Holy Paladin - where are now the QQ...

[Offhand]

News flash - You don't bring three holy paladins to a raid to cover for paladin buffs anymore.

[Aloysius]

Actually, I find it more enjoyable to bring 4 for Illidan so I can top the healing charts with BoL up :P

[Sephirote]

Holy paladins are NOT fine, every decent pve raider will agree with this.

Not gonna go into details but heres an analysis of the current state of the Holy palas:
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...00037&sid=2000

Sure the change to DP is a step in the right direction, but the iol nerf simply destroyed the holy tree, that already were weak...

Bump again for that link !!! i took the time to read it and even if I'm Tankadin I fucking hate that holy pally be so broken

[Ilara]

Need more bacon

[Paladin885]

I personally would like to see an improvement with paladins because in all T5 and T6 content i am being out classed by the other healer classes. Its kinda annoying being a single target healing class but it is very loveable as well(fun to play but not fun to play with the other healer classes who get more praise).

I like my paladins gear and being able to spam flash a tank for 3k+ ever 1.4-1.5 seconds and remain doing so until the boss fight is over. What I dont like is seeing the other classes doing the same but being able to add to that and heal 5-10+ other targets.

As much as I want blizz to keep class uniqueness (lol@me rite?) I cant avoid thinking that HoTs or AoE heals would help the paladin class : /

[Offhand]

Bump again for that link !!! i took the time to read it and even if I'm Tankadin I fucking hate that holy pally be so broken

I don't think it's really broken. I think that the niche aspect of the holy paladin is being played up a bit too much. Yes, holy paladins are good tank healers but all other healers can do passably well tanking healing. On the flipside, when it comes to comes to raid healing, holy really sucks and the other 3 are great. The fact that pretty much every nerf to holy paladin healing has actually been a switcharound or change with something in the ret tree during the Wrath beta is a pretty bad sign.

[Sephirote]

Well honestly even on 5 men holy pally have hard time if the CC are not good enought or the dungeon is not like it should be

Did u already try to heal in HMGT !! Honestly this dungeon suck a lot for holy pally and yeah when u arrive at 25mrn T5 and T6 the other Healing class beat holy pally !! one of my holy pally in my guild is rating to be in Sunwell plateau on '' be imba '' and top sunwell and the other class or buttom sunwell but they beat that holy pally so well in healing that is not making sense!!!

[Sephirote]

well what they should really do is put the game on two side , PVE and PVP

Poeple are QQing that Holy pally are OP in PVP and people are QQing that Holy pally are BROKEN in PVE honestly with the top 20 3v3,5v5 in PVP with no Holy pally show that is wrong and with T6 content that show that Pally Holy get own in PVE show that it'S true!

Maybe they could design the game for PVE cause If I'm looking for some PVP I will go play Warhammer online I will not play World of warcraft!

if they want to compete with war hammer byt not penalizing PVE player they could just make two talent tree's u make one for PVP and one for PVE, ok waht I mean is that when u go do arena or BG u get on the tree that u build for PVP , they can arrange that in the login screen, so it's switch u to your PVP tree's just by entering the BG or the arena, I'm just trowing idea here!

The big point I want to make is that I dont call Holy pally are QQing they just show the truth over here and it's not really nice with PVE pally that try to compete for a raiding spot! some holy pally geared from Sunwell get owned buy the other healing class geared from BT IS IT NORMAL!!!!

[Bainz]

That's a pretty cool Sig you got there.

[Sephirote]

thx =) Photoshop CS2 FTW!!!

[Rhozul]

I feel inclined to wait until I can see the changes in action myself before making any judgments on them. In theory, things look good, but at the same time I'm not sure how I take it that our Glyphs are supposed to solve Holy's issues. That seems like a lame fix to me and if Blizzard has to add new abilities baseline to make us competitive, then they should go for it.

[Sephirote]

Nice sig too Rozhul!!

Well we cant denied that in TBC T6 content holy pally get owned ! so they have to change something for sure

[Firecrest]

I juat want a mid level heal to replace my downranked HL. Something between HL and FoL. That's all.

[Sephirote]

Alrihgt quick question like that!

with the new glyph of flash of light : reduce heal done per 50% but put an HoT of 140% on the target

Do holypally will still being able to spam their flash of light on the MT ???
I mean if their healing is reduce by 50% and they are suppose to be a MT healer the MT will get 50% less heal o.O

if anyone know it please explain cause I'm kinda lost over here lol

[Jiai]

Do holypally will still being able to spam their flash of light on the MT ???
I mean if their healing is reduce by 50% and they are suppose to be a MT healer the MT will get 50% less heal o.O

Well you say it yourself, if you want to spam Flash of Light on someone, you don't use the FoL glyph.

[Sephirote]

ok I'm noob with glyph : Do the glyph work like a spell that u have to active or when u got it on you it's passive ???

[Durygos]

ok I'm noob with glyph : Do the glyph work like a spell that u have to active or when u got it on you it's passive ???

There's a glyph tab at the bottom of your spellbook. Clicking on this tab brings you to a page with 6 glowing sockets, 3 of which can contain a major glyph and 3 that can contain a minor glyph. High level scribes have a 4th major glyph slot.

[Sephirote]

There's a glyph tab at the bottom of your spellbook. Clicking on this tab brings you to a page with 6 glowing sockets, 3 of which can contain a major glyph and 3 that can contain a minor glyph. High level scribes have a 4th major glyph slot.

Ok! so it's passive or castable ???

[masticore1984]

on a different subject, what is lay on hands, new mana cost? i have heard that it costs nothing, just want a confirmation.

[tjanson]

Lay on Hands indeed costs nothing... which does now make it at least usable in raids. I think whoever stated that paladins were given these grand, completely overpowered, but not very practical abilities, causing balance issues throughout the entire development of the class, hit the nail right on the head.

The problem with Holy only really manifests itself when there's massive aoe damage being applied to the raid. Our single target healing IS quite good. As long as tanks are getting smacked for a whole crapload of damage you'll always see a holy paladin or two, simply because we really can heal forever and ever and ever(especially with the changes to Divine Plea). I think the issue that many paladins have is just... there's really nothing you bring to a raid that can't be filled by another class, and the other classes as a WHOLE(note I didn't say in every area, cause we do shine in certain types of fights) are just better healers, with more tools at their disposal. For example, you could realistically compose a healing corps entirely of Shamans or Druids or Priests. You can't say that about Paladins.

The other issue is that instead of changing the way paladins heal, or giving them an extra heal(or even something really cool like Sheath of Light - I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE LOGIC THERE) they gave us... 30 yard judgements(cause holy paladins have so much downtime while healing that they needed to give us something to do : ) and haste? I mean don't get me wrong, haste is nice, but it still doesn't heal a bunch of people at one time. And every other healing class has the ability to AOE heal to some degree. They've said they gave Druids an AOE heal because it was something that they lacked... what the fuck? At least Druids could keep up hots on multiple targets and they DID have an AOE heal in Tranquillity, but obviously it wasn't really practical to use because of the cooldown, much like LoH. Still was a very nice OH SHIT button though. I will say that resto druids did have almost as bad of a time as we did in Sunwell, and I was glad to see them given more abilities in that area. :P

All this is largely moot, of course. There will still be holy paladins in raids in WotLK because lets face it... there's a whole bunch of em. And healing isn't something a lot of people want to do. A lot of people really like the image and playstyle of a holy paladin. It's pretty simple and direct, and it's not hard to learn the basics. I personally really enjoy playing my paladin, and I've gotten as furious as I'm sure some of you have about the "OMG I KANT EVEN HEEL MAGISTERS TERRACE OMG" bullshit that so many bads spew daily. But if you've ever healed as a holy paladin in Sunwell, you'll understand why even the best players feel somewhat neglected by developers. I honestly don't think they see what the problem is.

And PvP... don't get me started. Let's just say that on my server, there's at this time only one paladin of any spec that has his S4 shoulders. And he's not even on my faction. Hand of Sacrifice basically made the most CCable class in the game even more so, and the Infusion of Light nerf... I'm not holding my breath for Holy's chances in PvP.