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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    What ARE they supposed to be?
    That was kind of part of the problem. The idea was "let's do the RTS experience, but from a unit's perspective" which sounds kinda cool but is such a vague concept that it never quite materialized properly. They just didn't figure out what it was they actually wanted and how this is not just another dungeon/raid. It's more like a quest or an event, I guess.

    They had a cool idea but no idea how to really make it work within the existing WoW framework, both in terms of gameplay and in terms of interface, let alone in terms of group play. Just not a great implementation of one of those "oh that sounds cool!" moments that just wasn't cooked enough and quite frankly probably would never have gone anywhere even with more cooking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Imo they should have at least done the Southern Barrens Warfront, if only because it would have been great for the story to actually make the Alliance a bit less hero/victim (especially if it would give Baine a chance to actually stand up for the Horde for once). Plus Dwarf/Tauren themed mogs? Yes please.
    I really do think they just looked at feedback, saw that people by and large really did not like WFs, and decided to not throw good money after bad. There's plenty of things they "should have done" for story/lore/flavor reasons, but content isn't free. You have to manage your resources. It's the ol' at-the-cost-of-a-raid-tier meme.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    It works (to a degree) whenever it's a solo activity. It falls apart REAL quick when it becomes a group activity.

    Like, if you want a solo Warfront where you are the commander and get to send out troops and whatnot... that's totally fine to do. No real problem. But having a commander in a large player group? That's a recipe for disaster.

    But even in solo play, it very quickly becomes ridiculous if everyone is the commander, big lord, chosen one, whatever, especially outside of instanced solo content. That was the whole thing with BFA world quests where Magni blows smoke up your ass about saving the world as its champion... while there's 20 other champions around you saving it, too. It just becomes such a cliche in a group setting, even if it's not actual group play.

    They'd have to just put everything into strictly instanced solo content and then it's the rise of the forum hordes who complain the game isn't even an MMO anymore.
    Hmmm, to be honest, I can't follow your point.
    This is how the game is handled for a decade by now, at least
    Why would it be a disaster.

    I'm the Huntsmaster, I wield Thas'dorah not that other hunter that had the same quests and owns same item etc.
    When I'm in the Maw, I'm the Maw Walker, and no one else, I'm also the only one with Thrall at my side, the other player (what is he even doing here?) only has some NPC called "orc companion" by his side. (it doesn't even have the same model/name)
    Just like how in Final Fantasy I'm the only Warrior of Light, my comrades are just buddies I summon to defeat enemies.

    That's not the point though, what I wanted is that the NPCs in this universe do something and work too from time to time, and this can be shown when you are part of the force that is engaged with the enemy, and when you are not *the only* force that is actually engaging the enemy while azeroth's races just idle and wait for your return and some good news. It would make the world feel more alive than right now, as of right now, it feels like the armies of azeroth don't exist and it's on the shoulders of 1-25 heroes.

    Warfronts were changing that. Garrisons too.
    Among other things.

    And getting to command (as in, I'm the leader of the group and can select what unit types I use or what upgrades they have for this new, imagined game mode) for this a small "sidequest" is hardly shaking up the command chain or whatever.
    When another player would join my group here, he is also allowed to order troops around. Why wouldn't he, in the end I'm the leader of this endavour for my part of the story, and the other player would be the leader in "his".
    From my point of view it would just add to the whole experience because now I have a player who is also bringing his fighting force along. So the whole thing became a joint operation. etc. etc. yada yada.
    Last edited by KrayZ33; 2025-01-14 at 11:02 PM.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by KrayZ33 View Post
    Hmmm, to be honest, I can't follow your point.
    This is how the game is handled for a decade by now, at least
    Why would it be a disaster.
    That's how it's been in solo play.

    Not in group play. What I said would be a disaster is if someone had to ACTUALLY be the commander in a Warfront. Not just a character like all the others in the group that's simply referred to as "Commander" but an ACTUAL commander that gets to make choices etc. the other group members don't get to make.

    And you're right that the conceit of everyone being special has been in the game for years, but it's also been a bit of a sore spot for years. It came to a head with the whole Champion of Azeroth thing in BFA where all the memes exploded (mostly because of Magni's insufferable interjections) but it's been cooking for a long time. And of course there's no good solution, but it's something somewhat tacitly accepted in the background - going deeper on it would probably not sit well with people.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    That's how it's been in solo play.

    Not in group play. What I said would be a disaster is if someone had to ACTUALLY be the commander in a Warfront. Not just a character like all the others in the group that's simply referred to as "Commander" but an ACTUAL commander that gets to make choices etc. the other group members don't get to make.
    That is not correct, or perhaps you overestimate the scale I'm suggesting here. Or maybe you are confused because I'm talking about a PvE mode even though OP suggested turning Warfronts into PvP.
    Right now if you join a delve as a group there is only 1 Bran - I think it's the party leader's, or the highest level - can't remember.
    When you defended the garrison in WoD, the owner gets to decide what troops and NPC walk around and help defend.

    In this "let's imagine this"-Warfront (which is on a scale of a delve or two or a small battleground), I'd say it's almost the same as in a regular Warfront. Players have ressources, players can upgrade/build something on predefined spots to help for the mission and on top they either get to create their own unit type which works just like you would change Bran from a healer to a DPS plus whatever relics you pick, or they can only buy/use the units that the party leader has chosen for this (more likely due to how it would technically work with the scaling of the difficulty).

    I'm not suggesting an actual RTS game here with archon mode.

    You basically play some kind of DotA match/Alterac on a small scale.


    This would be nothing new, everything exists in one form or another already, but not "together"
    Last edited by KrayZ33; 2025-01-15 at 08:00 AM.

  5. #25
    Maybe then the right implementation for Warfronts would have been solo play...

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Maybe then the right implementation for Warfronts would have been solo play...
    That's what I'm thinking, or as mentioned, really small group content like Delves, just so you can play with friends and talk about stuff while doing them etc.
    Add some progress to it through troop type leveling, and upgrades, just like you level Bran right now - add 6-10+ troop types per Warfront (each Warfront featuring different races) and it would be amazing content in my opinion.
    Scaling and Rewards could work exactly like Delves do atm.

    At lvl7 onwards, the enemies get one island-AI enemy for each player among the usual HP/DPS scaling the enemies get, or something.

    And it's okay for content to fall off eventually, I wouldn't expect players that run Mythic+/Mythic raids to do them every single week until the end of an expansion, but they would surely add immersion and could be used as story telling devices.
    Much more so than delves currently provide.

  7. #27
    The Unstoppable Force Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Warfronts were a cool idea, but with bad execution

    Too long, too boring, the objectives took like, forever to do.

    IF it was solo and shorter would be good

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by KrayZ33 View Post
    You aren't.
    I loved them too.
    It's just that they didn't really evolve it, just like island exploration.

    I'd have taken 3 solo/small group warfronts over the 10 or howevery many Delves we have right now any day.
    I just love the idea of Alterac or Alterac-esque systems where you fight together with NPCs and upgrade stuff etc.


    An idea that I have would involve a rogue-like system where you can upgrade your troops/change the troop types you are going in with and then have some kind of DotA-esque fight against the AI similar to how warfronts worked, but on a smaller scale.


    One of the things WoW suffers from in my opinion is that you rarely feel like part of something greater.
    Warfront made me feel like a high ranking officer in an army and that army actually supported me and my goals.
    One of the few momemts where you aren't basically handling every single thing by yourself while everyone else around you is at most some kind of actor pretending to fight alongside you.
    I would lose my fucking mind for a mount and blade or sands of Salazar (idk if anyone knows that game hah) style game mode as the next remix/plunderstorm extra mode

    You start off as a lone champion and level up completing quest and eventually find or hire soldiers and build an army then move up to taking control of settlements

    Could be themed around the mixed up timelines with a bunch of different versions of azeroth all getting tangled in "infinite space" or whatever and we have the option to join one of the groups from the different time lines we saw the time rift vendors from

  9. #29
    Field Marshal TheWizardFan88's Avatar
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    I would like to see HD Battlegrounds like Alterac Valley someday. Warfronts did had their great shot in the BFA Expansion but they were scrapped. I was hoping we see Ashenvale one, Silverpine, and the Barrens but oh well.
    Last edited by TheWizardFan88; 2025-01-16 at 07:40 AM. Reason: misspelling.

  10. #30
    warfronts are pve not pvp, but it has become very difficult to queue for them now even if someone just wants to do it once for the story/achievement, they need to be like more accessible and scaled down to be soloable or something

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