Now I understand why pures hate hybrids

[Clueless]

Pures don't hate hybrids, they hate what blizzard has done to appease the whiney masses that play hybrids. Hybrids have their roles: They are there to fill a hole that can't be filled by a pure class. They're the gray area. They can perform multiple job roles relatively easily. The penalty for that versatility is they can't do any one role well.

That didn't sit well with them, so they wanted more. Shamans want to DPS like rogues and mages. Druids want to tank and heal like warriors and priests. Paladins want to heal like a priest, tank like a warrior, and dps like a rogue. Sorry, something has to give. The pures are being eclipsed by hybrids that can do 1 job extremely well, but at the same time provide a secondary ( and maybe even a tertiary ) role at diminished capacity.

When a druid can dps like a mage, pop a heal when needs be, and go into bear when he pulls aggro and survive until the tank gets aggro, why bring the mage? The mage has been turned into a vending machine.

When a ret pally can bring rogue dps ( and they will in 3.0 ), slap on a shield and tank if needs be, can buff, manage threat, etc. Why bring a rogue or dps warrior?

When a shaman can dps better than a mage, can be about equal to a rogue, and can heal better than a priest, and offer raid wide buffs at the same time. why bring a mage, rogue, or priest?

You see what i'm getting at. Hybrids have gained so much they can easily take the job of several other classes. In most cases they may not do them as efficiently, but in some they can do them better.

Hybrids as a playstyle are fucked up, we have to spec into a PURE role to be viable at all. READ THIS NEXT BIT CAREFULLY, we.....cannot......perform.....non-specced.....roles.......as.....well.....as......a......pure......spec. Which means that if we spec ret we cannot heal as well as a pure healer, nor tank as well as a pure tank. I rolled a pally to be able to play as a hybrid, doing bits of everything , but it was soooo under-par as to be ridiculous, forcing me to spec into a pure role to be even remotely useful :S. Druids as a hybrid at least performed their hybrid role decently enough during the early levels but as you gain in levels ur hybrid abilities become more and more crappy, again forcing you to spec a PURE role to be remotely useful. I have invested too much time in my characters to re-roll as some ppl try to tell me.

[Varithorn1]

true but he will boost the tank 's threat alot if the tank is aware of it and takes advantage of it

Problem is, this utility is a poor one, because even on a straight out nuke fight (Patchwerk) the dps who's highest on threat is aroud 30-40%.

[Spots]

When a druid can dps like a mage, pop a heal when needs be, and go into bear when he pulls aggro and survive until the tank gets aggro, why bring the mage? The mage has been turned into a vending machine.

DPS like a mage, why not? I did specc for it. I did tailor my gear for it.

Pop a heal. Well at that moment I won't be DPS'ing like a mage now would I? So my DPS would be lower then a mage. Isn't that what you want?

Sorry to bust your bubble, but when a moonkin pulls aggro he'll die just like any other clothy. Should he go to bear or not. A mage can still iceblock. The druid will die. Oooh the fun of raiding without aggro reduction. Something you cannot comprehend.

I applaud this change. For now I can go: Moonkin LFG SH HC and actually expect getting invites.

Do you have any idea how much 'fun' it is to play a hybrid? No, so shut yer trap.

If yer only worried about yer raidspot, well if ya got friends then getting into raids won't be a problem now will it? It'll only be a problem if yer a guildhopper in seek of those purple pixels.

[Realmadrid]

If yer only worried about yer raidspot, well if ya got friends then getting into raids won't be a problem now will it? It'll only be a problem if yer a guildhopper in seek of those purple pixels.

I laughed at this, do you really think you can get a raid spot because the Raid leader is your friend?
As for every endgame guild you want to progress, which means invite the people who are needed for the raid, not the people who are 'best friends with' the raid leader..

[Pooti]

I laughed at this, do you really think you can get a raid spot because the Raid leader is your friend?
As for every endgame guild you want to progress, which means invite the people who are needed for the raid, not the people who are 'best friends with' the raid leader..

I wonder if you read blue posts...
Blizz stated that thier intentions when blending classes raid utility and removing unique buffs was so that you can play with who you choose, not the person that has the class you need. That doesnt mean that the crappy player in blues is getting a raid spot because he is friends in RL with the raid leader, it just means that you DONT have to sit the mage who you have played with since MC because you need a shadow preists mana regen. I can also say, that I have yet to see a boomkin, enhance shaman or shadow preist stop doing thier thing to heal. Without the proper spec the 2k heal they cast that costs them WAY too much mana wont save the day.

[Spots]

I laughed at this, do you really think you can get a raid spot because the Raid leader is your friend?
As for every endgame guild you want to progress, which means invite the people who are needed for the raid, not the people who are 'best friends with' the raid leader..

This is what Blizzard wanted. To play with who you want, no matter their specc/class. In stead of being forced to take on players you don't know cause they have the required class.

And for the record: Actually yes I do.
I'm a moonkin. There is absolutely no reason to bring me to raids. Innervate is covered by other druids, we have 4 SS and 2-3 rebirths, my DPS sux and a shaman/SP will buff my grp more ten I could possibly hope. On top of that I don't have an oh shit button. If I pull aggro priests curse at me. The only reason I'm able to raid is cause the RL likes me. Not because I'm 'needed' for the raid.

'Same with any raid group - you dont only bring a moonkin for the +crit aura / casting.
You bring the thing for moral support.'
I read that somewhere and you have no idea how true that is.

I'm inclined to think you are one of them sad sad 'pure' classes. Who think the only reason to bring them is cause they are 'needed'. I feel sorry for you. Playing a social game without the social part.

[SilverLynx]

Yet another post whining about "pure" versus "hybrid" classes in PVE.

Here's the real scoop. For serious.

As *any* class, in order to be effective, you need a substantial amount of gear. This is gear that doesn't always drop, that you don't always have good luck with on rolls, that you need to get gemmed and enchanted (often with very expensive mats).

In order to fully gear out say, a rogue, you might (and that's ONLY might) need two sets of gear for PVE. And that's only if you wanted to mess with a combat non-dagger spec (relying heavily on AP) versus mut (relying heavily on crit). In most cases, you'd probably be wearing the same gear.

In order to fully gear out a Druid, you would need (at the very least) 5 sets of gear. One for Bear. One for Cat. One for Moonkin. One for Resto. One for Tree-Resto (which is a totally different type of healer). Very little of that gear, even with the recent spellpower change, would be used in the other specs.

What does this mean? It means that what people are crying about (You can pewpew, while you mewmew and fix my booboo) requires your average druid to play 5 times MORE than your average rogue. Plus, as they are collecting off-spec gear, they'll be taking a HUGE amount of flack from everyone for constantly rolling on things they "aren't going to use".

And no, no guild will be progressing slowly enough (unless they REALLY stink) to allow you to collect 5 sets of gear while they progress. They will expect you to choose ONE role, and to stick to it (allowing you to maybe passively roll on things that would be sharded for a single offspec).

That was what Blizzard discovered in TBC by letting the Hybrids out of their cage. So now they're perfecting it. They're finally letting all of the Hybrid specs off the leash. You can be anything you want without it being laughable.

You're just going to have to play an abnormal amount if you want to be perfect at everything. And no one, not even the best players, will want to put up that much effort - especially if the other roles are covered.

Now please stop crying about this.

(For the record, I've raided as a Rogue and as a Pally)

[Spots]

Not reading through this whole thread but...

Removing Blessing of Salvation and adding these new abilities = player has to pay attention more to how they play. Basically, they are making the game more about your skill instead of using crutches.

Even with Salvation I can pull aggro of most tanks. Thats part of being Moonkin. Real aggro management. No ice block, soulshatter, vanish, FD. Knowing the tank, knowing the fight, knowing your limits and pushing them further and further.

But anyways with the new talents I couldn't get over 40% aggro even if I tried.........