World of Reportcard-Craft

[Big Thanks]

So right after launch? When hardcore raiders were immeasurably more powerful than casual players compared to today? When raiders could zone into BGs in full raid gear and wipe out enemy teams with impunity? Because that was 20 years ago

Meanwhile, universe B, my alt with 1/10th the playtime of my main is ~2ilvls lower. I haven't set foot in the undermine raid, and my main is ~2lvls from the sweatiest mythic raiders and key pushers in the world.

This game is far more egalitarian than it has ever been.

On this topic, i think players are clueless:

"I need better gear even tho i dont do hard content"
"Why and for what?"
(and i shit you not these are REAL answers from the past)
"To kill mobs faster in the world AND for old raids transmog runs"

Bruh...
What you need is progression...and is not gear progression u need. IMO

[Just Passing through]

On this topic, i think players are clueless:

"I need better gear even tho i dont do hard content"
"Why and for what?"
(and i shit you not these are REAL answers from the past)
"To kill mobs faster in the world AND for old raids transmog runs"

Bruh...
What you need is progression...and is not gear progression u need. IMO

Thanks for posting that. Because by that logic....once you killed the last boss...you need no loot. You proved you can do it in the gear you had. Why do you want better loot? I guess as a reward and TO DO IT FASTER NEXT TIME.

Same difference. I don't get the logic.... It is why ppl drive to go shopping in a SUV if a normal car, a bicycle or some big shopping bags will do. Yes..you often do NOT need stuff in your life, but it is sure nice to have.

I can do my T11 delves in ilv 640 gear, but it sure is nicer in ilv 660 - and it might get me into other content should I decide to go there. What's it to you?

[Caprias]

Thanks for posting that. Because by that logic....once you killed the last boss...you need no loot. You proved you can do it in the gear you had. Why do you want better loot? I guess as a reward and TO DO IT FASTER NEXT TIME.

Same difference. I don't get the logic.... It is why ppl drive to go shopping in a SUV if a normal car, a bicycle or some big shopping bags will do. Yes..you often do NOT need stuff in your life, but it is sure nice to have.

I can do my T11 delves in ilv 640 gear, but it sure is nicer in ilv 660 - and it might get me into other content should I decide to go there. What's it to you?

Well not sure what your CE experience is but in all guilds I've been this is a bad argument because motivation massively drops once the last boss is done lol.

[Big Thanks]

Thanks for posting that. Because by that logic....once you killed the last boss...you need no loot. You proved you can do it in the gear you had. Why do you want better loot? I guess as a reward and TO DO IT FASTER NEXT TIME.

Same difference. I don't get the logic.... It is why ppl drive to go shopping in a SUV if a normal car, a bicycle or some big shopping bags will do. Yes..you often do NOT need stuff in your life, but it is sure nice to have.

I can do my T11 delves in ilv 640 gear, but it sure is nicer in ilv 660 - and it might get me into other content should I decide to go there. What's it to you?

So in your opinion, if we gift everyone Mythic gear they will decide to finally try harder content?
I dont think they will...
But fuck it, do it

You know the tier set gated tokens that get added once every 2 weeks?

Make a Mythic level item piece gifted every 2 week too.
Sounds fun, no joke but might cut morale to actually do/engage in harder content.

[Ereb]

and then good luck getting into a group. Opting out of the system does not unfortunately eliminate its reprocussions.

You can't have your cake and eat it too guy lol. People don't want to waste their time, same as you

[Glorious Leader]

So right after launch? When hardcore raiders were immeasurably more powerful than casual players compared to today? When raiders could zone into BGs in full raid gear and wipe out enemy teams with impunity? Because that was 20 years ago.

All of which was simple of function time investment. Not niche difficulty catered to the elites. I have no problem with QOL. The game was made far better with it. Multiple difficulty is not QOL. It represents a far worsening experience for everyone who isnt the cream of the crop. Any satisfaction they may have derived from achievement is instantly undermined by the fact that that boss exists in another tier expressly in order to cater to you. And i think evem the developers realize this. Why is the normal raid level track called champion?

[Ereb]

Yes of course. World of Warcraft is a job and you are being hired for your services. Good luck encouraging players with this. People seeking escapism in a video game are going to be really turned on by replicating real world functionality. Common sense my dude.

You are the type of guy to run head first into a wall and blame the wall. IF you want your little "escapism" it's still right there, but you know that and don't care because you will say anything.

Also nothing in this game is "a job" I already told you people don't want to waste their time on your lack of skill, which is perfectly fine they pay $15 a month just like you and, to your grand surprise, you aren't more special than anybody else.

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All of which was simple of function time investment. Not niche difficulty catered to the elites. I have no problem with QOL. The game was made far better with it. Multiple difficulty is not QOL. It represents a far worsening experience for everyone who isnt the cream of the crop. Any satisfaction they may have derived from achievement is instantly undermined by the fact that that boss exists in another tier expressly in order to cater to you.

What a meaningless word salad..

[Soon-TM]

By having 4 raiding difficulties, as well as separate gearing paths that aren't really relative to eachother unless you do the higher difficulties of Delves and M+ (which has led to things such as Raider.io hurting casual players chances of getting gear, as many of them have no prior experience to M+, which means their rating is...well...0 lol), you overcomplicate the game for the casual player. In 2025, many players just want to enter the world, get the gear, then vibe. And with a lack of new fans coming into WoW (let's face it, most young folk are NOT thinking about WoW as a game they should try out), I don't think appealing to the competitive and overachieving side of WoW is the best course to go.

Exactly. Ion & co. love to talk about muh esportz, but every single esport worth something these days has some kind of automated matchmaking, precisely because if you are a DPS it really isn't fun to apply to 483710485715 groups before you can actually, you know, play the damn game (the few good bits, anyway).

[Joshuaj]

that's a wild ass statement that is disproven with 3rd party tools lmao

"3rd party tools"

Oh brother...

[Stickiler]

All of which was simple of function time investment.

Except that's objectively not true. The ONLY way to get the good gear in Vanilla was to be part of a raid group, and to get in to those, you had to pass extremely stringent entry requirements, trials, and even more clique-like behaviour like requiring a recommendation from an existing member of the raid team.

Nowadays you can get full Myth track gear having never stepped in to the raid, or joined a guild. All it requires now is time, time to either put your own groups together, or run the dungeons up through each key level.

[Glazey]

"3rd party tools"

Oh brother...

Do you think it doesn't? There is 14,767 guilds that have killed and recorded Gallywix on Normal. Assuming we go with the basic composition of 20, that's just under 300k players (add in maybe 200k additionally for unrecorded/flex?). For a game with 7 million+ Subs as of Dragonflight, I'd say yeah, we can use 3rd party tools in this case to say that the casual playerbase is pretty fuckin' healthy.

[Rageonit]

All of which was simple of function time investment. Not niche difficulty catered to the elites.

99.9% of vanilla players (who never conquered Naxx) might disagree.
What you fail to realize is that in the "old" WoW with a single difficulty mode goals and expectations of various groups of players would clash, because Blizzard could not cater to all of them at once; while nowadays players can hapilly coexist in those awful, awful cliques of like minded players and just do their own thing. The horror!

[Just Passing through]

Well not sure what your CE experience is but in all guilds I've been this is a bad argument because motivation massively drops once the last boss is done lol.

My experience is that we had difficulties getting ppl on "wipe nights" - Sure, at the start of the raid, EVERYONE wanted to be there...but once we got stuck on a boss, participation dropped. After all bosses were down, we would have no problem filling raids for quite some time - the hard work was done, the farming began.

So in your opinion, if we gift everyone Mythic gear they will decide to finally try harder content?
I dont think they will...
But fuck it, do it
You know the tier set gated tokens that get added once every 2 weeks?

Make a Mythic level item piece gifted every 2 week too.
Sounds fun, no joke but might cut morale to actually do/engage in harder content.
.

It is not what I said and it is not my opinion. No, I don't think everyone will try harder content even if you give out free gear. Then however there are ppl who DO harder content like mythic +17 despite rewards not getting better after +12. Or am I wrong in the reward thing?

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Except that's objectively not true. The ONLY way to get the good gear in Vanilla was to be part of a raid group, and to get in to those, you had to pass extremely stringent entry requirements, trials, and even more clique-like behaviour like requiring a recommendation from an existing member of the raid team.

Nowadays you can get full Myth track gear having never stepped in to the raid, or joined a guild. All it requires now is time, time to either put your own groups together, or run the dungeons up through each key level.

...and if you have the dedication to do harder content for the sake of it, you can still go crazy and even crazier than in Vanilla (I was actually shocked...don't ask me why...how crazy mythic raids are. I mean...."memorize a 70 page excel spreadsheet of where to be at what point"? ) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKPweYtoUN0 - from a guy who joined a mythic guild to make it into the Hall of fame of season 1 in WWI

[Merpish]

Thanks for posting that. Because by that logic....once you killed the last boss...you need no loot. You proved you can do it in the gear you had. Why do you want better loot? I guess as a reward and TO DO IT FASTER NEXT TIME.

Correct. You don't need more loot. My guild starts doing mythic sales as soon as the last boss dies, and we prioritize giving loot to the buyer no matter what.

Raiders will eventually get all the gear they need during farm.

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My experience is that we had difficulties getting ppl on "wipe nights" - Sure, at the start of the raid, EVERYONE wanted to be there...but once we got stuck on a boss, participation dropped. After all bosses were down, we would have no problem filling raids for quite some time - the hard work was done, the farming began.

This is a bad guild problem. Sorry to tell you this.

[Just Passing through]

Correct. You don't need more loot. My guild starts doing mythic sales as soon as the last boss dies, and we prioritize giving loot to the buyer no matter what.

Raiders will eventually get all the gear they need during farm.

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This is a bad guild problem. Sorry to tell you this.

No problem, the times are long gone....

[Merpish]

All of which was simple of function time investment. Not niche difficulty catered to the elites. I have no problem with QOL. The game was made far better with it. Multiple difficulty is not QOL. It represents a far worsening experience for everyone who isnt the cream of the crop.

Can you please explain how this is the case? How is having multiple difficulties, that exist to meet all players wherever they are, catering to high-end players?

[Ashana Darkmoon]

Can you please explain how this is the case? How is having multiple difficulties, that exist to meet all players wherever they are, catering to high-end players?

He's uncomfortable that it is possible for people to achieve things that he cannot, because that's too much like real life.

[Ghostile]

Can you please explain how this is the case? How is having multiple difficulties, that exist to meet all players wherever they are, catering to high-end players?

He wants everything above his level deleted because only he matters.

[Relapses]

He wants everything above his level deleted because only he matters.

He also wants slot machine gambling from WQs via Titanforging to return. Unironically, I think he'd be better off playing a gacha game, but he's one of those stubborn individuals that'll rail against the dying light of the sun until he gets what he wants. He's already getting Legion Remix later this year, but I don't think he'll actually be sated until he gets to re-experience the early Legion shitshow in all of its RNG glory via Legion Classic (probably some time in 2027?).