We will probably see a new Class during the Worldsoul Saga

[Teriz]

And they chose not to call him a Tinker at all at release, not even a mention in his bio. How does that support your claims on brand recognition if they literally chose to dump the brand for release?

Uh, none of the HotS WoW characters were referred to by their classes.

Like I said, the Tinker name doesn't match a Titan tech user either.

Considering that Mimiron's tech and his minions can resemble G/G tech, I don't see how that would be an issue. If we have a tinker using a mechanical claw pack that is hybrid titan/Goblin tech and is still using Xplodium Charges, Gravity Bombs, missiles, Deth Lazors, transform into a full size mech and deploys turrets and pocket factories, I'm not seeing an issue.

Well I disagree, since the concept of a class that reverse engineers Titan Tech doesn't sound anything like a Tinker.

You're welcome to that opinion. I'm pretty sure the class survey also mentions reverse engineering titan tech for the Tinker class as well. That further supports my theory.

When I look at the WC3 Tinker Hero and how it would be adapted to WoW, I expect to see something that fits that concept and identity, like Gazlowe from HOTS or even Sneed from WCRumble. If it's going to end up using Protoss-like tech, then that's no longer a Tinker.

Who said anything about Protoss-like tech? I'm talking Mimion-style tech.

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If we wanna talk about alpha/beta things - hunter had turrets in alpha/beta at some point too.

10 years ago. And that turret got turned into a spitting cobra using the same mechanics.

The Dark Ranger talent from beta worked out in the end though. Just like I said it would.

[Nightshade711]

10 years ago. And that turret got turned into a spitting cobra using the same mechanics.

-snipped irrelevant-

And HOTS alpha/beta was 10 years ago too so...?

[Teriz]

And HOTS alpha/beta was 10 years ago too so...?

The point is that before they decided to refer to the HotS heroes with their names instead of their classes, Gazlowe was called a Tinker. That would be considered a Tinker reference.

[Triceron]

Considering that Mimiron's tech and his minions can resemble G/G tech, I don't see how that would be an issue.

Not at all. His tech a completely different aesthetic from any known Tinkers.

You're welcome to that opinion. I'm pretty sure the class survey also mentions reverse engineering titan tech for the Tinker class as well. That further supports my theory.

Only if your theory was a purist Titan Tech class, yes.
Nothing in that leak says it's using a Goblin and Gnome aesthetic or would be themed around them at all. From the description, it looks applicable to practically any and all races who would use Titan Tech.

And I wouldn't be opposed to that idea, since we're talking about a unified sci-fi inspired concept, not some mishmash of steampunk powered by magic.

Who said anything about Protoss-like tech? I'm talking Mimion-style tech.

What color scheme is mimiron's tech and aesthetics? Primarily shiny metallics like gold and bronze. What powers his tech? Magical energy.

Where do we see any of this in the WC3 or HOTS representations of the Tinker archetype? We don't.

[Nightshade711]

The point is that before they decided to refer to the HotS heroes with their names instead of their classes, Gazlowe was called a Tinker. That would be considered a Tinker reference.

10 years ago.
And if that's fine then the Tinker references in the Hunter class back then would be relevant.

[Teriz]

Only if your theory was a purist Titan Tech class, yes.
Nothing in that leak says it's using a Goblin and Gnome aesthetic or would be themed around them at all. From the description, it looks applicable to practically any and all races who would use Titan Tech.

From the survey;

Genius inventors, who have uncovered the secrets of the titan technology, and using it to protect their allies, heal wounds and attack enemies. Through their understanding of machines. tinkers can create inventions (custom made skills/spells), control Mech-Suits and deploy mechanical constructs to create an advantage in combat.

That sounds exactly like the concept I'm proposing. Further since its using the name "Tinker", that means its going to use aspects of the Tinker heroes from WC3 and HotS.

Where do we see any of this in the WC3 or HOTS representations of the Tinker archetype? We don't.

Turrets, mechs, robotic minions, missiles, etc. You're talking about color schemes, the point is that Mimiron is utilizing mechanical technology. As for it being fueled by magic, we have multiple examples of G/G tech being powered with everything from Azerite to Fel energy.

[Wyrt]

Not if they’re as big as male Draenei and Tauren.

Yeah, male draenei getting into a mech the same size as himself makes a ton of sense.

And no, Blizzard is not going to make a tech class that is arbitrarily restricted to highly unpopular races. They're already voicing concerns about how much dev time and maintenance goes into a class, they're not going to make a class they know will be a waste of time by having idiotic race restrictions.

[Triceron]

That sounds exactly like the concept I'm proposing. Further since its using the name "Tinker", that means its going to use aspects of the Tinker heroes from WC3 and HotS.

As exact as saying they're gonna make a new class based on Chromatic Dragonflight. It's as close as it is far off the mark.

Turrets, mechs, robotic minions, missiles, etc. You're talking about color schemes, the point is that Mimiron is utilizing mechanical technology. As for it being fueled by magic, we have multiple examples of G/G tech being powered with everything from Azerite to Fel energy.

Then it may as well summon demons and be able to turn into dragons, because what would be the limit for magically-enhanced Goblin and Gnome tech really?

[Teriz]

Yeah, male draenei getting into a mech the same size as himself makes a ton of sense.

No, what I'm saying is that you restrict the class to smaller races, and their mech forms can be as large as a male Tauren or male Draenei in full plate armor. That would be respectable size increase that also wouldn't be an obstruction.

And no, Blizzard is not going to make a tech class that is arbitrarily restricted to highly unpopular races. They're already voicing concerns about how much dev time and maintenance goes into a class, they're not going to make a class they know will be a waste of time by having idiotic race restrictions.

Blizzard just released a class that was restricted to a race that didn't exist until said class was released. I seriously doubt they have an issue with releasing a new class that can be played by multiple established races.

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As exact as saying they're gonna make a new class based on Chromatic Dragonflight. It's as close as it is far off the mark.

Well they did. Dracthyr Evokers and Chromatic drakes were both created by black dragons and both can control the 5 dragonflights. Dracthyr can even mimic the coloring of Chromatic drakes.

Then it may as well summon demons and be able to turn into dragons, because what would be the limit for magically-enhanced Goblin and Gnome tech really?

You're simply being absurd here. We have examples in WoW of G/G tech being powered by magic, and machines powered by magic isn't unheard of in the technology archetype.

[Wyrt]

Blizzard just released a class that was restricted to a race that didn't exist until said class was released. I seriously doubt they have an issue with releasing a new class that can be played by multiple established races.

Yeah, and then the very next expansion they start talking about how much dev work new classes are and how much upkeep they require and say that new classes are going to be much rarer in the future and start looking at adding new specs instead of new classes.

Almost like spending all that dev time on a class only 3.5% of players play wasn't a worthwhile investment and it's changed how they view adding new classes to the game.

[Teriz]

Yeah, and then the very next expansion they start talking about how much dev work new classes are and how much upkeep they require and say that new classes are going to be much rarer in the future and start looking at adding new specs instead of new classes.

Almost like spending all that dev time on a class only 3.5% of players play wasn't a worthwhile investment and it's changed how they view adding new classes to the game.

Your reasoning simply doesn’t line up with Blizzard’s recent actions. Again, the Evoker class was assigned to no existing races. So again, the argument that blizzard wouldn’t let Tinkers be exclusive to races that make up over 3% of the current userbase simply doesn’t hold water.

Also look at the recent Demon Hunter class expansion. They only expanded the class to void elves, where a rather easy layup for maximum player adoption would be to also open them up to Nightborne. Didn’t happen, further demonstrating that Blizzard still has no issue arbitrarily race restricting classes.

Btw, I’m quite sure Blizzard is very happy with the millions of dollars they’re getting a month from Evoker players.

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And they chose not to call him a Tinker at all at release, not even a mention in his bio. How does that support your claims on brand recognition if they literally chose to dump the brand for release?

They were absolutely fine with ditching the Tinker name entirely and just calling him the 'Boss of Ratchet'.

Again, NONE of the heroes in HotS were called by their class names. That said, there are Tinker references in the bonus stuff offered to Gazlowe players.

Like I said, the Tinker name doesn't match a Titan tech user either.

Except with the class survey right? The class survey literally attaches titan tech to the tinker name.

Well I disagree, since the concept of a class that reverse engineers Titan Tech doesn't sound anything like a Tinker.

You're welcome to that opinion. We have examples of a goblin inventor reverse engineering both titan tech and legion tech while also inventing various devices like the Iron Star, so there is a precedence for Goblin geniuses to do this stuff.

Because it's common sense, and multiple people in this thread have even agreed with it. What I see here are two very distinct archetypes that you're trying to merge together as one. They don't really fit together at all, and clearly I'm not the only one who sees this.

But hey, if you think people like the concept, you can feel free to make one and add a poll to prove me wrong.

We actually already had two polls about this, and the titan-based Tinker concept beat out all the other options rather handily, including the Artificer concept.

Iron Star tech is not magical by any means. Titan Tech IS magical.

I didn't say it was. I'm saying that from the perspective of the Draenor Orcs, Iron Star tech was futuristic technology created by aliens.

[Al Gorefiend]

For the tinker class, I hope they heavily use the mech gameplay, at least for one of their specs. I think that's the main appeal and it's how they're usually represented in wow, with goblins in their golems or other mechs and vehicles (undermine), dwarven and earthen mechs in TWW and Gnome mechs since gnomeregan and Mekkatorke.

Tinker being just a hunter with a gun and some gadgets wouldn't cut it, and wouldn't look that different from a hunter using robot pets.

I think hunter with guns and gadgets as a spec will be ok, somewhere for all the crazy ideas hunter has had over the years can go.

The always-in-a-mech Tinker will get old for me, FAST. Especially if you cant mount / interact while in your mech like classic druid forms. So your mech suit is just constantly materializing and vanishing every time you leave combat or mount up.

I think the best idea with the mech suit is their tanking form working like shapeshift or being a long cooldown long duration

[allegrian]

I think hunter with guns and gadgets as a spec will be ok, somewhere for all the crazy ideas hunter has had over the years can go.

The always-in-a-mech Tinker will get old for me, FAST. Especially if you cant mount / interact while in your mech like classic druid forms. So your mech suit is just constantly materializing and vanishing every time you leave combat or mount up.

I think the best idea with the mech suit is their tanking form working like shapeshift or being a long cooldown long duration

I mean, the easiest and coolest way for them is to have the mech be its own flying mount, with a cast time like normal mounts where it transforms into a flying vehicle like normal flying mech mounts we've had since MoP. Basically like dracthyr work but as a class/spec.

[Al Gorefiend]

Yeah, and then the very next expansion they start talking about how much dev work new classes are and how much upkeep they require and say that new classes are going to be much rarer in the future and start looking at adding new specs instead of new classes.

Almost like spending all that dev time on a class only 3.5% of players play wasn't a worthwhile investment and it's changed how they view adding new classes to the game.

There was a time shaman and rogue were only half of Hunters and Paladins.

I think the introduction of Evoker, Earthen and Haranir just proves Blizzard doesn't give a shit about the mainstream trends in WoW or gamer preferences. They could release a sexy waifu race with its own spellblade-lancer class with custom spear-fighting animations straight out of final fantasy and it would be a guaranteed slam dunk. WoWs particular flavor comes with its mixing of themes.
And the elven/dragon high fantasy theme is way overdone, at least for now I am bored of it. I want a dirty, greasy mechanic for a character next.

[Teriz]

There was a time shaman and rogue were only half of Hunters and Paladins.

I think the introduction of Evoker, Earthen and Haranir just proves Blizzard doesn't give a shit about the mainstream trends in WoW or gamer preferences. They could release a sexy waifu race with its own spellblade-lancer class with custom spear-fighting animations straight out of final fantasy and it would be a guaranteed slam dunk. WoWs particular flavor comes with its mixing of themes.
And the elven/dragon high fantasy theme is way overdone, at least for now I am bored of it. I want a dirty, greasy mechanic for a character next.

I think this is unfortunately the crux of the disagreement;

Some very vocal people in this thread want yet another elven-based class that wouldn't be out of place in a Japanese or Korean MMO, and they DON'T want a class based on what they consider to be inferior races like Goblins and Gnomes despite trends showing that players would welcome such a class due to it being something unique and fresh. They especially don't want these races attached to something like the titans, despite multiple points of evidence suggesting that that's exactly what Blizzard is doing.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

.Btw, I’m quite sure Blizzard is very happy with the millions of dollars they’re getting a month from Evoker players.

Blizzard has deemed evoker players not worth caring about and made them the only class that has ever been excluded from content with there multi month event that is suppose to keep players subbed excluding them completely.

There’s no way blizzard are happy with the results and actively leaving them out giving there players a reason to unsub until next expansion.

[Al Gorefiend]

I think this is unfortunately the crux of the disagreement;

Some very vocal people in this thread want yet another elven-based class that wouldn't be out of place in a Japanese or Korean MMO, and they DON'T want a class based on what they consider to be inferior races like Goblins and Gnomes despite trends showing that players would welcome such a class due to it being something unique and fresh. They especially don't want these races attached to something like the titans, despite multiple points of evidence suggesting that that's exactly what Blizzard is doing.

Lots of people needing to realize guild wars 2 and ff or genshin are probably more up their alley. Those games imitate WoW not the other way around.
You go over to Warhammer subs and they complain of the same shit.. Asian MMO sterilization and saccharine cutesyfication of characters to appeal to people who want cute face cute pet cute outfit cute everything.
Zug Zug Horde was Blizzard having to balls to make the "ugly bad guys" into playable with complex background and it WORKED. I hate seeing it go away, WoW was the only MMO doing that.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I think this is unfortunately the crux of the disagreement;

Some very vocal people in this thread want yet another elven-based class that wouldn't be out of place in a Japanese or Korean MMO, and they DON'T want a class based on what they consider to be inferior races like Goblins and Gnomes despite trends showing that players would welcome such a class due to it being something unique and fresh. They especially don't want these races attached to something like the titans, despite multiple points of evidence suggesting that that's exactly what Blizzard is doing.

I play trolls and dwarfs exclusively, I don’t want tinkers to go to goblins/gnomes only as I think that it not only doesn’t fit the lore at all but it will severely gimp the class and we’ll end up with another evoker situation where it’s deemed not worth resources and left out of content which is a lose lose for every one.

Also I want to be a proper chaos dwarf and take my demon engines into battle.

[Al Gorefiend]

I play trolls and dwarfs exclusively, I don’t want tinkers to go to goblins/gnomes only as I think that it not only doesn’t fit the lore at all but it will severely gimp the class and we’ll end up with another evoker situation where it’s deemed not worth resources and left out of content which is a lose lose for every one.

Also I want to be a proper chaos dwarf and take my demon engines into battle.

I think dwarves and draenei fit Tinker too.

Personally if they gave Alliance more options than Horde I'd be fine with it. Such an arbitrary restriction that Tinker cannot happen because Alliance has more tech-savvy races than Horde does. Give Horde 2 (Goblin and Earthen) and give Alliance 7 (Dwarf, DI Dwarf, Earthen, Gnome, Mechagnome, Draenei, LF Draenei). People would hate that even though I wouldnt, so that is why people say G/G, it just opens up faction disparity to allow anything else.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I think dwarves and draenei fit Tinker too.

Personally if they gave Alliance more options than Horde I'd be fine with it. Such an arbitrary restriction that Tinker cannot happen because Alliance has more tech-savvy races than Horde does. Give Horde 2 (Goblin and Earthen) and give Alliance 7 (Dwarf, DI Dwarf, Earthen, Gnome, Mechagnome, Draenei, LF Draenei). People would hate that even though I wouldnt, so that is why people say G/G, it just opens up faction disparity to allow anything else.

open to all is really just the only sensible way to do it as there's no way to justify not letting dwarfs be a techclass even more so if it's titan tech which they are more savvy at then either goblins or gnomes and as you said that opens up an imbalance people would cry to the heavens about.

The idea that elves will be the most played with it as any class is annoying, but farless annoying then leaving out the races with the actual closest ties to the titans for two races that have zero interactions with pretty much any thing titan related other then one abandoned vault.