2024 Election - Trump vs. Harris, important downballot

[Huehuecoyotl]

That's what, four or five people who've condemned me and others for calling out fascism who, when I've asked, have just thrown a useless tantrum about it rather than an actual definition of fascism that they'd prefer I use instead?

I'm giving them every opportunity to make their case. And it's just so unfair, apparently.

That is dribbles MO, sadly. When faced by facts that are inconvenient, he'll ignore them and invent his own. It's why he's still convinced, to this day, that Brexit is a glorious achievement. Even if he can't state a single benefit when pushed.

He's also capable of cognitive dissonance on an industrial scale, and he views hypocrisy as being as normal as breathing. If you push him, he'll be claiming that he's "already given you a definition of fascism" before you know it.

If the Power Rangers were the various types of trolls that these forums attract, dribbles would be the giant combined mechanoid that they'd come together to create. Only, you know, working for the other side.

[PhaelixWW]

my guy. my dude. do you genuinely honestly think that the accurate timeline will matter?

To anyone who will make a difference? Yes, the timeline matters.

Anyone who's too braindead to even pay attention to such a blatantly obvious detail was never going to care one way or the other, because their mind was already long gone made up.

I mean its your right to be dismissive

I'm not at all being dismissive. But you'll pardon me if I don't go full doomer.

but yanno... keep hiding your head in a sand - we did back when Hillary was running and look where it got us.

Yes, a lot of people had a wakeup call in 2017. Including me. I voted for Jill Stein in 2016 because I was disenchanted with both parties (even though I was still a registered Democrat). But when 2020 rolled around I knew that it was more important than ever to vote for the Democrat candidate, even if Biden's not the most impressive specimen. Same thing applies this time around.

[Kathranis]

I really just see this sentiment as begging the biggest Trump supporters to laugh and taunt if, heaven forbid, some Biden event has a crazed shooter. A real sign you believe in the concept of a liberal democracy is genuinely believing that political assassinations are damnable acts, and anybody attending a political rally that dies is deserving of sympathy.

I can even get behind the thought of “if you think the 2020 election was stolen, you’re part of what’s wrong with this country.” At some level (and we can argue about it), there’s a nub of truth there. Now, going “and I’m going to laugh when you die, because you deserved it at some level” is just personal radicalization. I think sane people will have to admit a year from now that the person they were that believed it made a mistake.

The sentiment, at its most pure core, is believing that some people deserve to be dehumanized. And I want to believe in a future country where the people of the Right and the people of the Left that do this kind of routine just willingly drop it.

Do you ever feel a twinge of pain in your conscience while posting this utter horseshit or are you just truly a sociopath? You are seriously the most disingenuous poster on this forum.

There is no nub of truth in claims the election was stolen, unless you mean a handful of Republicans voted illegally or that the entire Republican party tried to steal it using every method available to them and still lost. Nevermind all the forms of election interference the Republican party employs across the country to maintain control in minority Republican areas.

Trump and MAGA and countless high profile Republican politicians and pundits have spent the last 12 years calling Democrats pedophiles and communists, claiming they are trying to destroy this country, claiming that immigrants are vermin polluting the blood of our country, claiming the doctors who perform gender-affirming care or abortions are butchers, and so much other heinous shit I'm having trouble put it all into words.

Democrats are rightly calling out Republican attempts to institute a theocratic, fascist regime in 2025. This isn't even a matter of opinion, it is the literal Republican party platform. You know it, I know it. Everyone fucking knows it.

We've had countess acts of violence and threats carried out by right wingers, both those acting alone and those organized into militias and other such groups. From Charlottesville to Jan 6 to Nancy Pelosi's husband getting attacked, and several other incidents besides. To say nothing of the violence going on at the border, where Abbot installed literal death traps in the Rio Grande that killed dozens of women and children last I counted, which was months ago.

Things that Republicans cheer on, joke about, and call for more of. You've got thousands of Republican chuds calling for Civil War on an almost daily basis.

Nevermind the radical rolling back of abortion protections which have now resulted in a marked increase in infant mortality in states where anti-abortion legislation was passed, as well as a steep increase in rape-related pregnancies, and women facing life-threatening complications with doctors being unable to help for fear of being prosecuted.

Nevermind the violence of poverty inflicted on millions of Americans every year. Nevermind the material harm caused by rolling back worker protections and child labor laws, removing books from schools, depriving schools of funding, and eliminating school lunch programs.

The Republican Party exists to vilify and cause harm to marginalized groups. Period.

And here you are spouting this crap all while, on an almost daily basis, downplaying the killing of civilians in Gaza, which is a loss of life on a far grander scale with far more grotesque consequences.

Truly, you sicken me. Go cry your crocodile tears and spout your empty platitudes somewhere else.

[unfilteredJW]

That is dribbles MO, sadly. When faced by facts that are inconvenient, he'll ignore them and invent his own. It's why he's still convinced, to this day, that Brexit is a glorious achievement. Even if he can't state a single benefit when pushed.

He's also capable of cognitive dissonance on an industrial scale, and he views hypocrisy as being as normal as breathing. If you push him, he'll be claiming that he's "already given you a definition of fascism" before you know it.

If the Power Rangers were the various types of trolls that these forums attract, dribbles would be the giant combined mechanoid that they'd come together to create. Only, you know, working for the other side.

We already have Shitty Voltron. Get your own.

[Corvus]

Republicans are increasingly attacking the media, claiming they have been excessively vilifying Trump and saying that caused the shooting, which ignores it has been Biden they have been hounding for a while.

Oh, and calling the director of the secret service necessarily woke and more interested in getting women into the job than making sure they can do their job.

[Breccia]

Republicans are increasingly attacking the media, claiming they have been excessively vilifying Trump.

Yes, the wailing cry of "Stop demonizing Trump by pointing out all that stuff he did! All that pointing out his deplorable words and actions caused one of our own party members to attack democracy, just like Trump did Jan 6th 2021!"

Nothing about Trump getting a paper cut changes that he's a horrible human being and, by multiple experts' accountings, the worst President the US has ever had.

I especially like the REEEEE-like shrilling of those saying this is Biden's fault for inciting violence and that he should be indicted. Like, they completely forgot the SCOTUS ruling applies to the current US President. Who is not Trump, despite a violent terrorist insurrection. Led by Trump.

[ati87]

Republicans are increasingly attacking the media, claiming they have been excessively vilifying Trump and saying that caused the shooting, which ignores it has been Biden they have been hounding for a while.

Oh, and calling the director of the secret service necessarily woke and more interested in getting women into the job than making sure they can do their job.

Oh no...instead of attacking the media on a daily basis republicans are attacking the media on a daily basis now.

[Flarelaine]

Belarus, Hungary and Serbia don’t parade around trying to claim they’re the greatest country in the world though. The US is quickly living up to the idea of it being a failed experiment in democracy.

Hungary absolutely has fever dreams of being the bestest there ever was. I suppose rightwingers in every country do but around here the flames have been stoked by the government for a decade and a half now.

[Elder Millennial]

Belarus, Hungary and Serbia don’t parade around trying to claim they’re the greatest country in the world though. The US is quickly living up to the idea of it being a failed experiment in democracy.

You never met a single Hungarian over 40 or Hungarian nationalist have you? Or Serbian for that matter? :P

[Nymrohd]

You never met a single Hungarian over 40 or Hungarian nationalist have you? Or Serbian for that matter? :P

I'd say nationalists from anywhere. Building some type of myth, either by picking a moment in time when your country was expansive or if need be, appropriating someone else's, is what nationalists do. You need to base your supremacist narrative on something after all.

[Paranoid Android]

New: House Democrats tell Axios
that the fight over Biden's candidacy is on the back burner in the immediate aftermath of the Trump shooting.

Rep. Dean Phillips says it would be "unpatriotic and unprincipled" to focus on anything but the shooting.

I swear the Dems just have no heart.



https://x.com/AndrewSolender/status/1812590415071138114

There has been reports that multiple Democrats are just resigned to Biden losing and are giving the "we will get it next time" or "let's try to work with him". Yeah Dems, there won't be a next time.

[ati87]

New: House Democrats tell Axios
that the fight over Biden's candidacy is on the back burner in the immediate aftermath of the Trump shooting.

Rep. Dean Phillips says it would be "unpatriotic and unprincipled" to focus on anything but the shooting.

I swear the Dems just have no heart.



https://x.com/AndrewSolender/status/1812590415071138114

There has been reports that multiple Democrats are just resigned to Biden losing and are giving the "we will get it next time" or "let's try to work with him". Yeah Dems, there won't be a next time.

At least the DNC will write a report about what they did wrong in 2024 and that they will learn their lesson for 2028. But whatever the lesson is the next nominee will need to be even something like Clinton or Biden but not older than 70 because clearly the age is the problem not the fact that the DNC puts its finger on the scale to pick a candidate that they like and not what's best for the US.

DNC would rather lose any election than to risk somebody like Sanders to become President.

[shimerra]

At least the DNC will write a report about what they did wrong in 2024 and that they will learn their lesson for 2028. But whatever the lesson is the next nominee will need to be even something like Clinton or Biden but not older than 70 because clearly the age is the problem not the fact that the DNC puts its finger on the scale to pick a candidate that they like and not what's best for the US.

DNC would rather lose any election than to risk somebody like Sanders to become President.

Folks like you also vastly overestimate how likely a Sanders presidency would have been. Half the country thinks Biden is a dirty commie socialist and Clinton too and Sanders couldn't even pull a win off in an election where people are more likely to be okay with socialism than the general voting population and the DNC really didn't have to even put their finger in the scale to any significant degree since the voters took care of it for them.


Let's also not pretend that it's at all surprising the DNC wasn't the biggest fan of a guy who historically refused to join the DNC on top of being quite critical of the organization literally only joining in temporarily vs. two of their biggest players.

Don't get me wrong I'd have happily voted for Bernie if he made it through. I'm just not under this weird delusion that with the Electoral college Sanders would be this auto win ya'll seem to think he is in the United "Keep your socialism out of my Medicare" States of America.

[Kaleredar]

At least the DNC will write a report about what they did wrong in 2024 and that they will learn their lesson for 2028. But whatever the lesson is the next nominee will need to be even something like Clinton or Biden but not older than 70 because clearly the age is the problem not the fact that the DNC puts its finger on the scale to pick a candidate that they like and not what's best for the US.

DNC would rather lose any election than to risk somebody like Sanders to become President.

The hell does sanders have to do with anything? He isn’t running. “Oh but if Biden stepped down than Bernie could come in and win the election and then he could wave his magic wand and we’d all be living in the land of cookies and marshmallows.”

It was tiring in 2020, it’s tiring now.

Democrats need to stop bitching and moaning, frankly. Biden is going to be the candidate, and people need to come to peace with that. So instead of undermining him but saying “oh dang but he looks old,” maybe give it a sec for the hubbub to fade around Trump’s kerfuffle and then focus on how Trump’s a convicted criminal, liable sexual assaulter, chronic narcissistic liar, and willing participant in installing a fascist state, and that some Republican whackjob taking a shot at him doesn’t change that.

[DarkAmbient]

Democrats need to stop bitching and moaning, frankly. Biden is going to be the candidate, and people need to come to peace with that. So instead of undermining him but saying “oh dang but he looks old,” maybe give it a sec for the hubbub to fade around Trump’s kerfuffle and then focus on how Trump’s a convicted criminal, liable sexual assaulter, chronic narcissistic liar, and willing participant in installing a fascist state

How well do you think Biden is currently doing in this regard?

[Kaleredar]

How well do you think Biden is currently doing in this regard?

In communicating that message? Currently he’s probably laying low in not lashing out while Trump is “down,” so to speak. That’s common political decorum.

And I can tell you he’s going to have a better job enumerating on Trump’s many, many failures, shortcomings, and terrible policies and positions if he’s not spending all his time having to bat down democrats with cold feet talking about “optics.”

[Paranoid Android]

In communicating that message? Currently he’s probably laying low in not lashing out while Trump is “down,” so to speak. That’s common political decorum.
”

Ooph. Dems keep getting their teeth kicked in, but think decorum is the key. Lord help us.

[Endus]

Ooph. Dems keep getting their teeth kicked in, but think decorum is the key. Lord help us.

I can see holding off on any direct attacks until Trump's communicating politically again after the shooting. Maybe don't kick the opponent when they're on the mat. But given that Trump was back to bloviating on Truth Social on Sunday, he's already gotten back up and stated he's ready to keep going. No reason to go easy on him after that point.

And before anyone takes issue with "violent rhetoric" there, I'm comparing it to a boxing match. A sport. Not an actual fight.

If things had gone differently and Trump were laying in a hospital bed in a coma, personal attacks would be gross. His near got nicked and he's fine, though. Trump's implicitly said he's ready to keep going. "Political decorum" is satisfied; start swinging back full strength.

[PosPosPos]

Folks like you also vastly overestimate how likely a Sanders presidency would have been.

So it's a self-fulfilling prophecy you are describing. Left-wing candidates can't win because you won't let them.

And Americans unironically wonder why the top 2 presidential candidates are fascist-lite and fascist.

[Kaleredar]

So it's a self-fulfilling prophecy you are describing. Left-wing candidates can't win because you won't let them.

And Americans unironically wonder why the top 2 presidential candidates are fascist-lite and fascist.

“You won’t let them” nothing. Bernie had his shot. Democratic voters chose other candidates.