What pisses you off greatly in WoW?

[Lecadre]

that it runs on a horribly ancient engine which was built for rts (warcraft 3) thus making its optimization far worse over the years including memory leaks and other issues

[Ielenia]

For players, who play for so long, that they get tired of 1/3 specs in this game - Blizzard should add new classes/specs every other xpack.

And what happens if you also don't like the class being added? Then what?

It's their problem, that they're so lazy, that they don't do it.

This is not about being lazy. It's just you thinking you know better than the developers when you actually don't. You can only add so many classes before they start becoming homogenized. It's easier to make 13 classes feel and look different from one-another than it is to make 31 classes feel and look different one-another.

Asking to change existing ones - is terrible idea, cuz there may be players, who like them and would be pissed off in case of changes.

It's not a bad idea. It's a decent one. Because just as much as there would be people who won't like the changes, there are others who will like them. Even its most extreme negative example, the survival hunter, has fans.

"I've got bored" - isn't valid argument, you know, cuz it's the greatest example of "you" problem.

No, the rea "greatest examples of a 'you' problem" are actually your posts and threads. Every single one of them, a big, big "you" problem you try to masquerade as a game issue.

And this isn't abut me getting bored, or you getting bored. This is about the players in general getting bored of a stale game. The human mind craves novelty, that's basic psychology. Without repeated stimuli the mind grows bored, the "new and exciting" becomes "stale and commonplace". It loses its luster. And changing classes expansion to expansion helps keep them somewhat fresh.

You should learn to find new interesting things in game by yourself.

These forums would be so much better if you followed your own advice...

[NineSpine]

Brother, I'm not playing this boring semantic game with you for the five hundred billionth time. This is a thread called "what pisses you off about WoW" and the analogies you were providing were very obviously alluding to your personal preferences.

Nothing I said was about semantics. Are you replying to a different thread or something?

The conversation was about whether things should be changed for the sake of change. It is not my fault that rather than follow that conversation you decided to dredge up all your usual stock lines like “it’s subjective” and “wow is an mmo whether you like it or not” and “it’s semantics”.

Like I said: never on topic, always arguing with some phantom that has nothing to do with what anyone said.

[Ielenia]

that it runs on a horribly ancient engine which was built for rts (warcraft 3) thus making its optimization far worse over the years including memory leaks and other issues

I believe you're talking about that old WoW prototype screenshot using WC3 assets, but WC3 and WoW do not run on the same engine. The initial states were made on the WC3 engine, almost like a "mod" for the game, as a proof of concept, but the engine itself is not the same between WC3 and WoW.

[WowIsDead64]

And what happens if you also don't like the class being added? Then what?


This is not about being lazy. It's just you thinking you know better than the developers when you actually don't. You can only add so many classes before they start becoming homogenized. It's easier to make 13 classes feel and look different from one-another than it is to make 31 classes feel and look different one-another.


It's not a bad idea. It's a decent one. Because just as much as there would be people who won't like the changes, there are others who will like them. Even its most extreme negative example, the survival hunter, has fans.


No, the rea "greatest examples of a 'you' problem" are actually your posts and threads. Every single one of them, a big, big "you" problem you try to masquerade as a game issue.

And this isn't abut me getting bored, or you getting bored. This is about the players in general getting bored of a stale game. The human mind craves novelty, that's basic psychology. Without repeated stimuli the mind grows bored, the "new and exciting" becomes "stale and commonplace". It loses its luster. And changing classes expansion to expansion helps keep them somewhat fresh.


These forums would be so much better if you followed your own advice...

You take your arguments to extreme. It starts sound like "What if developer X would make game and I wouldn't like it? He should make new game for me!" Remember? My threads are always treated as "You play wrong game". But my demands are more reasonable than yours. Because game was more friendly in the past, so we can always treat current design as result of going wrong direction around Cata-MOP. But when game has 13 classes, 40 specs and player can't find anything interesting for him - then it's time for him to quit. How would he have played old games, that had just 3 different characters? M? It's about being spoiled, you know. 40 specs? I'm bored! More, more, MORE! New class? I don't like it! Next one! Yeah?

[Ghostile]

It's not WoW that I remember.
It's no longer a setting of war and struggle for survival, being FORCED to live in a world with opposition that you can't see eye to eye because you're different species and culture-wise, with too much unforgivable history.
Now, the entire multicultural fantasy (when I say fantasy, I mean as in, it's impossible in any logical sense, especially if you look at the real world where 1st world nations are importing 3rd world people with values that are not compatible), where different species live together in harmony, like the current year D&D, and the awful writing reflects it.

You somehow missed the faction war not making sense since WC3?

[Ielenia]

You take your arguments to extreme.

Because it's at the extremes that claims are tested. And what I wrote isn't even that extreme anyways.

It starts sound like "What if developer X would make game and I wouldn't like it? He should make new game for me!"

That is a good summary of all your threads and posts: "Blizzard should make the game for me".

My threads are always treated as "You play wrong game". But my demands are more reasonable than yours.

Excuse me? For starters, I haven't made a single demand. All I'm saying is that Blizzard should continue doing what they have always done with the classes (changing their playstyle expansion after expansion), meanwhile you are always insulting Blizzard developers in one form or another, and then say that your ideas are better than Blizzard's own ideas, when they are not (as demonstrated by basically everyone responding to your threads).

Because game was more friendly in the past, so we can always treat current design as result of going wrong direction around Cata-MOP.

The game is friendlier now, more than ever. To say that the game was "friendlier" in the past (as in, at or before Cata) is to put on the biggest and thickest rose-tinted glasses that would make Mr Magoo look like he has perfect eyesight.

How would he have played old games, that had just 3 different characters?

Those "old games" weren't live-service games. Which is why they could get away with "just three different characters".

It's about being spoiled, you know. 40 specs? I'm bored! More, more, MORE! New class? I don't like it! Next one! Yeah?

That's a strawman. My argument is literally "change how existing classes play to keep things fresh", but you're arguing against a made-up argument I never made, one that exists only in your head, where your made-up version of whoever you're arguing against is demanding more classes and more specs.

[Relapses]

Nothing I said was about semantics. Are you replying to a different thread or something?

The conversation was about whether things should be changed for the sake of change. It is not my fault that rather than follow that conversation you decided to dredge up all your usual stock lines like “it’s subjective” and “wow is an mmo whether you like it or not” and “it’s semantics”.

Like I said: never on topic, always arguing with some phantom that has nothing to do with what anyone said.

Yeah, I guess you'll have to forgive me for trying to pull the conversation back on-topic by relating your very bad analogies to arguments we've had in this very thread.

[WeAreNotSmilesTimes]

For most people here? Having to do any content, having to login into the game, anything on the store, any change Blizzard makes, any race blizzard adds, any class blizzard adds, any class change, the fact WoW still exists, the fact Blizzard still exists, any time a quest chain is more than 2 quests, any raid cinematic, any drop rate below 100%. That's just off the top of my head

[Calfredd]

Remember? My threads are always treated as "You play wrong game". But my demands are more reasonable than yours.

Your demands are actually some of the worst and really do boil down to "You play wrong game".

[WowIsDead64]

Your demands are actually some of the worst and really do boil down to "You play wrong game".

I don't want to start this discussion again. But Wow had become popular exactly because it wasn't pure MMO. Remember? One of things, that was different in Wow - questing, that was essentially solo game experience. Other games tried different formulas and nothing worked. GW2 tried "sandbox". Wildstar tried hardcore group content (due to "Bring back Vanilla/TBC" demands). But at the end what made Wow great - was ability to play at any moment, i.e. not relying on other players. Because Wow had backup content. And for some players like me that backup content was enough to stay subbed. It's Blizzards' "We don't want players to be happy via playing not as it's intended" policy, that started to ruin things for players like me.

[NineSpine]

Yeah, I guess you'll have to forgive me for trying to pull the conversation back on-topic by relating your very bad analogies to arguments we've had in this very thread.

The conversation was about how for some people it "pisses you off greatly in WoW" when they make changes for the sake of making changes, which is very much on topic. As usual, you instead made the topic about you and your meta-whining about things nobody was talking about, like "semantics" and "is wow an mmo" and "what is subjectivity".

- - - Updated - - -

I don't want to start this discussion again. But Wow had become popular exactly because it wasn't pure MMO. Remember? One of things, that was different in Wow - questing, that was essentially solo game experience. Other games tried different formulas and nothing worked. GW2 tried "sandbox". Wildstar tried hardcore group content (due to "Bring back Vanilla/TBC" demands). But at the end what made Wow great - was ability to play at any moment, i.e. not relying on other players. Because Wow had backup content. And for some players like me that backup content was enough to stay subbed. It's Blizzards' "We don't want players to be happy via playing not as it's intended" policy, that started to ruin things for players like me.

Questing exists squarely in the MMORPG framework of the original game. Almost all quests happen in the open world. GW2 is not a sandbox game. If anything it is even more solo friendly than WoW, so what you are saying just doesn't really work.

[WowIsDead64]

Questing exists squarely in the MMORPG framework of the original game. Almost all quests happen in the open world. GW2 is not a sandbox game. If anything it is even more solo friendly than WoW, so what you are saying just doesn't really work.

When I say "sandbox" - it isn't about games like Minecraft or Terraria. "Sandbox" means "free goals", i.e. not being restricted by dailies. Something like TI. GW2 isn't that bad. I don't like it's graphic style, that is more "realistic". Yeah, it's more solo friendly than Wow. It had dynamic events with shared progress long before Wow (like DF ones). But for me lack of any quest lines beyond personal story every 10 (?) levels - is way too boring gameplay. Plus that 3-button style. This is what Wow has turned into.

[Jshadowhunter]

You somehow missed the faction war not making sense since WC3?

What happened at the end of WC3 was the Horde, which Thrall led across the sea to a new land, Jaina, who took the Lorderon's survivors, and the Nelf, teaming up against the end of the world.
Meanwhile, the rest of the Alliance is on the other side of the world, and they didn't participate in the 3rd War. They still hate the Horde, as is literally shown in the Founding of Durotar, with Daelin Proudmore looking for his daughter, and then finding her on the continent with the very Horde that he's fought in 2nd war, and he went full scorched earth. All of the Human, Dwarf, and High Elf kingdoms still had reasons to hate them all after what the Horde did during 1st and 2nd Wars.

[NineSpine]

Brother, I'm not playing this boring semantic game with you for the five hundred billionth time. This is a thread called "what pisses you off about WoW" and the analogies you were providing were very obviously alluding to your personal preferences.

You should go back and read through this conversation. People were talking about how they don't like when the designers make changes just to keep things from staying the same. Other people were defending that practice as a way to keep things fresh. Then you burst in rambling about "semantics" and "subjective" and responding to phantoms who were arguing about "is wow an MMO".

Take a break, reread the conversation, and maybe you'll realize that you are just being a needlessly argumentative pedant. If it pisses someone off when the designers make a change for the sake of change, that's relevant to the thread, and it's not your job to police the topic by ironically derailing it into some bizarre conversation about whether WoW is an MMO or what the meaning of subjective opinions is.

[Relapses]

You should go back and read through this conversation. People were talking about how they don't like when the designers make changes just to keep things from staying the same. Other people were defending that practice as a way to keep things fresh. Then you burst in rambling about "semantics" and "subjective" and responding to phantoms who were arguing about "is wow an MMO".

Take a break, reread the conversation, and maybe you'll realize that you are just being a needlessly argumentative pedant. If it pisses someone off when the designers make a change for the sake of change, that's relevant to the thread, and it's not your job to police the topic by ironically derailing it into some bizarre conversation about whether WoW is an MMO or what the meaning of subjective opinions is.

The only thing bizarre here is you feeling compelled to quote the same fucking post twice. Who the fuck does that?

[NineSpine]

The only thing bizarre here is you feeling compelled to quote the same fucking post twice. Who the fuck does that?

Yeah let's talk about quote posting habits now. That's definitely on topic, as opposed to "It pisses me off when Blizzard makes changes for the sake of changes".

I swear to god, I have not seen you productively add to any discussion on here in fucking years at this point. Every god damn conversation you interject yourself into turns into some meta-analysis of the argument.

[Relapses]

Yeah let's talk about quote posting habits now. That's definitely on topic, as opposed to "It pisses me off when Blizzard makes changes for the sake of changes".

I swear to god, I have not seen you productively add to any discussion on here in fucking years at this point. Every god damn conversation you interject yourself into turns into some meta-analysis of the argument.

Cool story bro. We done here, or are you gonna find a post from 6 years ago to quote me out of context on again?

[NineSpine]

Cool story bro. We done here, or are you gonna find a post from 6 years ago to quote me out of context on again?

I'll check off "out of context" on my bingo card of random phrases you drop for no reason.

[Itisamuh]

You can watch the movie with different friends, speed up the playback, slow it down, put it through a sound or color filter, etc. Eventually, the movie will lose its luster to you. Eventually what is new will become old. What is amazing will become commonplace. It's basic psychology.

There is no need for it to be new. It just needs to be good. No class redesign is going to feel novel after playing for decades.