Twin Eredar, TTR Arena Battle, Warlocks in WotLK

[Smith]

Read again, goober... Kalgan said that they were thinking about giving them this spell so that the developers no longer have to rely on Warlocks having a ton of stamina for survivability.

So in other words, the lock's tradeoff for this spell will be less stamina.

Was I the only person who didnt read that? Youre responding to the other suppositions in the thread and not what Kalgan actually said. They are trying to get away from balancing locks around drain tanking. Sounds like a bit of a class overhaul to me. I don't mean to be a nonce, as this may include a massive Stam reduction but that isn't mentioned in the blue post. No need for name calling.

[calixstus]

Read again, goober... Kalgan said that they were thinking about giving them this spell so that the developers no longer have to rely on Warlocks having a ton of stamina for survivability.

So in other words, the lock's tradeoff for this spell will be less stamina.

double goober on you!
i read it again, dont see any suggestion of nerf to stam...
it kinda reminds me of the old Shadow Step spell that necro's had in EQ, only instead of random to a static spot required for certain spells/abilities. could be interesting, but seriously, INC PVP QQ!

[Fektoer]

goody... new skills. when do holy pala's get a new skill? :'(

[Flubbie]

and Shadow priest are strong against meele, great, buff lock more
screw shadow.......

[schmich]

As if they'll ever try to balance things...in any case, they'll be at least 1 expansion too late.

[Tekno]

whatever happened to classes having counter classes?
"melee seem to be doing too well against warlocks drain-tank-killing them...so we're thinking about giving warlocks a form of teleport." ok.. Don't bullshit me either, i've seen plenty of warriors die to warlocks drain tanking because pummel is on CD.

majority of mages are going to flame this idea mainly because warlocks are (potentially) getting our class defining defensive spell...more so, the version of the spell from Beta that was deemed OP and changed to its current form. all the while, we've been asking to have it changed back because its bugged as hell.

[Flubbie]

many class, many builds, I don't think that is even possible balance it.

[ampas]

thinking about defense improve at warlocks -> shadowp will probably stay a fringe group forever, seems like blizz isn't interested in them anymore

give us the best ideas for the majority and let the minority die -> reroll, kkthxbye

[Darkblaze]

Making warloks More defensive, arnt they already hard to kill? Hrm means they have no anti class as they pwn casters and that means melle cant get them if they port off....

[Kitren]

Mmmm.... a big purple glowy circle on the ground? Why I do believe I will just sit here in stealth and wait for a panicing warlock to appear in front of me. CS-HEMO- HEMO-KS.

Doh! Where did that pesky warlock get to??? Oh, duh.. to his big glowy circle on the floor... CHARGE!

[Thaendra]

Wow. Warlocks need a buff. HA. A change? Perhaps, like a tradeoff for some more defensive capabilities. I'd be careful with that though - their changes to shamans (which were reverted) make me honestly wonder about how they balance classes. You warlocks better be careful what you wish for, they might take away your STA and stick an MS debuff on Soulfire and call it even :P What I find hilarious is that they were just trying to nerf warlocks, but due to the massive rivers of tears overflowing the warlock community, it was reverted. Well, okay, we can live with that. But let's just take a look again at what a BLUE posted. As a reminder, 100% is supposed to be the "expected amount". I omitted the healing classes for ease of reading and because their "problems" seem to lie with the original DPS classes.
2200+ rating:
2v2 3v3 5v5
Hunter 43.0% 50.2% 43.0%
Mage 8.7% 96.0% 96.0%
Rogue 144.2% 175.1% 61.8%
Warlock 149.2% 93.2% 111.9%
Warrior 130.4% 90.7% 79.3%

1850 rating:
Hunter 50.2% 50.2% 50.2%
Mage 61.1% 87.3% 87.3%
Rogue 154.5% 154.5% 82.4%
Warlock 121.2% 102.5% 102.5%
Warrior 90.7% 85.0% 85.0%

In every single category in 1850, Warlocks are above 100% representation. In 2200+, they are above 100% representation in 2v2 and 5v5, with a 93% representation in 3v3. Not bad. Okay so, let's compare... Warlocks are represented more than Hunters straight out across the board. They are represented more than warriors in every single category in both rating brackets (the class that is supposedly causing them so many problems that the warlock class needs an "overhaul"). Rogues are better represented than warlocks in all of the categories except for 5v5. Alright, this is the supposed "warlock counter" class. There is one, according to those numbers. That seems reasonable. I understand that it can be "hard to play a warlock" with things beating on you, but from what I've been shown, apparently there are ways to overcome that, and people have taken advantage of them. The last time my Battlegroup's 2v2 Ladder was accurate (some teams are being held by single players with 1500 p. rating these days), warlock/druid dominated the top 10 spots: they were 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 7th. Only one Warrior/druid team managed to beat them all out for 1st. The other warrior/druid teams took 8th and 9th. Sorry for the long post, but it baffles me why Blizzard goes to the trouble to compile those statistics when they don't even take them into consideration.

[Tekno]

Deathknights just may be their WotLK counter class...theres no telling right now though.

my opinion still stands though, giving warlocks a means of gaining the upperhand on their counter is rediculous.

[El_Vaughn]

rock, paper, scissors, mage, warlock

awesome \o/

[Ahura]

In every single category in 1850, Warlocks are above 100% representation. In 2200+, they are above 100% representation in 2v2 and 5v5, with a 93% representation in 3v3. Not bad. Okay so, let's compare... Warlocks are represented more than Hunters straight out across the board. They are represented more than warriors in every single category in both rating brackets (the class that is supposedly causing them so many problems that the warlock class needs an "overhaul"). Rogues are better represented than warlocks in all of the categories except for 5v5. Alright, this is the supposed "warlock counter" class. There is one, according to those numbers. That seems reasonable. I understand that it can be "hard to play a warlock" with things beating on you, but from what I've been shown, apparently there are ways to overcome that, and people have taken advantage of them. The last time my Battlegroup's 2v2 Ladder was accurate (some teams are being held by single players with 1500 p. rating these days), warlock/druid dominated the top 10 spots: they were 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 7th. Only one Warrior/druid team managed to beat them all out for 1st. The other warrior/druid teams took 8th and 9th. Sorry for the long post, but it baffles me why Blizzard goes to the trouble to compile those statistics when they don't even take them into consideration.

It's not about classes being represented or not. This isn't a buff so to speak. It just gives warlocks a means to create some distance between them and the melee enemy. You obviously haven't played a warlock, otherwise you would know what this is about. This ability, if implemented, addresses one of the core issues of a class heavily based on a CC that has been nerfed to oblivion: Fear. The whole class is balanced based on the assumption that the warlock's target is CC'd a good chunk of the fight. But as you probably know Fear has been pretty much nerfed every single patch. Also, all classes that give warlocks trouble already have very good Fear protection (warriors, rogues and hunters). Add to that a plethora of items and abilities that break Fear and you have a very broken class...

Currently for a warlock to be effective in higher brackets they have to spec SL/SL. Again, if you have played a warlock you would know it's one of the most boring and repetitive playstyles of any class/spec, which also doesn't necessarily take the highest skill. Personally, I quit PvPing on my warlock (which used to be my PvP main) because I didn't enjoy the 'DoT n' Drain' routines. I think it's pointless and boring. All Blizzard is doing is addressing this issue. If you want to count this as a 'buff' you can be sure they're going to 'nerf' warlocks by cutting back on their stamina or damage, or possibly even their damage mitigation. The whole point of this change is so that warlocks won't have to stack 14k hp to be even relevant.

[Deleted]

You guys whining about op'ed warlocks are all retarded and have never played a warlock. Sure, those SL-SL noobs are overpowered, I fully give you that. But any, and I mean ANY, other build that it is raid-able with (I would kick every SL-SL lock from my raid instantly b/c I assume they do not have skill at all) leaves you like a sitting duck to all melee classes.

I'm mainly a PvE fan but do PvP at times to have something else to spend my time on. And believe me, whenever I hear that 'cluck' sound of a rogue stunning me, i can go afk, because he will keep me stunned for 80% of my 12k life (with around 200 resil) and then take down my remaining 20% while having cloak of lol on.

With a warri it is better because it doesn't take as long. but more or less with the same effect. Charge-stun-deathcoil-charge-stun-insane white dmg (even non-crits). I'm dead.

Everybody hates locks because there is ONE out of the 5, 6 or 7 possible builds that is overpowered and all the noobs are using it.

Play a destro warlock in pvp or stop bitching.

[Gebbatron]

its not only locks being OP in pvp, (btw whoever said hunters can get out of fear thats only BM hunters, the other 60% of us non noob MM/surv players cant do anything about it) but there are 2 locks in my guild (BT/hyjal on farm) who dominate the damage meters every night unless one of them has to resist tank illidan or something, honestly explain to me that... Top damage in PvE and over 100% representation in all arena brackets.

[Wildhorn]

Why some items are powered by wowhead while the last are not? I am too lazy to click!

[Thrudnir]

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...o=15&sid=1#280

Apologies that this update is coming so late but we pulled the Essence of Immortal quest chain about 2 weeks ago. That's why you haven't seen it on the Public Test Realm. The 3 gates will open automatically over time at equal intervals on all servers.

Regarding the taking back of the town on the Isle, however, that will still be dependent on completion of daily quests. Servers can race to see who can open their quest hub the fastest. But access to raid bosses has been made equal.

We really like the concept of cross-server competition. But the concept of the gates being tied to specific boss kills was not playing out as we had hoped. We plan to do future things that involve servers competing with one another through major events.

[tarrant972]

I'm just trying to figure out how people can complain when all we are getting is information on a possible change to one class. An addition that will sit side-by-side with all the other new talents and skills that getting to level 80 will give every class. Class "X" at 80 will likely be very different from class "X" at 70.

[Thaendra]

It's not about classes being represented or not. This isn't a buff so to speak. It just gives warlocks a means to create some distance between them and the melee enemy. You obviously haven't played a warlock, otherwise you would know what this is about. This ability, if implemented, addresses one of the core issues of a class heavily based on a CC that has been nerfed to oblivion: Fear. The whole class is balanced based on the assumption that the warlock's target is CC'd a good chunk of the fight. But as you probably know Fear has been pretty much nerfed every single patch. Also, all classes that give warlocks trouble already have very good Fear protection (warriors, rogues and hunters). Add to that a plethora of items and abilities that break Fear and you have a very broken class...

Currently for a warlock to be effective in higher brackets they have to spec SL/SL. Again, if you have played a warlock you would know it's one of the most boring and repetitive playstyles of any class/spec, which also doesn't necessarily take the highest skill. Personally, I quit PvPing on my warlock (which used to be my PvP main) because I didn't enjoy the 'DoT n' Drain' routines. I think it's pointless and boring. All Blizzard is doing is addressing this issue. If you want to count this as a 'buff' you can be sure they're going to 'nerf' warlocks by cutting back on their stamina or damage, or possibly even their damage mitigation. The whole point of this change is so that warlocks won't have to stack 14k hp to be even relevant.

Actually, I know sorely how bad fear has been nerfed - my main is a priest. I am saying all of these things with the mindset that fear is cast once every 30 seconds (trust me, I've had my share of fun experiences - to do 5v5 and get 3 "immune" messages and 1 resist in a single spell... WotF is a nightmare sometimes!) My fear is once every 30 seconds, 26 with talents. That is my one fear. Complaining about having to be one spec is 100% selfish and pointless - all priests must be disc to be "good", all warriors must be MS, all mages must be frost. Almost EVERY class has to deal with that "one boring spec" that is repetitive in order to compete seriously. Until they change that for EVERY class, it's not unfair for one class to join the rest on that boat. Also, you omitted the first part of my quote where I said "Warlocks need a buff. HA. A change? Perhaps, like a tradeoff for some more defensive capabilities." .