Thread: Dawntrail

Page 41 of 42 FirstFirst ...
31
39
40
41
42
LastLast
  1. #801
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    I can't believe we live in an age where people are white knighting for a multibillion dollar corporation that can't bother to hire people that know how to write tooltips and chart rotations effectively.

    It took how many years for them even to put an incomplete flowchart inside the ability page?

    What's really funny is that the google doc link up there is literally flowcharts for all of the classes, not just the tooltips. Even the people who made those flowcharts knew how cumbersome and idiotic SE's tooltips are and decided to save everyone a few moments of effort and just put them into flowchart form.

    You really need to take a step back, damn. White knighting for SE means you've gotten pretty low.
    "You can read the tooltips" = "White knighting"

    Uh-huh. Nice try, Sparky.

  2. #802
    Is...is this the FF14 version of when WoW fans have nothing to actually talk about right now so people just start fighting over stupid irrelevant bullshit? lol

    Because this "argument" over tooltips is so incredibly dumb.

  3. #803
    Quote Originally Posted by Arlette View Post
    Is...is this the FF14 version of when WoW fans have nothing to actually talk about right now so people just start fighting over stupid irrelevant bullshit? lol

    Because this "argument" over tooltips is so incredibly dumb.
    If you don't fight over the dumbest things, are you even a real gamer?!

  4. #804
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    This is also incorrect. Nothing in the game teaches you anything about oGCD's or how they are different from GCDs. Even the tooltips aren't often clear on what is and isn't an oGCD vs GCD action - usually the best way to tell is that oGCD is usually an Ability while GCD is typically a Spell or Weaponskill.
    Point being, you can practice with your class before ever setting foot in an encounter, before ever being in a group. You can't practice an encounter without being in the encounter.

    I came to FFXIV from WoW and so I treated oGCD's like Upheaval like I would have any other cooldown-based button in WoW - use them separately and use them over filler actions preferentially. This, of course, is horribly wrong and it's no surprise that my DPS was in the gutter until someone sent me to the Balance and some helpful noob videos to break me of my WoW habits and learn how XIV is different.
    This sounds like a you problem and not a game problem. If you weren't noticing the fact that oGCDs behaved differently from regular GCDs that's you not paying attention.

    Not going to deny that it's an easy mistake to make, but alluding to needing a video or something to teach you how things work is absurd.

    WoW for the most part doesn't have very many oGCD actions - most actions are on the GCD, instant or not, so in many cases it's just a priority system for which button you press on which GCD.XIV, because it has a much slower GCD (as well as lack of haste stat/buffs outside of like bozja and eureka, and the spell/skill speed stat is minimal), has oGCDs. Stuff for you to weave in between GCDs.
    WoW is a different game from FFXIV so...congratulations for noticing they play differently, I guess?

    That was back in 5.1 or so, and nothing in the game (aside from the addition of incomplete flowcharts into ability pages, which is something at least) has really changed on that front.

    Management of oGCD's, weaving, and clipping are foundational concepts to the entire battle system and nothing in-game teaches you any of this.
    Teaches? No. Show you that there's a difference? Yes.

    Again, this sounds more like a you problem than a game problem. How much hand holding do you need?

    Granted, I am drawing a line between learning how to play your class and min/maxing to get every ounce of performance from your class...min/maxing has been the realm of guides and stuff since forever. That's not what i'm talking about.

  5. #805
    Bloodsail Admiral
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2022
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    1,092
    Quote Originally Posted by Katchii View Post
    Teaches? No. Show you that there's a difference? Yes.
    Go out and find me a sprout that's in shadowbringers, so has plenty of playtime under their belt, and will understand what you're talking about when you say weaving and clipping - they don't know what those words mean, exactly, but they are familiar with the concepts they refer to.

    You won't find one, unless they've been referred to The Balance or Icy Veins (which just copy-pastes The Balance's stuff, as far as I can tell...) in the past. Because literally nothing in the game references or teaches about it and it's not really something that you'd notice unless you know to be looking for it.

    FFXIV does a pretty fucking bad job of teaching players to play the game beyond the absolute most baseline level (as in, move mouse to look around, WASD to move, etc.) What few resources are in-game are severely outdated (Hall of the Novice and guildhests) and aren't even included as mandatory content.

    I don't know why they're so fucking allergic to teaching players how to play their game. It's not like XIV is a particularly complicated game to play. If a player avoids drifting their oGCD's out of buff windows, doesn't skip/drop GCDs ("always be casting"), and puts as many of their buttons inside their buff windows as possible, they'll be doing "good enough" DPS even if their timings and orders aren't optimal. It isn't hard to teach people this stuff, either - joonbob did one during a content drought and I think it's like 8 minutes? I think the "stop being bad at WAR" video I watched was like 4 or 5 minutes. It's ridiculous that Square-Enix can't spare the time to put this stuff into the game themselves. You can't force the horse to drink water, but you should still make sure it has access to it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Arlette View Post
    Is...is this the FF14 version of when WoW fans have nothing to actually talk about right now so people just start fighting over stupid irrelevant bullshit? lol

    Because this "argument" over tooltips is so incredibly dumb.
    Hey, for once I wasn't the one that started it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Polgara View Post
    If you read tooltips, you'll notice spells/weaponskills vs abilities and that triggering the former puts them on GCD but not the latter, surely you tested what would happen if you slapped, say, mug after a gcd? Not gonna lie tooltips are generally pretty self explanatory, some of them are convoluted but reading them (and pressing them) kinda gives you most of the information, just like a game should: you press buttons, and see what happens?
    Nothing in the game gives you any indication what the difference between a spell/weaponskill and ability is. You might have a class that specifically cites weaponskill/spell (like MCH or DRG), or you might not - but that only helps you understand that your free crit button only applies to some of your buttons, not key differences between them. You might, by very closely watching your hotbars, notice that abilities are typically oGCD actions while spells are not. And then spells like Off Guard and Peculiar Light exist, which have a cast time and are Spells, but are not on the GCD just because fuck you for trying to understand.

    Ooh! What about stuff like Dissipation? "Orders your faerie away while granting you a full Aetherflow stack. Also increases healing magic potency by 20%." Healing magic potency sounds like it should apply to all healing you do, especially since you're getting another 3 AF charges to dump into healing (or our flaccid little 100 potency nerd slaps, more likely) right? Haha, nope! It only applies to Spells, dummy! You're definitely watching those healing numbers really closely during the dungeon, right? So you'd notice that your lustrates and excogs, which already have +/- 5% variance to begin with (which applies to all damage in the game AFAIK), are definitely not roughly 20% bigger than usual. Right? Because I mean, you're a Pro Gamer. You'd never fail to notice such things in a Video Game, of which you are a Professional. Right?

    Some abilities include "Triggers the cooldown of weaponskills upon execution. Cannot be executed during the cooldown of weaponskills." like SAM's Tsubame, which make it clear (if you already know what oGCD's are, etc) that these are instant Abilities that are still on and trigger the GCD.

    Another obvious difference is that spells and weaponskills have their cast times and recast times (including if those recast times are not the usual 2.50s) reduced by speed materia, while abilities are unaffected. But this is again something that you might not really parse until your attention is directed to it. Although, especially with them killing off-brand BLM builds in DT, I think they should just remove materia entirely since it's just like a really, really shitty version of WoW's reforging (which has been added and removed multiple times because it's a stupid, shitty concept to begin with.)

  6. #806
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    Nothing in the game gives you any indication what the difference between a spell/weaponskill and ability is. You might have a class that specifically cites weaponskill/spell (like MCH or DRG), or you might not - but that only helps you understand that your free crit button only applies to some of your buttons, not key differences between them. You might, by very closely watching your hotbars, notice that abilities are typically oGCD actions while spells are not. And then spells like Off Guard and Peculiar Light exist, which have a cast time and are Spells, but are not on the GCD just because fuck you for trying to understand.
    So you did learn things from trial and error, and realize that abilities and weaponskills/spells are different to abilities, but because BLU, a limited job that has a different function in game (and requires you to play other jobs first before being able to get your hands on it) has a few that break the mold it's all confusing? I don't buy it, again, let's look at your other examples:

    Reassemble: Guarantees your next WEAPONSKILL is a critical direct hit, I don't understand, these are how they are all sorted: anything that affects both will affect the raw affix such as DAMAGE or HEALING on their own. Minne mentions actions too, it affects all healing spells and abilities.

    It's right there, in the text: here I'll even show you the differences:





    Again, if you read the tooltip, it makes perfect sense: Your next WEAPONSKILL (which are denoted in the tooltips as well) is a guaranteed CDH. All this does is prove you don't read tooltips mate.

    Pec light and off-guard can be tested with just >1< cast, and they function like that to ensure BLU isn't locked out of another 1.5s gcd after applying the debuff, that's a benefit but you need to take 10s out to test. It's also one instance I can find of things working a bit odd like that, and tsubame doesn't count as I'll explain below.


    Ooh! What about stuff like Dissipation? "Orders your faerie away while granting you a full Aetherflow stack. Also increases healing magic potency by 20%." Healing magic potency sounds like it should apply to all healing you do, especially since you're getting another 3 AF charges to dump into healing (or our flaccid little 100 potency nerd slaps, more likely) right? Haha, nope! It only applies to Spells, dummy! You're definitely watching those healing numbers really closely during the dungeon, right? So you'd notice that your lustrates and excogs, which already have +/- 5% variance to begin with (which applies to all damage in the game AFAIK), are definitely not roughly 20% bigger than usual. Right? Because I mean, you're a Pro Gamer. You'd never fail to notice such things in a Video Game, of which you are a Professional. Right?
    I simply tested it, Dissipation says "healing magic", which I thought it would mean spells, but lustrate and such are abilities with healing, so I scratched my head and thought "well I'll send my fairy away and cast 10 adlos before and after, as well as some lustrates on myself" and I learned it doesn't work, same with synastry. I read the tooltip, made an assumption and then tested it. What you are asking for is the game to write every little potential nuance into everything because you don't want to test or read at this point? The game only "requires" you to seek external information so far if you are lazy, and you have that right, but it's not a game issue here.

    Some abilities include "Triggers the cooldown of weaponskills upon execution. Cannot be executed during the cooldown of weaponskills." like SAM's Tsubame, which make it clear (if you already know what oGCD's are, etc) that these are instant Abilities that are still on and trigger the GCD.
    They are called SPELLspeed and SKILLspeed, we cast SPELLS and weaponSKILLS on the GCD, which I assumed translated to SKILL speed materia and SPELL speed materia, but I again simply tested, took me 10s of reading lmao. with regards to tsuba:



    It has it clearly in the tooltip... So again, do you even read?

    Another obvious difference is that spells and weaponskills have their cast times and recast times (including if those recast times are not the usual 2.50s) reduced by speed materia, while abilities are unaffected. But this is again something that you might not really parse until your attention is directed to it. Although, especially with them killing off-brand BLM builds in DT, I think they should just remove materia entirely since it's just like a really, really shitty version of WoW's reforging (which has been added and removed multiple times because it's a stupid, shitty concept to begin with.)
    Materia is fine, it's just another commodity for slight optimizations, we have so little of it I don't want the last remnants to be cast out. Again, the materias make sense: SPELL speed and SKILL speed are pretty adjacent with some reading. I don't understand, none of this I read externally, I simply read tooltips, went "oh I wonder" hit buttons and went "ah okay". I get confused by the tooltips at times too, so I test them, and 9/10 I can come to a conclusion on my own solely through my own gameplay. It's just such a silly batch of complaints, because even raids teach you shit like vuln/DD is "you can avoid that happening", damage blowing you up for 400k means you may have fucked something, magic and phys vulns up show you either can't eat that, can't eat 2 of them, or some other requirement of resolution. Optimization is a different beast, but all the problems you are expressing I've never been held back by, and I'm not that smart of a person.
    Last edited by Polgara; 2024-06-12 at 06:05 AM.
    “World of Warcraft players are some of the smartest players in the world” - Someone who never played with wow players.

  7. #807
    maybe you don't remember because you're now very familiar with the game but I'm still working through Stormblood and am struggling with a lot of different mechanics the game has to offer. Limit break being one prime example of this. Is this a personal resource? Where do I find the ability to consume the stacks? Should I use it when available? etc.

    I've learned most of what the game has to offer through trial and error because I'm used to WoW (which is also terrible at teaching you the basics even through their new tutorial) so I'm not afraid to fail a few times in an mmo. But I'm convinced that I'm missing a lot of things in FF XIV because the game is mostly a point and click when doing MSQ.

  8. #808
    Quote Originally Posted by Skildar View Post
    Limit break being one prime example of this. Is this a personal resource? Where do I find the ability to consume the stacks? Should I use it when available? etc.
    Limit Break is an ability exclusively available in party content only (Dungeons, Trials, Raids, Alliance Raids, ect) and is split into 3 (arguably 4) kinds that slowly builds over the course of a boss fight or trash packs leading up to a boss:

    a.) Tank Limit Breaks - These mitigate massive damage attacks against the entire party. These are probably the second most commonly used by Tanks on difficult fights to mitigate an attack that would otherwise OHKO the entire group.

    b.) Healer Limit Breaks - These will heal the entire group to various amounts, and at Limit Break rank 3, will revive any and all dead party members while healing everybody to full HP and MP. This is usually (Although not exclusively) used as an emergency if a group ran into problems and a significant number of people suddenly died. As such, Healer Limit Breaks are the least used.

    c.) Damage Limit Breaks - These will provide a big chunk of damage to an enemy and are split between Melee Job Limit Breaks and Ranged Job Limit Breaks. These are probably the most often used kind of Limit Break in party content outside of the hardest content level. Ranged Job Limit Breaks do a gigantic aoe that is usually used to hit a lot of stronger additional mobs that spawn alongside the boss to speed along a phase. The Melee Job Limit Break does slightly more damage but is only a single-target use only and is usually (Again, outside of the highest level content where strategies can change) used to finish off a boss who is at low health.

    Furthermore for Damage Limit Breaks it's important to note that if you're a "Physical Ranged Damage" job, such as a Dancer, Machinist, or Bard, your rank 3 limit break shoots in an aoe that is a straight line in front of you. For "Magical Ranged Damage" jobs such as Black Mage, Summoner, and Red Mage (Or presumably Pictomancer in Dawntrail), your rank 3 limit break is a targeted giant aoe circle. This is important to know so you don't waste a Limit Break and miss.

    If you are a new player normally you're probably not the one doing the Limit Break unless people tell you to OR if you ask about it beforehand in the chat so people can tell you when to use it. Although to be honest if you're just doing random MSQ dungeons and you're toward the end of the final boss and nobody has used it yet and you're <15%ish health on the boss and you're dps, you're probably safe to use it.

    The Limit Break button is located under the "General" tab on the left side if you hit "P" to open your Actions & Traits menu. How however you get there in controller, I dont play with one so I dont know the controls, sorry!


    ~~~~~~~

    As a side note, Limit Break is also available in pvp and adventurer squadron dungeons but they work differently. In pvp, it's sort of an "ultimate attack" unique to each job and you can read the tooltip for your specific job on the pvp guide window. For adventurer squadrons, it's a fairly dead system atm but essentially you need the other npcs alive with you and it lets you spend 1 Limit Break bar to do a stronger attack.
    Last edited by Arlette; 2024-06-12 at 11:58 AM.

  9. #809
    Quote Originally Posted by Arlette View Post
    Limit Break is an ability exclusively available in party content only (Dungeons, Trials, Raids, Alliance Raids, ect) and is split into 3 (arguably 4) kinds that slowly builds over the course of a boss fight or trash packs leading up to a boss:

    a.) Tank Limit Breaks - These mitigate massive damage attacks against the entire party. These are probably the second most commonly used by Tanks on difficult fights to mitigate an attack that would otherwise OHKO the entire group.

    b.) Healer Limit Breaks - These will heal the entire group to various amounts, and at Limit Break rank 3, will revive any and all dead party members while healing everybody to full. This is usually (Although not exclusively) used as an emergency if a group ran into problems and a significant number of people suddenly died. As such, Healer Limit Breaks are the least used.

    c.) Damage Limit Breaks - These will provide a big chunk of damage to an enemy and are split between Melee Job Limit Breaks and Ranged Job Limit Breaks. These are probably the most often used kind of Limit Break in party content outside of the hardest content level. Ranged Job Limit Breaks do a gigantic aoe that is usually used to hit a lot of stronger additional mobs that spawn alongside the boss to speed along a phase. The Melee Job Limit Break does slightly more damage but is only a single-target use only and is usually (Again, outside of the highest level content where strategies can change) used to finish off a boss who is at low health.

    If you are a new player normally you're probably not the one doing the Limit Break unless people tell you to OR if you ask about it beforehand in the chat so people can tell you when to use it. Although to be honest if you're just doing random MSQ dungeons and you're toward the end of the final boss and nobody has used it yet and you're <15%ish health on the boss and you're dps, you're probably safe to use it.
    thanks for the details, I'm playing tank and it seems like the other tank usually don't want to have the aggro nor does they want to use the limit break, I should check the role ability pages again but last time I did, I couldn't find any limit break ability

  10. #810
    Quote Originally Posted by Skildar View Post
    thanks for the details, I'm playing tank and it seems like the other tank usually don't want to have the aggro nor does they want to use the limit break, I should check the role ability pages again but last time I did, I couldn't find any limit break ability
    I updated the post a bit but you can find the Limit Break button if you hit P to open your "Actions & Traits" page and then look to the left side and select "General." The General tab is also where you find the Sprint, Teleport & Return buttons.

    Unless you are doing boss fights where you are required to do a Tank Limit Break to survive an attack, you should not be using one. Note: Unless I'm forgetting one, literally all the fights that require a Tank Limit Break take place in later expansions so it's not something you need to worry about just yet.

    Also if both of you are tanks and are new, it's possible that one of you do not have their "aggro" ability activated. If your other tank isn't using it, then its also possibly they're just telling you without words that they want you to be the main tank. Although I can't tell for sure without seeing the specific situation.

    Without riling up the Hornet's nest again with this comparison, if you're coming from WoW, don't be afraid of telling your groups you end up in that you're new. In most cases people will be more than happy to fill you in on any specific details you might need to know, including if you need to use a Tank Limit Break. You being new gives them a bonus to their rewards they get at the end of the dungeon anyway so feel free to ask any questions you might have.

    Also as a new tank don't be afraid to pull as much or few amount of trash packs as you want. Veteran players usually pull "wall to wall" (Meaning every single trash pack available before a boss or before a wall stops you from progressing) but if you're new and still learning and/or are unsure (Also check with your healer too if they are a Sprout as well before doing this), you as the tank dictate the pace.
    Last edited by Arlette; 2024-06-12 at 12:09 PM.

  11. #811
    I think my only complaint about tooltips is that the terminology seems different from one button to another sometimes.

    Like if you're a healer you have "Spells" and "Abilities". But then you have buttons that refer to "Healing Magic" like Dissipation, or "Healing Actions" like Protraction.

    The Zoe ability on Sage at least uses the consistent terminology, it specifically says "Next Spell" not "Next Healing Magic". So that's good.

  12. #812
    Just a slight correct to dps lbs. Because it can matter in some content, especially harder ones. The melee lb is not only slightly more damage. Its straight up 50% more damage. New players should know this, there is even some normal fights not using it could wipe some slower groups.

    Lb3 ranged 6000 pot vs melee 9000
    Last edited by minteK917; 2024-06-12 at 03:28 PM.

  13. #813
    Quote Originally Posted by minteK917 View Post
    Just a slight correct to dps lbs. Because it can matter in some content, especially harder ones. The melee lb is not only slightly more damage. Its straight up 50% more damage. New players should know this, there is even some normal fights not using it could wipe some slower groups.

    Lb3 ranged 6000 pot vs melee 9000
    You are correct, it was a tad understatement haha. But for somebody who isn't doing cutting edge content, at the end of the day the distinction isn't really going to matter. I don't think I've seen a single time where a ranged lb3 is used over a melee one and it's wiped a group in non-cutting edge fights.

  14. #814
    Ya know this tooltip discourse makes me wonder if I started talking about how absolutely dog shit and god awful ass terrible ALL Square Enix websites are if people would come in and be like "ERMAHGERD just learn how to internet, I think they're fine!!!" XD
    Last edited by WeAreNotSmilesTimes; 2024-06-12 at 03:55 PM.

  15. #815
    Quote Originally Posted by Arlette View Post
    You are correct, it was a tad understatement haha. But for somebody who isn't doing cutting edge content, at the end of the day the distinction isn't really going to matter. I don't think I've seen a single time where a ranged lb3 is used over a melee one and it's wiped a group in non-cutting edge fights.
    You haven't been blinded by the great ver-flashbang into wipe cuz can't see the floor no more I assume?

  16. #816
    Bloodsail Admiral
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2022
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    1,092
    Quote Originally Posted by Polgara View Post
    Again, if you read the tooltip, it makes perfect sense: Your next WEAPONSKILL (which are denoted in the tooltips as well) is a guaranteed CDH. All this does is prove you don't read tooltips mate.
    Did you even read what I wrote? I specifically cited MCH and DRG as examples of classes that have abilities that highlight the difference between skill and ability, and then said that many classes don't have such a skill, so if someone didn't play one of those classes, they may not really understand the difference.

    What you are asking for is the game to write every little potential nuance into everything because you don't want to test or read at this point?
    No, I am asking for tooltips that are concise and are truthful. Because, after all, you and the others have been banging on and on about "omg just read tooltips noob, that's all u need lmao can't even read smh."

    And I'm pointing out cases where "reading the tooltips" might not be enough by itself, because the tooltips are poorly written.

    It has it clearly in the tooltip... So again, do you even read?
    Do you? I literally used Tsubame as an example of an ability which breaks the usual format (it is an ability which is on the GCD and triggers the GCD), and pointed out how the tooltip actually reflects that - even if it's not the simplest way of denoting it.

    Materia is fine, it's just another commodity for slight optimizations, we have so little of it I don't want the last remnants to be cast out.
    It's not slight optimizations, it's literally just whatever Balance or whoever maths out as being optimal. BLM had some leeway with different builds, but those are being killed off in DT. It literally does not have a purpose at this point.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by WeAreNotSmilesTimes View Post
    Ya know this tooltip discourse makes me wonder if I started talking about how absolutely dog shit and god awful ass terrible ALL Square Enix websites are if people would come in and be like "ERMAHGERD just learn how to internet, I think they're fine!!!" XD
    Probably. Some folks here are aggressively tribal in their mentality and it's never made sense to me.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Cow View Post
    I think my only complaint about tooltips is that the terminology seems different from one button to another sometimes.

    Like if you're a healer you have "Spells" and "Abilities". But then you have buttons that refer to "Healing Magic" like Dissipation, or "Healing Actions" like Protraction.

    The Zoe ability on Sage at least uses the consistent terminology, it specifically says "Next Spell" not "Next Healing Magic". So that's good.
    Supposedly the different classes are handled by different people (each handling a few classes) and it sounds like they're kind of siloed off, which would account for inconsistencies in writing and design. If that's true, I have absolutely no goddamn idea why anyone would ever run an outfit like that because it sounds horribly inefficient. If it's not true, I still don't know how to justify the inconsistency in class design and tooltips.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Arlette View Post
    Also as a new tank don't be afraid to pull as much or few amount of trash packs as you want. Veteran players usually pull "wall to wall" (Meaning every single trash pack available before a boss or before a wall stops you from progressing) but if you're new and still learning and/or are unsure (Also check with your healer too if they are a Sprout as well before doing this), you as the tank dictate the pace.
    You can pretty much always pull two packs and it will not be an issue for the healer to handle. If you only pull one pack, there's a pretty good chance the healer or a DPS will go pull another pack for you, because honestly there's really nothing to fear from only two packs. Keep hitting your AOE buttons, rotate through your mitigation buffs, and you'll be fine.

  17. #817
    Quote Originally Posted by Caprias View Post
    You haven't been blinded by the great ver-flashbang into wipe cuz can't see the floor no more I assume?
    I guess I have not haha but I can now imagine it now that you've said it.

  18. #818
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    Did you even read what I wrote? I specifically cited MCH and DRG as examples of classes that have abilities that highlight the difference between skill and ability, and then said that many classes don't have such a skill, so if someone didn't play one of those classes, they may not really understand the difference.
    I pointed out why that is, and what I did to figure it out. If you STILL don't understand then just. . . I dunno, play the game?



    No, I am asking for tooltips that are concise and are truthful. Because, after all, you and the others have been banging on and on about "omg just read tooltips noob, that's all u need lmao can't even read smh."
    They are? I even pointed out examples, and your examples, and how they say what they do? So you can't be asking for them to be truthful, what are you actually asking for?

    And I'm pointing out cases where "reading the tooltips" might not be enough by itself, because the tooltips are poorly written.
    They are? What ones are not? Healing SPELLS and WEAPONSKILLS only affect GCDs,



    Do you? I literally used Tsubame as an example of an ability which breaks the usual format (it is an ability which is on the GCD and triggers the GCD), and pointed out how the tooltip actually reflects that - even if it's not the simplest way of denoting it.
    So are the tooltips not correct or correct? Can you point out one blatantly incorrect? Genuinely, if I've been confused by a tooltip, I simply test it, it's made tooltip make sense. I'm not saying there aren't correct ones, but I went hunting for all your examples and so far you've managed to provide "It's correct but confusing", which returns to my original PEBKAC issue; you can test or look online, there's no shame in asking others for answers.

    It's not slight optimizations, it's literally just whatever Balance or whoever maths out as being optimal. BLM had some leeway with different builds, but those are being killed off in DT. It literally does not have a purpose at this point.
    If anything it MAY lead to sps having a bigger benefit than raw crit/det, it'll require testing but atm the biggest complaints about blm is that it's being standardized, fine, but I doubt many people here were playing when it was required to do double transpose/sharpcast F3 shenanigans to clear ToP P6 on content, because that's the biggest boon of variant builds, which was the only example of it being needed and even then it was "needed" when variance lead to unfortunate enrage wipes because P6 was pretty tightly tuned with sharp bursts of movement that required you to leave TC and some xeno's out of burst.

    Probably. Some folks here are aggressively tribal in their mentality and it's never made sense to me.
    So just like tooltips, people explaining shit also doesn't make sense to you. I think A LOT of things are probably like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by WeAreNotSmilesTimes View Post
    Ya know this tooltip discourse makes me wonder if I started talking about how absolutely dog shit and god awful ass terrible ALL Square Enix websites are if people would come in and be like "ERMAHGERD just learn how to internet, I think they're fine!!!" XD
    You wonder about things that don't exist, are legitimate arguments too far above your paygrade or something?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Cow View Post
    I think my only complaint about tooltips is that the terminology seems different from one button to another sometimes.

    Like if you're a healer you have "Spells" and "Abilities". But then you have buttons that refer to "Healing Magic" like Dissipation, or "Healing Actions" like Protraction.

    The Zoe ability on Sage at least uses the consistent terminology, it specifically says "Next Spell" not "Next Healing Magic". So that's good.
    IIRC zoe and dissipation both say healing magic potency, I'll double check when I get home but I'm pretty sure they are consistent, I'm not sure why it's worded that way but it may be because it increases the base potency? Krasis says healing actions, just like minne. I do agree they could match synestry which says "healing spells" so a mite of weirdness there, but may be because it only functions single target, so they wanted to be clearer in that "it really is only single-target magic". It's weird but the tooltips still do what they say on the tin, which is why I'm confused that people think the tooltips are lying, when they have instances of minor inconsistency in language but a quick test will make you go "ah cool", pretty sure WoW had some funky tooltips too, or still does, but again, quick test and away you go.
    “World of Warcraft players are some of the smartest players in the world” - Someone who never played with wow players.

  19. #819
    Bloodsail Admiral
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2022
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    1,092
    Quote Originally Posted by Polgara View Post
    IIRC zoe and dissipation both say healing magic potency, I'll double check when I get home but I'm pretty sure they are consistent, I'm not sure why it's worded that way but it may be because it increases the base potency? Krasis says healing actions, just like minne. I do agree they could match synestry which says "healing spells" so a mite of weirdness there, but may be because it only functions single target, so they wanted to be clearer in that "it really is only single-target magic". It's weird but the tooltips still do what they say on the tin, which is why I'm confused that people think the tooltips are lying, when they have instances of minor inconsistency in language but a quick test will make you go "ah cool", pretty sure WoW had some funky tooltips too, or still does, but again, quick test and away you go.
    I don't play SGE so I don't know about Zoe but Dissipation only affects spells, not abilities. It's weird you act like a cocky, know-it-all asshole and then turn around and say you're not sure about something. Especially when it's so trivial to check for yourself, as you like to say.

    Honestly, dude. I don't know why you have a bug up your craw about SE's shitty tooltips being pointed out, or why you're taking it so defensively, but you need to calm the fuck down and back up a step. There are literally newer players here that are stating that sometimes it's hard to understand what's going on in-game and how sometimes the tooltips don't make sense until they have time to put things into action and you've completely ignored them so you can hurl vitriol at me and others... while, apparently, not even bothering to read what you're replying to because you are *still* behaving as though I'm arguing from a point of ignorance, instead of someone who understands all the battle system's nuances and is pointing out how the tooltips frequently don't cover a lot of them.

  20. #820
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Epic Premium
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    46,534
    This tangent about tooltips isn't germane to this thread, which is about the upcoming Dawntrail expansion. It would be more appropriate in another thread, but for now, let's pivot away from the discussion and return to the actual topic of the thread.
    "We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •