previous records even tho borrowed power was advertised as the main feature of those expansion, and DF is a flop even tho the removal of systems was heavily advertised.

And, as I said, borrowed power is not the reason BfA and SL failed to retain players. If that were the case they wouldn't have seen record number of players returning. It's Blizzard's incompetence, greed, and lack of care that sunk both expansions.

It's simple logic really.

First of all, SL sales numbers were heavily bloated by Covid and people being forced to replace any and all social activities in favor of sitting at home. BfA came off a successful expansion, so the expectations were naturally high. Dragonflight comes off of 2 absolutely terrible expansions, and it's natural that people are reluctant to return after getting burned with both BfA and SL. Expecting DF to break sales records after that would be completely unrealistic. But the fact of the matter is, feedback on DF seems to be largely positive.

And I'm still waiting for your arguments that enforcing long mandatory grinds and repetetive side content (such as visions and torghast) for everyone , just in order to be able to play the actual content people enjoy, is a good thing for the game.

[Gorsameth]

Properly restated this question is tautologial. I.e How is df a flop other than df is a flop..

failing to beat a covid boosted sales record doesn't make something a flop...