Poll: What's the worst 18 to pug with mediocre group not in comms?

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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    Waycrest Manor was miserable as a tank. There are so many paths and people kept wanting to go down different paths each time. As a tank, I pick one path and then people start whining "no you're supposed to go down this route!" so the next run I went down that route and then people said "no, you're supposed to go down this other route!".
    There might be 2 ways to go at the start, but normal groups just expect you to go to coven first. It's not that complicated you must be running some crazy low keys if you ever saw a shitter say you should go right first.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    There might be 2 ways to go at the start, but normal groups just expect you to go to coven first. It's not that complicated you must be running some crazy low keys if you ever saw a shitter say you should go right first.
    Plot twist, both wanted him to go upstairs.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    For worst dungeon to tank, it's a tie between Waycrest Manor and Murozond's Rise.
    As a tank, these are my favourite dungeons to play (all my runs are pugs, so play = pug)


    The one I do once for .io and never again is AD. Last boss on tyrannical is the end of innocence, no matter how much the group is told what to do. It's a boss I've soloed from 50% on both druid and monk, just because I knew we'd be wiping until depleted. 1 chesting after a 7min fight is better than pulling my hair out for 15 min.
    Last edited by Nephod; 2024-03-11 at 10:04 PM. Reason: Spelling.

  4. #24
    Herald of the Titans czarek's Avatar
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    Thats strange for me that AD is voted. For me thats easyest dung this tier (im 100% pugger)

  5. #25
    Stood in the Fire lllll's Avatar
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    Fall.

    People that are playing classes/races that can nullify the corrosion on 3rd boss aren't doing it in pugs, makes it a nightmare in higher keys.

  6. #26
    Galakrond's Fall has 3/4 hard bosses, and Galakrond himself has an absolute fail state if your entire group can't do his mechanic - you literally cannot carry a bad player through that dungeon

    - - - Updated - - -

    I'm not surprised Rise is number 1 because I felt that way initially; but honestly, only murozond is a problem and you can just tell your group not to touch orbs and deal with it yourself, the other bosses aren't super difficult

  7. #27
    Honestly I don’t regularly have problems on any of them, normally doing 18s, but have hit them all on 20.
    When I remember my most consistent problems though, it revolves around Blackrook Hold on Fortified weeks. Sometimes groups just cannot manage to CC/kick the adds and it’s just a wipefest over, and over, over.
    Might just be bad luck, as no one else in thread seems to have my experience.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Villager720 View Post
    Blackrook Hold on Fortified weeks. Sometimes groups just cannot manage to CC/kick the adds and it’s just a wipefest over, and over, over.
    Tbh that's a tank fail. If you see your pug struggling with interrupts in BRH you single pull every trash group and interrupt yourself.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    Tbh that's a tank fail. If you see your pug struggling with interrupts in BRH you single pull every trash group and interrupt yourself.
    Yeah, this dungeon in particular highlights how strong VDH is for PuGing. You can chain CC packs for almost the entire duration of BL which is absolutely nuts. Pally's with their infinite kicks are nice, too, but sometimes there are too many interrupts going out for them to get them all. (Blinding Light and HoJ are great back up tools but almost zero tanks at the 20 keystone level use this stuff.) Another neat trick I've found as a DK is that you can MC one of the casters and make the pull a bit less bandwidth intensive for your group. You can actually keep it MCd for the whole dungeon though I typically release so I can MC one of the cats on the way to 2nd boss instead. (That AE bleed sucks ass on high Fort keys.)

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Yeah, this dungeon in particular highlights how strong VDH is for PuGing. You can chain CC packs for almost the entire duration of BL which is absolutely nuts. Pally's with their infinite kicks are nice, too, but sometimes there are too many interrupts going out for them to get them all. (Blinding Light and HoJ are great back up tools but almost zero tanks at the 20 keystone level use this stuff.) Another neat trick I've found as a DK is that you can MC one of the casters and make the pull a bit less bandwidth intensive for your group. You can actually keep it MCd for the whole dungeon though I typically release so I can MC one of the cats on the way to 2nd boss instead. (That AE bleed sucks ass on high Fort keys.)
    Illuminated sigils isn't surviving to next xpac, if it even survives into season 4. It's absolutely broken, and creates bad habits for dps who never have to learn to use their own stops and interrupts if a good VDH is carrying them. It's worse than the prot pal kick situation cause it's stops and not just interrupts. VDH would still be strong with a lot of stops even without double sigil charges(moving chains to be more accessible was already enough) , that talent is so broken I don't know how it went live in the first place.
    Last edited by Tech614; 2024-03-20 at 08:08 PM.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Baraden View Post
    Galakrond's Fall has 3/4 hard bosses, and Galakrond himself has an absolute fail state if your entire group can't do his mechanic - you literally cannot carry a bad player through that dungeon
    I sort of did as a priest by lifegripping a hunter who refused to get into the soak by himself.

  12. #32
    The two worst in my opinion are Rise and Everbloom. Rise is tight on the timer and has some bosses that pugs just seem to struggle badly with, the sand room is also a big time loss with a lot of groups because its not extremely linear. Last boss in a pug group can be very frustrating. Everbloom on the other hand is one of those keys that's challenging on both a fortified and a tyrannical to a lot of groups. Aside from the first boss I would say the remaining 3 can all be frustrating in a pug group with players making small mistakes that are costly. 3rd boss has to get the prize for worst boss of the season. If you're not coordinated and somewhat skilled at using your CDs/Healthpots etc (which pugs might not be) then you're in for a rough ride.

    Biggest gap from "easiest in a premade to hard in a pug" probably goes to Atal though. It's such an easy ride in a premade when everyone does their job, but it can be very frustrating in a pug and I usually avoid it for those reasons. People get very caught up about the routes for some reason (I used to get whispers as the tank for going Priestess after Rezan instead of Vol'Kaal and everything from trash to bosses in there have that 'easy when done right but mess it up and it hurts you' aspect. Just getting into a group that can kill 3 totems at once feels like a big hurdle.

    For me the easiest ones this tier has been BRH, Waycrest and Galakrond's Fall. They're all pretty chill with the timer and with the first 2 I think a lot of it is people played Legion and BFA and already had a decent basic knowledge of those two dungeons, so you're not starting from scratch. With Galakrond's Fall there's really not much to struggle with in my experience. The second and fourth boss have had punishing wipe mechanics since day 1 so people picked up on those pretty quick. It's been a long time since I had a group fail with the debuff on second boss or miss a soak (or heal Chromie) on last boss because those are the mistakes that people 'worked out' earlier in the season. Only boss that can get a bit messy in there for me is the third boss and that's usually only with a tank who doesn't 'get' the debuff mechanic and when to pass it.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Zantera View Post
    Only boss that can get a bit messy in there for me is the third boss and that's usually only with a tank who doesn't 'get' the debuff mechanic and when to pass it.
    I didn't want to be the one, but I do have to inform you if the tank ever has to pass the debuff the group fucked up. It's acceptable in P3 if you had no one else close to throw it on the tank or in a high tyr and no one else has a personal to take the initial hit(this situation doesn't happen in normal pug keys, it's not high enough), but that still messes with mob positioning. If the tank ever has to pass the debuff in p1 and p2 the person the debuff went on initially has no idea what they're doing. Generally the debuff should be going on the tank when the frontal is going to happen before it expires(p1, send it on immediately, p2 send it on the tank during the tornado phase, p3 send it on the tank after the 3rd fire breath if fight gets that far), and it's a group responsibility not the tanks so the tank can maintain proper positioning and not drag bad shit into places it shouldn't be or be aiming the frontal toward the group.

    Now if someone fucks up should the tank be aware and try to fix it? Yea, but it's still because someone else fucked up first and it's just extremely punishing if it expires on the tank vs someone else.
    Last edited by Tech614; 2024-04-09 at 03:23 AM.

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