thoughts on the holy 51 pointer...?

[greenmasheen]

i havnt really used it a LOT, but so far in 5 mans its basically pretty worthless.

i have to say though that the other talents in holy are very nice. serendipity is nice, imp holy concentration is ok in the fact that you get more chance to CC, but it sucks that its really situational. twin disciplines in disc is nice for your prayer of mending, circle of healing, and renew.

desperate prayer is meh because its a nice heal that is instant, but it costs like a ton of mana.

test of faith is kind of a loser talent because you should have everyone topped off... and so far its not been too hard for me to do that in the current instance content *i am currently 76*

i know circle of healing is probably going to get the nerf bat which is really retarded, but if they do they need to give us a 51 point talent worth having.

[Ordin]

The 51 point talent is an OH SH*T button. It's like a better version of pain suppression. Until you get into instances where a tank could potentially die from taking huge hits it isn't going to seem useful.

Healing the 70-79 instances has been a joke so far, so I would reserve judgment of any healing talents until you actually have to heal through difficult encounters.

Most of the instances I've done so far can be healed with leader of the pack + vamp embrace + art of war. Bringing a dedicated healer to a non-heroic 5 man just slows things down.

[mutantboy]

Respec Disc if you want to be a healer and rethink your options when you get to harder content.

As a disc healer I NEVER pick up 4 stacks of biscuits when a table is dropped now. As holy I needed to and drink every single break I could. (Mind you I did tend to spam CoH too much because it was easy mode) Paying for my own drinks would have sent me to the poorhouse! :P

Now I grab one stack of biscuits and after several instance runs have 1/2 left. I think the only times I go under 1/3 mana is when someone over pulls and we have to clear 8-10 mobs. But normally I am regenning mana so quickly by the last kill I am over 2/3 again.

And 51pt talent - OMFG I LOVE Penance. I love it more than CoH or any other heal spell I have ever used.

Pom the tank, hit renew, Penance when damaged, keep an eye out for spikes and make sure you can sheild yourself without losing focus so your G/heal is hasted

And quite good at killing stuff too :P

[dionadar]

"As holy I needed to and drink every single break I could."

I just healed 3 lvl 80 instances as a deep holy lvl 75 (14/52/0), we had nobody above lvl 77 - and I used 10 biscuits total. Dunno what you are doing with your mana...

Oh, and the only time I got innervated was after I needed a battleres... sometimes I do feel squishy -.-

Guardian Spirit was kind of helpful oftentimes (our lvl 75 paladin switched tanking with a 77 feral, so there was quite a bit of dps incoming partially)

[derevka]

Honestly, I've found it somewhat enjoyable.

I did Heroic Halls of Stone last night, and it was nice to just toss it on the tank when the boss was at 15% or so to have a "just in case". Chaining it with a shield wall is a great buffer towards the end of a boss encounter.

[Kelesti]

As a Holy Priest, I've found myself not having to drink since 2.2's SSC (good job Lurker Trinket! )
Discipline as of 3.0 makes me keep about 10 water a day if I use my cooldowns constantly (Blood Elf to boot). Holy would less so because I'd actually gem/enchant spirit and get free casts too >.>

Guardian Spirit is an AMAZING utility.

One thing I wanna see though:

Tank with Tree of Life aura/Imp Devo Aura, Amplify Magic, Guardian Spirit, getting a max rank auto-crit Holy Light with Wings. What's those numbers gonna look like?

[antidan]

Its worth 1 Point. That I am sure of. And holy has so many good talents putting in 50 for endgame wont be hard.

[rikken]

One thing I wanna see though:

Tank with Tree of Life aura/Imp Devo Aura, Amplify Magic, Guardian Spirit, getting a max rank auto-crit Holy Light with Wings. What's those numbers gonna look like?[/color]

26k is my highest gheal so far. Lock with demon armor, guardian spirit, trinket, hyjal ring, inner focus. =p

[Discnia]

Wait until you get into Heroics. Guardian spirit saves lives, feels awesome, and is a lot of fun. You might not believe me now, but after your first 20,000+ Gheal, you will.

[Wyndrunner]

Also being a holy priest, I must say I love the talent. I can't figure why people are going oom so fast, or why anybody wouldn't like this talent, unless theyre only running lvl 75 instances at lvl 80. Theres been a handful of times where there's just way too much dmg being passed around, and not being able to keep PoM floating around. It really gives you a bit of leeway in regards to tank healing. Plus, it's not like it's 5 points or anything, and even if it were, I'd still probably get it.

[Leprodigy]

Respec, Disc is awesome for 5 mans, and I too looooooooove pennance, I wanna stay disc at 80 now and MT heal.

Other than that I think that the idea behind holy is to raid heal, disc being more for 5 mans etc.

Either way havent tried holy yet, ill give it a go at 80 but im not too impressed by the 51 pointer.

[Skurp]

i questioned if guardian spirit was wroth the points at first but after doing several heroics and 25 man naxx, i realized that it is an amazingly helpful talent. the fact that it only has a 3 min CD makes it def wroth getting.

as far as having mana issues... you def are not gearing yourself right if you have any sort of mana issues or you are just spamming coh too much. pick up as much spirit as you can and items with mp5

[destro]

I find guardian spirit to be a lot more useful than I originally thought. It comes in handy when there is high dmg incoming to multiple people and you need to concentrate on the tank or to keep the tank alive when you've gone oom. It's basically a 10 second soul stone that returns the tank with half their half health and more importantly, they retain their aggro.

Desperate prayer is your personal survival button in an emergency. I think test of faith will be more useful during end game raids than in 5 mans, so as someone who is there for raiding I think it maybe worthwhile. I'm currently looking at this talent build:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?prie...h=000000000000
I have been debating whether to take out test of faith and put two points in renew and get the renew glyph. With prenaxx gear at 80, renew should be ticking for 1500+ which is pretty tasty.

[derevka]

Prot pally got a 70k LOH Crit, with GS up.

[rikken]

Atm i'm having mana issues, not horrible ones, but I have to watch it much more closely. Patchwerk is really the only fight where i go oom (without any replenishment buff) Single healing one tank, while the other two healers heal the other one.
This is because of the change to the way spirit works, that int is actually valued as high if not higher than spirit. Guardian spirit is amazing for the fact that is gives you a solid 10 seconds of regen. Pop it on the tank and just let him sit, he can't die. Take that time to channel hymn of hope and thats easily 3k mana, follow that with a inner focus and you can squeeze an extra 5-10 seconds of regen. This doesnt have to only be a situational button(even though i mentioned patchwerk, do not ever let the tank sit with this and try and regen, the hatefuls will one shot your melee).

I love this talent.

[meowmeow]

As a Holy Priest, I've found myself not having to drink since 2.2's SSC (good job Lurker Trinket! )
Discipline as of 3.0 makes me keep about 10 water a day if I use my cooldowns constantly (Blood Elf to boot). Holy would less so because I'd actually gem/enchant spirit and get free casts too >.>

Guardian Spirit is an AMAZING utility.

One thing I wanna see though:

Tank with Tree of Life aura/Imp Devo Aura, Amplify Magic, Guardian Spirit, getting a max rank auto-crit Holy Light with Wings. What's those numbers gonna look like?

troll ...

i am level 80, i have a resto druid and a holy priest both level 80. my main is a druid now, since well they are more verstile the priests so i simpley play my druid more.

i have managed to heal with my priest 10m nax as holy, 25m nax as holy, 10m malygos as holy, osidian 10m as disc. i've done all the heroics as discipline and holy (several times, 132 badges on my priest).

here are real words: holy is much more harder to play then disci.
disci is valiable for pve without penance if you take divine fury and use greater heal instead, all you need to make disci pve vailable is rapture (i am saying this after i checked by changing my spec paying over 500g just to see if disci is go go for pve without penance, and wanted ofc to see how it is with).
you need to be stupid if you need to drink as disci. i didn't go below 80% mana if i healed effectively. since it was only a heroic, i healed 96% effective (good thing we play with a meter) and i didn't drink once, in any instance, any heroic or any situation as a discipline. perhaps penance makes it too easy but you really don't need a mana bar if you understand how to play disci. if you do lose mana and go oom fast your dumb l2p.

as holy the situation is totaly different: when you actually heal effectively your mana goes down really fast, as holy you need to drink alot in heroics which sucks ass (donno what dream fanatsy your on, i doubt you had better gear then i did at lvl 70 simpley cause sw was on farm for me for 4 months and i basically had all my loot from sw, and by now i'm already almost fully epic with level 80 gear, most from nax 25). even when i see the holy from another char, every pack he needs the mana. serendipity might not be that amazing as was intended, perhaps a change to "base cost of mana" might help allowing the priest to gain mana from clearcasting procs. or perhaps adding to serendipity AE heals to benifit the mana abit.

the main problem i have with holy is the ability to heal, druids just win when it comes to the mana, and just cause they are druids (well done blizz). When comes the part where i don't MT heal but raid heal and use circle, prayer of healing or binding heal my mana just drops low, serendipity doesn't effect my "raid healing" abilities, basically as holy every time i need to heal i need to watch my bar really closely. it is truely difficult to play holy comparing to discipline gamestyle.

i do think that the holy tree is still abit broken, combining talents perhaps, giving the holy tree a 51 talent point that is about the tree and not mitigation (gaurdian spirit is amazing, it really is, when you use it on time its just a wow i saved the raid a wipe, yet once a night i press it? sometimes even not. when it comes to pvp i die faster then i can click trinket, i managed to get some pvp gear with 670 ressiliance yet i get instant gimped so fast by the melee without the discipline survivability talents). perhaps looking around at thing trying to fix the holy to be able to heal for long encounters raid as well as tank (atm a holy cannot maintain raid healing for long, simpley because there isn't a efficiant spell for it, unless you are already in 25m nax gear, there is no chance you'll manage alone raid healing without having huge mana difficulties, yet when you heal tank those mana diffictulties dissapear (holy conc proc and surge of light if you are smart enough to take both). ofc we can theory craft all day of how many times you use CoH, and if you combine other spells, if you get in the FSR, yet the only thing i can say is simple: we went 3 resto druids 1 holy priest to malygos, and i was told it would've been 4 resto druids, the holy priest was oom whispering me if my inervate is free on the phase switch from phase 1 to 2. I also came as a priest afew days later and i agree mana is intense, much more then the discipline fun and extremely easy pve gamestyle. this priest used barely CoH, mainly healed with prom and flash, and still i gave him my inervate doing twice more healing then him and rarely thinking of mana. this is a issue blizz should fix, there shouldn't be 1 spec in the whole game that should "prevent" himself from casting while others can. As a holy priest you enjoy healing, and seeing big numbers - but how can this be worth if 3 CoH, 1 Prayer of mending and you need a rest? especially when you look jealously at te dpam hot druid not resting for a sec maintianing high mana.

ofc same complaints that i gave on beta, too bad blizz can't read suggestions properly. Ofc we went malgyos with 3 resto druids and 1 holy priest. we have a discipline priest in the raid, but since the gamestyle is so easy, not challenging and you simpley can't run oom, though to my eyes, and more he is really not needed, especially when he can't manage to keep a tank up alone (the same job a holy priests capable of playing holy managed easly). i don't think the discipline priest will last, not cause he isn't supportive, the player him slefinsisting that discipline is hard to play makes him look like a joke. discipline is too easy to play, i really do mean it TOO easy. i

holy tree is built good for MT healing, and from my raid experiance and what i saw from other priests, its really been done for mt healing. when it comes to raid healing, i would say holy priests might be one of the 2 weakest in it from all the healers, simpley cause you run oom faster then the druids and the resto shamans (and if you ask why? cause resto shamans still spam chainheal and don't go oom, and druid just spam rejub now, priests want to heal raid are forced into no mana refound spells with AE ability that costs too much mana). If the gear is the same level and me and a resto shaman are healing the raid, a holy priest shouldn't go oom after the fiend ofc and the hymm, much before the resto shaman. i agree the resto shaman should have more abilities to maintain longer and better healing on raid. yet atm you have resto druids, the shamans, paladins with beacon, and last holy priests - i say this acording to mana "survivability" a paladin will last longer healing raid then a holy priests - this is sad, when it comes to mana holy priests have it really bad compared to disci, holy paladins, shamans and resto druids.

Yet this is exactly why i rerolled, i want to be the most verstile healer, i want to play and be able to heal when i want, i dont want to consistingly look at my mana bar and worry - and thats how i am with my priest when i spec holy, now as a druid i am the one that can do anything regardless. as a druid i can do it. i can't as a holy priest i go oom much much fast. and discipline, i guess it was blizz way of laughing at pve? or holy priests?

[dionadar]

"holy is much more harder to play then disci."
That actually depends. As holy mana management is harder (a lot) but as disci powerhealing is harder (not so much).

"as holy you need to drink alot in heroics"
Well, maybe sir, YOU need to "l2p"... Considering that my gear is still 5 pieces of tier 6 I doubt that I can match your epeen, but obviously if I am not going OOM as a holy either your group sucks, or you suck.

It is really kind of annoying to see that all your months of farming swp still did not teach you to do your job...

[destro]

I'm definitely also witnessing regen issues with holy. I'm having to drink quite a bit during heroics. My mp5 while casting is about 235 unbuffed. I think the problem maybe partially alleviated by raising holy concentration's chance to proc. With holy priests generally having such low crit, we aren't in holy concentration enough with the reductions in mana regen and high cost of spells (~1k per gheal).

I've been hearing quite a bit on the forums about how discipline is more mana efficient so I'm probably going to try discipline for raiding when I can expect another healer to help out. Can you post your disc spec meowmeow? I'm thinking of this spec:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?priest=053200213050510250102523125120505102000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000& glyph=130205050306

[Rambobarbq]

"holy is much more harder to play then disci."
That actually depends. As holy mana management is harder (a lot) but as disci powerhealing is harder (not so much).

"as holy you need to drink alot in heroics"
Well, maybe sir, YOU need to "l2p"... Considering that my gear is still 5 pieces of tier 6 I doubt that I can match your epeen, but obviously if I am not going OOM as a holy either your group sucks, or you suck.

It is really kind of annoying to see that all your months of farming swp still did not teach you to do your job...

it all depend to your group composition sure you wont drink if you have a survival hunter or any replenish specced class..... sigh

[Kelesti]

My mp5 while casting is about 235 unbuffed.

True story: Oo5SR > mp5. 235 mp5 and what's your spirit regen, 400?

I think the problem maybe partially alleviated by raising holy concentration's chance to proc. With holy priests generally having such low crit, we aren't in holy concentration enough.

You're sort of on the right track. Except, it's not just IHC, it's Surge of Light. You also get your Test of Faith to help push your crit a little higher (when it's needed). Also: Serendipity must be maxed. People say "OMG overhealing is bad" but realistically, regardless of how good you are, you're going to do it anyway, whether it's from latency, Judgement of Light, etc. Pushing out a 7k greater heal when tank only needs 6? Sure why not, if you get 25% of the spell's cost back to cast another one, that to me is a net gain.

I've been hearing quite a bit on the forums about how discipline is more mana efficient so I'm probably going to try discipline for raiding when I can expect another healer to help out. Can you post your disc spec meowmeow?

[color=teal]Let me fill you in here, Discipline can last for minutes straight, if it's the only healer. The second you throw another one into the bag, it's longevity goes through the floor. The reason? Rapture. Rapture returns mana on percentage of total healing done. So realistically, the second you put a Paladin on the same tank you are covering, sniping your heals, your mana goes from blue to grey and doesn't come back up.

it all depend to your group composition sure you wont drink if you have a survival hunter or any replenish specced class..... sigh

Or manage your spells and how to stay out of the 5SR rather than just go "OMG I HAVE MANAZ, I CAN SPAM LIEK PALADIZN NOW". Inner Focus, Improved Holy Concentration, Surge of Light, Serendipity. The tools are even better than they had before for managing mana, that doesn't mean you can spam forever like a retard.