About Warlock pvp problems

[ttt]

Simple solution: let warlocks wear mail/leather. We'll be able to last through the fear-immune durations and take control. Or ever just outlive them using DoTs and drains.

[Ofmanv]

Simple solution: let warlocks wear mail/leather. We'll be able to last through the fear-immune durations and take control. Or ever just outlive them using DoTs and drains.

I don't know about changing every loot table in the game to make mail for locks but something doable like having demon armor count your cloth's item level and give it the corresponding amount of armor a piece of mail would have.

[ttt]

Hmm well maybe the problem lies with our 'signature spell' fear. Its either OP or useless - there's just no optimal configuration for a spell with such a function. A new spell that somehow solves all our problems without being OP? Maybe its too optimistic to even conceptualize such a thing.

How about making our Drain Life be immune to interruptions? It might be too good though if you're in demon form. An affliction talent, perhaps? Not that we won't be easily OHKO'd in the end...

[barrsftw]

the dot swiftmend is an awesome idea.

due to other class skils/talents, deathcoil can afford to be a 30sec CD or less.

[zarondd]

My suggestions, hopefully balanced, and my main is a pally not a lock

1) Fear is easily dispelled, breaks on damage, and many classes have immunities to it
2) need range and to be planted to do decent damage. No way to escape from melee (if arguing fear read above)

Talents for Fear, as to which trees they should go, I'll let you locks argue over it
Low Tier : Reduces chance of Fear being dispelled or broken (except by trinket or human racial, which should always work) by up to 30%
High Tier : Gives up to 50% chance of fear working on an "immune" target for 50% of the normal duration

3) Supposed to be a healing while damaging class. DKs outheal and outdamage us.

Ideal solution: Nerf DKs

4) Pets dies too quickly and have piss poor damage (minus felgaurd but he gets 1 shotted). SL needs a pet to work

Give pets %master resilience, increase base %sta bonus. IMO Pets aren't super weak like the 2 GCD exaggeration.

5) Deathcoil is easily resisted; both damage and healing. 2 minute cd is long considering this

Same as any other long CD spell for other classes, if its a big issue there is spell pen for a reason.

6) All other cloth classes have damage shields. Locks need to sac VW for one. No SL. Epic fail

No reason to homogenize, locks have a spell shield. Also Locks have unique abilities too.

7) Howl of Terror should be instant cast w/o talenting it. Even then it wouldnt help locks much

I'm just going to straight out oppose this.

8) All DoTs should have a counter to being dispelled. UA dispel damage should be 3x-5x more.

The 5s silence is a good deterence already. Just change UA to always be the priority dispel target.

9) CoTongues should now be a silence/interupt

You do not want that, trust me. CoT interrupting on cast would mean it would have a CD.

10) lack of a "knockback" ability

Along with over half the other classes

Other Changes:

Haste Scaling on cast Dots (all classes): Should cause dots to roll faster, 100% haste = 50% duration dots (double dps), fair since it does the double edged sword of haste, increases damage at the expense of burning mana faster.

Haste Scaling on Channeled Effects (all classes): As above. Lifedrain will be back in style, probably.

Demonic Circle: Summon made instant and invisible to hostile players. Teleport breaks immobilization and snare.

Enslave Demon -> Enslave Outsider : Make it work on elementals too, and for the love of god on enemy pets.

Banish -> Allows you to target your pets and yourself lasting 6 secs subject to DR that cyclone is in.
While banished you or your pet do not take any damage and cannot be targetted, but cannot be healed, do not regain mana and cannot take any action. However any physical effects will be removed.

Metamorphasis -> Add Rain of Chaos, channelled, summons 1 inferno randomly around yourself every sec for up to 4 secs. Inferno's last up to 45s and cannot be controlled, but will attack the nearest hostile.

Haunt -> Change the type to a curse that the curse limit does not apply to.
At the end of the effect, IMO it should summon a lost soul (like in SFK) that possesses the target or dispeller like a kind of MC for up to 6 secs. You can order the possession effect to end and get the regular life return effect based on the duration remaining.
That or it changes to You possess the target for the haunt duration, your body remains banished were you cast the spell.
Splitting damage and healing taken 50/50.
Damage received may end the effect, 50% dispel resistance.
While in possession, "you" as in the target, have a 50% haste penalty. Mana used is split between you and the target.
Costs %life, lasts up to 12s and is on 45s CD.

[Magic]

burst dmg scaled insanely (mostly for melee) res of s5 is not going to fix this. I had a rogue ambush for 10k mutilate for 9k my mage with 460 res at 80 now say make it 800 res in s5 its still a 9k ambush and 8.1k mutilate still 2 shotting me.....

[WolleKK]

High Tier : Gives up to 50% chance of fear working on an "immune" target for 50% of the normal duration

No just no! It is like the first concept of wotlk sub rogue ambush doesn't allow using any item for some seconds. It is against the hole game mechanic. Just like chaos bolt throu ice block.
Immune is immune. Trinket works always (in a pvp situation). That's the law and it should not be changed. The consequences would be fatal for the not existing balance team ;D

[TerryBogard]

I really hate when some people argue against points that shouldnt be argued against. Every caster class either has a bubble, (VW sac isnt the same because locks NEED SL for some semblance of survivabilty. Its like giving a liver transplant to a chronic alcoholic; yeah they'll live a little bit longer but the cause of death is still the same) snare, root, knockback, snare break, stun break, and in some cases multiple.

What do locks have currently?

1) Shadowfury (talented): A 3 second stun; shortest duration in the game. Without considerable burst damage that is on par with other classes its ineffective. Locks DO NOT have comparable burst damage.

2) CoExhaustion (talented): a 50% snare for 12 secs. More dispels than any other snare in the game (because its a curse). Only one curse can be applied at a time. Definately better than it was as a 30% snare but many abilities halve snare effects (which melee classes spec into for pvp).

3) Improved Fear (talented): Adds a 30% snare to target for 5 secs after the fear ends. 2.5 secs actual time against classes that it would matter having a snare on.




Mages: Iceblock, Ice Barrier (talented), Blink, Instant Invis (with glyph), Slow (talented), Frost Bolt (rank 1 for faster effects), Frost nova, Mirror Image, and a pet that snares. Not to mention better burst damage than locks.

Boomkins: 370% armor bonus (to leather), Magic school resists, Cyclone, Grasp, Unsnareable, Typhoon, stealth, heals, and celestial Focus (talented)

Elemental: Thunderstorm, Block (plus added armor bonus of a shield), Frost Shock, Grounding totem, Earthbind Totem, Elemental Warding, and Astral Shift.

Priests: I actually think shadow is in the same boat as Locks.


Fear is an outdated mechanic in todays PvP and cannot be the only means of defense for a class. DoTs cannot compare to burst damage. Locks need something else otherwise they have been blacklisted from an entire part of the WoW community.

[Dinamic]

What do locks have currently?

1) Shadowfury (talented): A 3 second stun; shortest duration in the game. Without considerable burst damage that is on par with other classes its ineffective. Locks DO NOT have comparable burst damage.

2) CoExhaustion (talented): a 50% snare for 12 secs. More dispels than any other snare in the game (because its a curse). Only one curse can be applied at a time. Definately better than it was as a 30% snare but many abilities halve snare effects (which melee classes spec into for pvp).

3) Improved Fear (talented): Adds a 30% snare to target for 5 secs after the fear ends. 2.5 secs actual time against classes that it would matter having a snare on.

4) A viariety of pets that each bring a different buff to the warlock.

5) Health regen like whoa

6) May not have the burst damage of some classes, but can apply a large percentage of their damage to multiple classes (dots) and while easy to remove (for certain classes but eats the dispeller's gcds), are very easy to reapply

Mages: Iceblock, Ice Barrier (talented), Blink, Instant Invis (with glyph), Slow (talented), Frost Bolt (rank 1 for faster effects), Frost nova, Mirror Image, and a pet that snares. Not to mention better burst damage than locks.

Fear is an outdated mechanic in todays PvP and cannot be the only means of defense for a class. DoTs cannot compare to burst damage. Locks need something else otherwise they have been blacklisted from an entire part of the WoW community.

I got rid of the parts of your post I didn't feel like replying to. I hate class comparisons like this. With every GOOD lock ability you remember to list, you bash it. Then you spit out mage abilities like a pissed off llama. Locks generally need help in a few areas:

Pet survivability - If Blizzard wants you to depend on soul link, it should obviously be harder to kill your demons. If other things about your demons need to be changed, so be it. Your demons do bring great variety. You should have to make a choice on which one to bring up and not have the one hit wonder that was the felhunter in TBC.

Melee Survivability - Demon Armor needs to mitigate percentages of physical damage to ignore armor reducing abilities.

I actually think fixing these two would work wonders for lock PvP. You can debate the smaller stuff if you want to, but I think the two I listed are the large, glaring problems of lock PvP.

[Undeadnerf]

give me an screen shot

happens all the time to all cloth, no screen required

[Dinamic]

This isnt the blizzard forums btw...their not coming here to read your suggestions on how to fix the class...

Not my intention to teach Blizzard anything.

I just could barely swim through the ocean of exaggeration in this thread and decided to sail straight to the point. Hopefully I picked up a couple of you along the way.

[TerryBogard]

@Dinamic

What I was listing were the numerous options other classes have to avoid damage while locks just have Fear and a VW sac (which breaks soul link, Epic Fail). With melee easily critting for 10-15k on cloth that means even with Soul Link locks are still taking 8-12k damage and 2-3k to the pet. That in essence 2 shots the lock and the pet at the same time.

Demonic Circle looked to be a nice addition and would help with lock survivability issues. What it turned into is a poor mans blink that isnt usable while stunned and 'hamstrings' locks into fighting in a fixed location if they want to use the spell (Dks easily pull us out of range making it useless against them, elemental can knock us out of range)

So yeah its a little annoying when other caster classes get multiple escape mechanics while every one the lock has is handicapped. If I am not allowed to comment on other classes then what am I supposed to compare locks to??? I dont want to be a mage but it would be nice to survive like one via alternate abilities.


BTW I know Blizzard doesnt read these forums. I come to MMO so that I can voice my own and read others concerns and advice about specific classes. This is a median though

[Klokie]

we got the ultimate escape ability! Death!

[Darkengelion]

I dont understand all these issues against melee classes, I dont seem to have problems to deal with mine opponents. Sure I get 2 shotted once and for while but thats life with no resilience. You all remember how it was on season 1...it was all about burst dmg when there was no resilience gear. So we aint really playing fairly until february when most people have same gear.

In addition, I find warriors and deathknights easy to deal with in duels... The game has changed and if you cant adapt to the new tricks and traps warlocks can do then you will fail...
You just cant dot and stand still anymoreXD

[Gozul]

Change Soul Link : Soul link an opponent. 20% of the damage he inflicts to you is redirected to him. Works on one target at a time.

[TerryBogard]

I dont understand all these issues against melee classes,

Then you havent been PvPing. There is no other answer to a statement like that.

I dont seem to have problems to deal with mine opponents.

Yes, you are better than everyone else (sarcasm). But seriously the l2p posts are old hat at this point. I love when people say "I never have problems" but never back it up with proof.

Sure I get 2 shotted once and for while but thats life with no resilience. You all remember how it was on season 1...it was all about burst dmg when there was no resilience gear. So we aint really playing fairly until february when most people have same gear.

Actually thats a logical fallacy. High burst damage before resil will still be high burst damage after resil. A 12k crit will now hit for 9-10k instead. So instead of 2 shots it takes 3, maybe 4. Remember they will have resil against locks damage too. That means we will be hitting for less also and still not have burst damage nor applicable escape mechanics.

In addition, I find warriors and deathknights easy to deal with in duels...

@ what level? Definately not 80 and they must realy, really blow.

The game has changed and if you cant adapt to the new tricks and traps warlocks can do then you will fail...
You just cant dot and stand still anymoreXD

1) locks never just dotted and stood there. That statement is just something you made up and has never been true.

2) Saying "The game has changed...." is actually saying very little and it doesnt prove your case. There are other factors than just adapting that affect locks. PvP is currently all about burst damage which places a Damage Over Time class at a distinct disadvantage. I already listed problems locks are facing so i wont do it again.

[TerryBogard]

Change Soul Link : Soul link an opponent. 20% of the damage he inflicts to you is redirected to him. Works on one target at a time.

So a rogue hits you for a 12k ambush and then an 8k muti; you die but he takes 4k damage. That helps us how?

Edit: wait the rogue was invis and stun fuxored you so the soul link was never applied. you get 2 shotted he has full health

[Darkengelion]

This whole issue is worthless to discuss at this point...everybody has pve gear so...also should be discussed on different forums in different categories...like arena, duel, bgs...different problems in every pvp aspect...

Also, rogues has been our counterclass since adam and eve so dont expect to win every class with facerolling...

[TerryBogard]

This whole issue is worthless to discuss at this point...everybody has pve gear so...also should be discussed on different forums in different categories...like arena, duel, bgs...different problems in every pvp aspect...

Also, rogues has been our counterclass since adam and eve so dont expect to win every class with facerolling...

ROFL!! You posted a solution by changing how Soul Link works and were subsequently told why its a bad solution (switch rogue with warrior using bladestorm). Then you claim locks expect to win by facerolling (not since S2).

Also this is a lock issue so it can be in the lock forums.

[Rymezz]

Haha, your corruption ticks for 800 and you are complaining about other classes making too much damage. Damn, l2p and gtfo! What I want to say: Wait for S5-gear

Lol, 800 per tick isn't that much, my priest deals around 1.7k per tick with VT(buffed&on boss ofc)