Race to World first: Liberation of Undermine

[Xath]

First of all we already know what the race for world first looked like without streaming; Limit were never even close to winning. Secondly, Echo's first 29 pulls on bandit was last reset, with probably more than 4 ilvl lower.

Uh yes they were? They released their uld logs they had a bunch of low wipes on ghuun including a sub 1% with a very early death. They should have gotten that one but made a bad call with extending.

[Bjay]

Uh yes they were? They released their uld logs they had a bunch of low wipes on ghuun including a sub 1% with a very early death. They should have gotten that one but made a bad call with extending.

No, they weren't. Method streamed the Uldir WF race. They should've never even been close to getting it.

[Tech614]

No, they weren't. Method streamed the Uldir WF race. They should've never even been close to getting it.

Limit was ahead of Method the entire time until they extended and choked, so Method streaming it did absolutely nothing to help Limit. Limit still had to figure out every boss and phase on their own because they hit them all before Method did.

There is a reason Limit started to get sponsorships after that race and it certainly was not because "they never should of been close" lmao, they where 1 bad decision away from likely winning the race.

[Shurkien]

We all can be happy that Method won Uldir.
I think this hole streaming thing would be one&done if they lost. Doesnt matter if they lost bc of streaming or not.

[SeIex]

No, they weren't. Method streamed the Uldir WF race. They should've never even been close to getting it.

I don't know why you're acting as if Liquid's skill level back in and prior to uldir when they were limit (and had never seriously went for world first) is at all relevant today. It's not whatsoever. They should have won uldir if not for the extension mistake, which was a reasonable mistake without foreknowledge of the vantus nerf, but yes, method (which is basicaly echo now), at the time, were the head and shoulders better guild as we saw for the next several tiers. But Liquid/Limit have massively improved since then.

Has the existence of the RWF allowed liquid to become what it is today. Absolutely. But if you're trying to suggest if right at this moment these guilds opted out of streaming, that echo would suddenly be massive favorites as they were before liquid/limit matured into what they are today, you're definitely delusional and have not been paying attention. Not a single echo player would agree with that sentiment.

[Bakis]

Yay splits time (again)

[Relapses]

I don't know why you're acting as if Liquid's skill level back in and prior to uldir when they were limit (and had never seriously went for world first) is at all relevant today. It's not whatsoever. They should have won uldir if not for the extension mistake, which was a reasonable mistake without foreknowledge of the vantus nerf, but yes, method (which is basicaly echo now), at the time, were the head and shoulders better guild as we saw for the next several tiers. But Liquid/Limit have massively improved since then.

Has the existence of the RWF allowed liquid to become what it is today. Absolutely. But if you're trying to suggest if right at this moment these guilds opted out of streaming, that echo would suddenly be massive favorites as they were before liquid/limit matured into what they are today, you're definitely delusional and have not been paying attention. Not a single echo player would agree with that sentiment.

History is written by the victors. Players don't remember the close 2nd place finishes. They only remember the winners. It's sad, but just how it be.

[SeIex]

History is written by the victors. Players don't remember the close 2nd place finishes. They only remember the winners. It's sad, but just how it be.

Yep that's fine. Method won and were the better guild at that time. It was only ever close to begin with that tier because they didn't believe they had competition and didn't take things seriously. But to try to suggest that the ease with which they won at that time and prior to that is any indication as to what would happen today if both liquid/echo decided not to stream today is insane, which is what that guy was saying earlier.

[gobarj]

Yep that's fine. Method won and were the better guild at that time. It was only ever close to begin with that tier because they didn't believe they had competition and didn't take things seriously. But to try to suggest that the ease with which they won at that time and prior to that is any indication as to what would happen today if both liquid/echo decided not to stream today is insane, which is what that guy was saying earlier.

It's a good thing we have competition so close these raids, it's always at the final boss with guilds progressing similarly. I don't want to see a repeat of Paragon where they shit on every competition under the sun like it's taking candy from a child (even the "old" Method back then).

To me, the race can go either way, which make it interesting! If I knew Liquid or Echo would always win, it'd be boring and I likely wouldn't tune in.

It looks like Echo is doing splits and what not, if they don't continue with Mugzee progression, I feel like Liquid could mess them up if they decide to go dark again given Echo hasn't really done much in that fight.

[Tech614]

Yep that's fine. Method won and were the better guild at that time. It was only ever close to begin with that tier because they didn't believe they had competition and didn't take things seriously. But to try to suggest that the ease with which they won at that time and prior to that is any indication as to what would happen today if both liquid/echo decided not to stream today is insane, which is what that guy was saying earlier.

The only tier Method won in BFA that was a clear talent disparity was BFD anyways. Not sure why you're acting like Limit was huge underdogs or well under current Liquid's talent level. Liquid has more resources but the talent level is relative. They should have won in Uldir, and it wasn't because Method didn't take it serious. They pushed Method to the limit(no pun intended) in eternal palace and props to method for forseeing the 2 heal strat which got them the W and then Limit won outright for Ny'alotha and that one wasn't even close just like BFD wasn't in the opposite favor.

I don't know why we're discounting Limit, who was a serious competitor from the moment BFA started.

[Unforgivenn]

Liquid did 24 pulls on Mug'Zee after the bandit kill, 43,7%. a lot of pulls tbh, and a good progression too...

Lets see if they will start on Mug'Zee or will do splits too

[Northern Goblin]

Liquid woke up, time for a Mug'zee nerf.

[SeIex]

The only tier Method won in BFA that was a clear talent disparity was BFD anyways. Not sure why you're acting like Limit was huge underdogs or well under current Liquid's talent level. Liquid has more resources but the talent level is relative. They should have won in Uldir, and it wasn't because Method didn't take it serious. They pushed Method to the limit(no pun intended) in eternal palace and props to method for forseeing the 2 heal strat which got them the W and then Limit won outright for Ny'alotha and that one wasn't even close just like BFD wasn't in the opposite favor.

I don't know why we're discounting Limit, who was a serious competitor from the moment BFA started.

You're gonna be hard pressed to convince me that limit weren't huge under dogs and clearly the worse guild definitively during early bfa when method won 3 tiers where they went head to head in a row, while facing competition that wasn't streaming while streaming themselves in 2 of those raids. They were obviously closer by eternal palace but the point still stands. Could/should limit have won uldir without the extension/vantus stuff, sure, but they were still the worse guild aided by method's inadequate prep that tier.

I'm not saying anything that Max himself hasn't said. Liquid/Limit were far worse at that time relative to method/echo then they are today which Max has also said time and time again. And this is coming from someone who has ALWAYS and ALWAYS will be cheering for Liquid/Limit in these races.

[gobarj]

Ignoring the past, both guilds are now equally skilled and it could go either way. Method is creeping up but I'd say they're more like 80-90% of what these two guilds are. It would be odd to say Echo/Liquid is far better when the race can go either way! If it was MDI, I'd agree, Echo is a dominant force there.

Method did shock me with their final boss kill being some 2 hours after Echo in the last tier, but other than that I haven't seen anything impressive this tier. They're just lagging behind.

[Jolly Roger]

this will be a stupid close race

[Northern Goblin]

This fight hasn't even hit it's crazy phase yet and it's been an excellent challenge.

This could last to the weekend, if it does, hoping Gallywix goes to a week 3 head to head on Thursday.

[Mackud]

This fight hasn't even hit it's crazy phase yet and it's been an excellent challenge.

This could last to the weekend, if it does, hoping Gallywix goes to a week 3 head to head on Thursday.

Mug'Zee will still be alive by the weekend. They're just using bloodlust right now in the hope they'll actually see the next phase. It will be a crazy tight dps check for the last 40%. Remember there's no way of resetting his energy in p2 which acts as a countdown til berserk

[Nymrohd]

Btw what are the odds for a secret Gallywix phase?

Also, can Liquid keep playing on week 3 or are they limited on how long they'll be at the venue?

[Roxinius]

Btw what are the odds for a secret Gallywix phase?

Also, can Liquid keep playing on week 3 or are they limited on how long they'll be at the venue?

They more than likely have an open contract for the venue doubt they'd chance it happening again

[Shurkien]

P3 looks insane right now.