OMG I can't believe mythic+ has become so toxic

[Lora]

I was running a +8 stone with fortified so I was a bit cautious with pulls to see if the healer can handle it (I play tank), it was my stone btw, two dps were screaming in the chat to pull more when it was clear that the healer could not handle it at all, I tried to tell them that the healer has a hard time and in return they left mid-run.

Next run I write on description that big pullers and rage quitters should not join and I get a hunter who pulled 2-3 more packs with misdirection without my consent every room which eventually led to one wipe.

So next run I was like....you must pull more so I did, wipe on the first room, rip.

This big pull culture needs to go away, it's ultra toxic atm playing as tank.

First time tanking? Sorry bud but big pulls is the name of the game with m+

[kranur]

had a pala dd ragequit a "+2 relaxed" after he died to a "don't stand in fire" mechanic.
Core issue is people too stupid to act normal are also too stupid to respect what "relaxed" means.

Search filter should by default exclude relaxed/learning to filter out problem people.
Currently default is everything on which means anyone will sign up without caring about it.

There are even people who create groups that don't understand what "Relaxed" means. Think some think it means to be so overpowered for it that it is a relaxed super fast clear.
I've seen multiple "Relaxed" groups that require "fast", even seen a +7 require 2k+

[Glorious Leader]

The formula is built for toxic behavior. Timer + Rating + infinite scale

[Rageonit]

The formula is built for toxic behavior. Timer + Rating + infinite scale

Yes, lets delete any point of player friction from this game, so noone ever has any reason at all to be disappointed, irritated or mad at others. This way there will be no toxicity at all! Free loot for everyone and content so easy you can never fail = World of Happysmileland.

[Alroxas]

The formula is built for toxic behavior. Timer + Rating + infinite scale

Um actually, I would say the issue is anonymity of the userbase is the root problem. What are the odds that you're going to run into Bob from XYZ server again in the hundreds of thousands of players running M+?

Until you get to very specific niche segments (i.e. Ultra high keys or super odd times or regions + times) you're likely never going to see that player again so there's no real penalty to being "toxic" for those that do.

Compare that to back in the WoW's history where you couldn't group up with players cross-servers/realms and you were "stuck" with the players on your particular server.

Now if Bob was a douche on XYZ server then Bob becomes a known quantity on XYZ server and starts getting blacklisted by everyone (that matters) on XYZ server so it becomes self-policing. Bob doesn't act super toxic because that would be harmful to Bob for their future potential runs.

But with cross-server/realm tech, that's no longer the issue. So what if XYZ server knows Bob is toxic? Players ABC server/realm don't so they'll group up with Bob.



Not sure what Blizzard could really do here - strip away anonymity? Poll /ignore list across all users and find common accounts that everyone has put on ignore (presumably for bad behavior) and flag them for manual review then additional action (potentially to account suspension due to violation of ToS / player contract?). However that costs a lot of money to implement and I don't think the beancounters in charge are going to be ok with that expense.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Um actually, I would say the issue is anonymity of the userbase is the root problem. What are the odds that you're going to run into Bob from XYZ server again in the hundreds of thousands of players running M+?

Until you get to very specific niche segments (i.e. Ultra high keys or super odd times or regions + times) you're likely never going to see that player again so there's no real penalty to being "toxic" for those that do.

Compare that to back in the WoW's history where you couldn't group up with players cross-servers/realms and you were "stuck" with the players on your particular server.

Now if Bob was a douche on XYZ server then Bob becomes a known quantity on XYZ server and starts getting blacklisted by everyone (that matters) on XYZ server so it becomes self-policing. Bob doesn't act super toxic because that would be harmful to Bob for their future potential runs.

But with cross-server/realm tech, that's no longer the issue. So what if XYZ server knows Bob is toxic? Players ABC server/realm don't so they'll group up with Bob.



Not sure what Blizzard could really do here - strip away anonymity? Poll /ignore list across all users and find common accounts that everyone has put on ignore (presumably for bad behavior) and flag them for manual review then additional action (potentially to account suspension due to violation of ToS / player contract?). However that costs a lot of money to implement and I don't think the beancounters in charge are going to be ok with that expense.

While this is true in many cases it isn't totally solid. If Bob was toxic but he was one of the few paths on that server to get higher rating people would still be involved with Bob. I play both retail and classic and I can tell you even when it was more isolated jerks would get into stuff all the time if it made the run a little faster.. made the almighty color of number improve on the 3rd party website.. etc etc.. people will accept jerks if it serves a little bit of selfish behavior.

[Just Passing through]

Yes, lets delete any point of player friction from this game, so noone ever has any reason at all to be disappointed, irritated or mad at others. This way there will be no toxicity at all! Free loot for everyone and content so easy you can never fail = World of Happysmileland.

Also interesting that people yell "toxic" at all corners, yet also accuse the game to be lacking the "War" in Warcraft. But maybe they want "safe space" raiding and LFD, where everybody is unicorn and rainbows and nobody ever gets their feeling hurt, but complete "stoneage raging male hormones" behaviour of characters in game.

But most of all, I think the word "toxic" gets thrown around for every little bit of "hurt" that happens. "Uh, bedtime at 11 pm - my parents are so toxic"...."Uh - I was told to pull more...so toxic". "A disagreement in my guild - they are all so toxic"

[czarek]

Yeah whole mythic+ is toxic because you had one bad run. Very highly reliable scale.

[Twdft]

Yeah whole mythic+ is toxic because you had one bad run. Very highly reliable scale.

If you I pug 20 keys a week and encounter a jerk you put them on ignore and move on with your day. If you do only 2 dungeons per week one asshole can ruin your week.

People complaining about toxicity should note how many keys they do and in how many of that they encounter toxic players.

[Ehrenpanzer]

I was running a +8 stone with fortified so I was a bit cautious with pulls to see if the healer can handle it (I play tank), it was my stone btw, two dps were screaming in the chat to pull more when it was clear that the healer could not handle it at all, I tried to tell them that the healer has a hard time and in return they left mid-run.

Next run I write on description that big pullers and rage quitters should not join and I get a hunter who pulled 2-3 more packs with misdirection without my consent every room which eventually led to one wipe.

So next run I was like....you must pull more so I did, wipe on the first room, rip.

This big pull culture needs to go away, it's ultra toxic atm playing as tank.

.......become toxic? My man, pugging keys, ESPECIALLY as a tank has been a toxic experience since the first day they put it in.... the higher the keys, the more toxic and sweatlordy the groups tend to become. There are exceptions of course, but those are the general rules since Day 1.

[czarek]

If you I pug 20 keys a week and encounter a jerk you put them on ignore and move on with your day. If you do only 2 dungeons per week one asshole can ruin your week.

People complaining about toxicity should note how many keys they do and in how many of that they encounter toxic players.

Im puging m+ since SL. Ofc sometimes i meet with douche but very very rarely. In midnight i met reminderable one so far. Im doin at least KSM every season. I would say m+ good behavior has grown up over the years.