2024 Election - Trump vs. Harris, important downballot

[Draco-Onis]

That's not what I'm arguing. I'm arguing that "ye average voter" does not look to Democrats or Democratic messaging to inform themselves about policies, or even inform themselves about policies or laws.

Again: Republicans would claim credit regardless. This would not be the first time Democratic passed legislation and its effects were promoted by Republicans who voted against the bill, and it will not be the last time.

You're complaining about messaging that this crowd doesn't even see.

So you are saying calling it a republican & democrat bill doesn't make it easier for those claims to have validity? Yes republicans would always try to take credit but you don't need to help them along by calling bipartisan.

Hugely, bigly, massively disagree with this assessment here.

First off: Casual reminder that a big selling point of a Biden administration was a "return to boring". Getting things done, moving forward, and not new scandals every other day and a 4-year long game of "Acting-Musical Chairs". And so far, he's fucking overdelivered on that which is what people said they wanted.

There have been quite a few wins notched including a ton of student loan forgiveness over the years after the bigger plans were stopped by the courts. Most just aren't huge, major, sexy pieces of news that get wall to wall coverage and that people get super duper excited about.

Drama around Manchin and Sinema is wholly unknown to "ye average voter" and is absolutely inside baseball Washington stuff that people who closely follow politics might care about and understand the importance of but "ye average voter" is wholly oblivious to, especially if they do not live in Virginia or Arizona and may not even know who either Senator even is.

False, I would agree with you with Sinema but not Manchin the man was a media whore who dominated headlines for months making the process look messy and Biden weak. There's a reason why President Manchin jokes became a thing because he was sucking the oxygen out of the room.

I assumed that's where the discussion was going, if it wasn't then my bad.

But back to Teriz's point, slogans are more effective than actual policies. Democrats don't have good slogans and have always struggled with it due to the actual "big tent" nature of the party. "Tax the rich!" is good to a point, but it doesn't exactly motivate folks like "MAGA", yaknow?

sigh I am not marketing genius but you don't need to reinvent the wheel remember early days of the Biden administration he loved to compare himself to FDR. Take a wild guess how FDR campaigned and won. MAGA isn't a new slogan either it's a straight copy and paste of old slogans and campaign strategies.

Because "ye average voter" has any awareness of this, right?

Why did you mention it then lol

[Edge-]

So you are saying calling it a republican & democrat bill doesn't make it easier for those claims to have validity? Yes republicans would always try to take credit but you don't need to help them along by calling bipartisan.

Again, "helping" them is irrelevant. It's not actually helping if they're going to do it regardless, and won't care about how true or dishonest it is.

False, I would agree with you with Sinema but not Manchin the man was a media whore who dominated headlines for months making the process look messy and Biden weak. There's a reason why President Manchin jokes became a thing because he was sucking the oxygen out of the room.

For example: https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...-82122-release

A plurality of voters don't know who he is or don't have an opinion (31%), with the second highest being "neutral" at 24% which indicates no real familarity. So over 50% of America had no real opinion on him as of late 2022, when he was whoring it up to the max extreme.

I'm trying to find it now, but there was another great recent example of just how shockingly uninformed ye average voter. Us here? We're the 1% of political discourse, yo.

sigh I am not marketing genius but you don't need to reinvent the wheel remember early days of the Biden administration he loved to compare himself to FDR.

Early on? Can you refresh my memory on that? The only time I remember he made the comparison was this years SotU and even then it was more about the moment in history than Roosevelt's legacy of progressive policies.

Take a wild guess how FDR campaigned and won. MAGA isn't a new slogan either it's a straight copy and paste of old slogans and campaign strategies.

Explain it to me? How did he campaign and win? It's been long since I took my AP US History class and that's not something we ever even really covered.

Why did you mention it then lol

Because "ye average voter" does know who Moody's is and that they're a big name credit/rating agency, which gives them credibility in their eyes.

Also, that's more for this thread specifically, us 1%'ers, to have a giggle over, mostly aimed at the "muh economic anxiety" crowd that thinks that Donald is the best thing for the economy.

[Draco-Onis]

Again, "helping" them is irrelevant. It's not actually helping if they're going to do it regardless, and won't care about how true or dishonest it is.

You are not reading what I wrote, I am referring to the validity of their claim. If it was the Democratic infrastructure bill they can try to claim credit but would fail. You put a giant banner plague on every project (FUNDED BY THE DEMOCRATIC INFRASTRUCTURE BILL). It's the same republicans tried and failed to claim credit for checks sent by Biden, this is messaging and marketing.

For example: https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...-82122-release

A plurality of voters don't know who he is or don't have an opinion (31%), with the second highest being "neutral" at 24% which indicates no real familarity. So over 50% of America had no real opinion on him as of late 2022, when he was whoring it up to the max extreme.

I'm trying to find it now, but there was another great recent example of just how shockingly uninformed ye average voter. Us here? We're the 1% of political discourse, yo.

We can't pass this bill because X , Y and Z democrats are on TV fighting with each other and nothing is getting done that's what ye old voter got from that era. That asshole couldn't keep it behind closed doors that's his biggest blow to Biden.

Early on? Can you refresh my memory on that? The only time I remember he made the comparison was this years SotU and even then it was more about the moment in history than Roosevelt's legacy of progressive policies.

It was within the first year only based on his proposals, the White house was bragging about his transformative economic and infrastructure proposals.

Is Biden The Next FDR? or LBJ?

How Joe Biden Is Positioning Himself as a Modern FDR

Biden Wanted an F.D.R. Presidency. How’s He Doing So Far?

Explain it to me? How did he campaign and win? It's been long since I took my AP US History class and that's not something we ever even really covered.

He ran against the evil rich fat cats and the do nothing congress, he famously said If The Rich Would Rather Leave than pay Taxes, Let Them.

Because "ye average voter" does know who Moody's is and that they're a big name credit/rating agency, which gives them credibility in their eyes.

Also, that's more for this thread specifically, us 1%'ers, to have a giggle over, mostly aimed at the "muh economic anxiety" crowd that thinks that Donald is the best thing for the economy.

Moodys lost most of the credibility they had with the public during the 2008 financial crisis.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Politics is just entertainment at this point. Democrats are still trying to run on good policy while Republicans turn the election into a Super Bowl Wrestling Match Reality TV between the two candidates. The future of our country hinges not upon who has the best policy but whoever owns the other candidate harder.

[En Sabah Nur]

How is it a messaging issue from Democrats

Because some people need to blame Democrats, or continually show them in a bad light, even while they supposedly support/vote for them because the other guys are worse.

[Benggaul]

Because some people need to blame Democrats, or continually show them in a bad light, even while they supposedly support/vote for them because the other guys are worse.

I wouldn't go that far in this case. I think it's just general frustration that the election's going to be close because Biden isn't the greatest candidate.

[Teriz]

rofl no, it's because they want credit for something that will help their constituents that they had nothing to do with. their voters aren't listening to Joe, lol



Republicans have consistently taken credit for Democratic pushed policies and legislation. It doesn't matter how effectively or ineffectively Democrats communicate around this, Republicans will lie anyways.

Gotta agree with Edge on that one. There was a GOP congresswoman on TV in Florida who got grilled for taking credit for a major infrastructure project she voted down in congress, and she suffered zero political consequences for it. Her (Republican) constituents simply didn’t care.

[Endus]

Politics is just entertainment at this point. Democrats are still trying to run on good policy while Republicans turn the election into a Super Bowl Wrestling Match Reality TV between the two candidates. The future of our country hinges not upon who has the best policy but whoever owns the other candidate harder.

Honestly, if you give a shit about good policy, you're already voting Democrat. They don't need to win their votes. They need to start throwing chairs into the ring for Biden.

You can't argue with fascists. They literally don't care, and they'll laugh at you for wasting your time. They're hypocrites? Who cares! They don't. They're tossing out bait for you to chase and you're falling for it. Don't try and correct them. By all means, correct the record for those who haven't sided with them (lord knows I do) but get the idea you'll ever convince them out of your head. Not gonna happen, and they'll laugh at you for even trying.

What you need to spend your time on is pointing out they're all chickenshit little cowards, panicky little Chicken Littles who're scared of their own shadows. The entirety of their worldview is predicated on being very, very afraid and very, very weak.

Mockery is the only weak point fascism has. You can't argue them into changing their minds. You can mock them into hiding themselves away because they legitimately cannot take it. Poor fuckin' widdle baby dorks.

- - - Updated - - -

Gotta agree with Edge on that one. There was a GOP congresswoman on TV in Florida who got grilled for taking credit for a major infrastructure project she voted down in congress, and she suffered zero political consequences for it. Her (Republican) constituents simply didn’t care.

Like, don't try and convince her voters she's terrible. They don't care. You point out she's a dishonest shitwad who's so incompetent she has to steal credit from Democrats.

And this has to be coming from the media. Or they're complicit with the lies. If you're providing them a platform and not contradicting their narrative to their face to shove it right back on them, you're complicit with the rise of fascism. You're not doing your job, as a journalist.

Journalism isn't about being neutral. It's about being objective. When someone uses your platform to push a lie, you crucify them.

[Milchshake]

Many are saying that since convicted felon Donald Trump was convicted of 34 felonies he no longer has "the juice." Sad! Sad!

[Dontrike]

Many are saying that since convicted felon Donald Trump was convicted of 34 felonies he no longer has "the juice." Sad! Sad!

[IMG]https://cdn.bsky.app/img/feed_thumbnail/plain/didlc:afucvpwfwrd35te62yqccbhz/bafkreigivrqiwf5xdenhsk4uepsngyiec4ibb26qqnvevjcneoma77jbnq@jpeg[/IG]

He's going to try and speed up that lawsuit that allows him to sell stock before it's practically worthless.

[Somewhatconcerned]

Trump campaign significantly out gained Biden in May, erasing the latter's cash advantage.

Former Dem governor of NY Andrew Cuomo comes out and says the hush money case should have never been brought against Trump.

Teamster union boss to address RNC this summer, has yet to hear back from request to also address DNC. Biden about to lose the union vote??!!

Biden is looking more and more done with each passing week.

[s_bushido]

Trump campaign significantly out gained Biden in May, erasing the latter's cash advantage.

Former Dem governor of NY Andrew Cuomo comes out and says the hush money case she have never been brought.

Teamster union boss to address RNC this summer, has yet to hear back from request to also address DNC. Biden about to lose the union vote??!!

Biden is looking more and more done with each passing week.

Keep huffing that copium, troll.

[Edge-]

Biden about to lose the union vote??!!

I'm just askin questions, here!

[Dontrike]

Trump campaign significantly out gained Biden in May, erasing the latter's cash advantage.

Former Dem governor of NY Andrew Cuomo comes out and says the hush money case should have never been brought against Trump.

Teamster union boss to address RNC this summer, has yet to hear back from request to also address DNC. Biden about to lose the union vote??!!

Biden is looking more and more done with each passing week.

Yeah yeah, the rich are backing Trump as he says he'll give them trillions in tax breaks once again, not surprising.

Why does Trump fuck little kids? I'm just asking questions.

[En Sabah Nur]

Biden is looking more and more done with each passing week.

Genuine question: did you start this account with this name, or later change it and attempt to just seem like a "somewhat concerned" left wing voter that I assume kept touting how poorly the left was doing, and how well the right were doing (as is the case right now)?

Your account seems to be from 2012, and the history feature of this forum only goes back 40 pages of posts, so I dunno if you name changed or what. But this seems to be the only way you really post.

It is shockingly opaque as an agenda. And you don't even do it very well, I have to say. Rather embarrassing at how on the nose it all is.

As a side note, btw, maybe offer some links to the things you claim, too. So people can actually confirm what you're saying?

[Benggaul]

As a side note, btw, maybe offer some links to the things you claim, too. So people can actually confirm what you're saying?

"Buh buh you'll just say those sources are bad!" or something.

Concern trolling is still trolling, but somehow they've gotten a pass for it for years.

[En Sabah Nur]

"Buh buh you'll just say those sources are bad!" or something.

Concern trolling is still trolling, but somehow they've gotten a pass for it for years.

I guess if you don't outright specifically break any forum rules, its easy to coast by. It seems like certain people have mastered that ability based on a few threads here.

[Shadowferal]

Genuine question: did you start this account with this name, or later change it and attempt to just seem like a "somewhat concerned" left wing voter that I assume kept touting how poorly the left was doing, and how well the right were doing (as is the case right now)?
Your account seems to be from 2012, and the history feature of this forum only goes back 40 pages of posts, so I dunno if you name changed or what. But this seems to be the only way you really post.
It is shockingly opaque as an agenda. And you don't even do it very well, I have to say. Rather embarrassing at how on the nose it all is.
As a side note, btw, maybe offer some links to the things you claim, too. So people can actually confirm what you're saying?

His "predictions" have always been wrong. And his responses reek more of desperation than any "concern."

[En Sabah Nur]

His "predictions" have always been wrong. And his responses reek more of desperation than any "concern."

I assumed from the reaction he got, he was seen as a bit of a joke. I just want to understand what he's about in his own words, so nobody can misconstrue him.

[Dontrike]

"Buh buh you'll just say those sources are bad!" or something.

Concern trolling is still trolling, but somehow they've gotten a pass for it for years.

You could say that about 30 different posters here. They'll get temp banned 50 times before anything meaningful happens.