Glyph of Frostbolt

[Yuziku]

Wow, with the raid content level at the moment, I didn't think there would be any moaning about a spec you HAVE to take ^^

We have a few mages in our guild, and I think only one or two of them are ffb at the moment, but thats mainly because they like the high numbers, the others go for whatever they have fun as. We have a frost mage, and the mana regen is fantastic for the healers and every other class that has a mana supply really. So who cares if they don't do the best damage in the world? raid content is so easy you don't need to go all out. ffb just seems like one of them specs that people say 'You have to go this otherwise you will suck forever' but who the hell cares? If you have fun in your guild then hey, do whatever the fk you want. I'm not changing to DW DK for the tiny dmg increase, since my dmg is fine at the moment.

If your guild is lacking in DPS, then yes, why not go FFB to help out? If you have cleared everything and are just having fun, then go whatever spec you like.

BACK ON TOPIC.

I find the glyph is rather helpful, its not a huge boost, but its a boost all the same.

[Dominate]

Snotty little kids like this are why I quit my mage.

Honestly - if you find arcane fun play it. If you find fire fun play it. If you find frost fun play it. If people are going to get a hernia over someone playing something other than your cookie cutter build then - I'm gonna play the life card. Go get laid, you take this way too seriously.

And frost is so simple? I see how throwing in a few living bombs and pyro's makes someone else suddenly an expert on complex rotations. Likewise with arcane throwing in frostbolts until the AB debuff wears off. Yes I have played mage. Wanna know why I found fire boring? Lack of kiting ability, high mana/ threat issues, and because everyone specced it. I played for fun, I was forst, I got 1001 snotty kids telling me or any arcane/ frost mage to play how they would and would cry when we didn't. Certainly you won't be in top guilds well gee whiz - some people might try out that fun thing that others sacrificed to feel self important and judge people by talent point allocations.

So yes - frostbolt glyph *is* a pve glyph if thats what you want to do. My advice would be play your game, not spec something you find boring and get turned off the class like I was. My argument will be that frosts survivability on aoe damage (for when melee spawn loads of adds you need to aoe down on Sartharion, people spawning slimes on Globbiius, kiting on Gluth to name a few) and mana efficiency can make it viable if people choose. And granted those people will actually have fun rather than seeing the game as a job and excuse to look down on people they don't know.

[DeacFrost]

Emiex ever heard of the cookie cutter band wagon? Im guessing you are the leader. Play what you wanna play but you shouldnt call someone else a waste of space cause they dont spec what you spec. I'm Frost. Been Frost from November 24th 2004 and have always did awesome dps from VC - Bwl - BT - Naxx and beyond. I love watching FFB die quickly in raids cause they are pure paper DPS. "Toilet Paper DPS". Ill take 10% less dps over 35% survivabilty. Besides I believe Mages are 25% spec, 25% gear, 50% well thought rotation and knowlege of how to play. Have yourself a nice day ;D

[Emiex]

LOL, FFB mages die quickly... Just cause the mages in your guild are horrible and die quickly doesnt mean you should be frost. If your going to raid be the highest dps spec you can be or dont go. This isnt a suggestion its reality. If you are going to do something do it right or just ebay your account, cause noone wants you to show up and half ass it... All you are is omg can I please be frost so I can entertain myself and screw 24 other people.

[Raptorg]

Emiex ever heard of the cookie cutter band wagon? Im guessing you are the leader. Play what you wanna play but you shouldnt call someone else a waste of space cause they dont spec what you spec. I'm Frost. Been Frost from November 24th 2004 and have always did awesome dps from VC - Bwl - BT - Naxx and beyond. I love watching FFB die quickly in raids cause they are pure paper DPS. "Toilet Paper DPS". Ill take 10% less dps over 35% survivabilty. Besides I believe Mages are 25% spec, 25% gear, 50% well thought rotation and knowlege of how to play. Have yourself a nice day ;D

EL

OH

EL


That is all.

[Emiex]

Emiex ever heard of the cookie cutter band wagon? Im guessing you are the leader. Play what you wanna play but you shouldnt call someone else a waste of space cause they dont spec what you spec. I'm Frost. Been Frost from November 24th 2004 and have always did awesome dps from VC - Bwl - BT - Naxx and beyond. I love watching FFB die quickly in raids cause they are pure paper DPS. "Toilet Paper DPS". Ill take 10% less dps over 35% survivabilty. Besides I believe Mages are 25% spec, 25% gear, 50% well thought rotation and knowlege of how to play. Have yourself a nice day ;D

I feel sorry for your guild... Have you ever killed anything? What about your healers are they so awful that you need to worry about your HP? Maybe your healers are showing up as off specs also like you. Would explain a lot... What if your tank was fury? Thats good times. Where do I app.

[DeacFrost]

Im not even gonna go back and forth with you Ex. I have 68 ppl in my guild love me to the death being Frost, and playing how I play, so no ebay for me. FFB is not the end all spec. Everyones got there place.

[Thunderspike]

I feel sorry for your guild... Have you ever killed anything? What about your healers are they so awful that you need to worry about your HP? Maybe your healers are showing up as off specs also like you. Would explain a lot... What if your tank was fury? Thats good times. Where do I app.

1)this guys is the biggest fool i've ever seen
2) i have seen fantastic dps from both frost and FFB mages so you can both stfu its all about gear and skill. FFB have larger burst damage and can get crits sure but frost just dont stop, ever, for anything. no matter the boss a frost mage can keep a constant dps that is better than most classes.

[DeacFrost]

Damn, Thunder you agreed with me and crapped on me all in the same post. Btw.Glyph of frost bolt is pretty nice but i prefer not to use cause of torment.

[Malentra]

LOL, FFB mages die quickly...  Just cause the mages in your guild are horrible and die quickly doesnt mean you should be frost.  If your going to raid be the highest dps spec you can be or dont go.  This isnt a suggestion its reality.  If you are going to do something do it right or just ebay your account, cause noone wants you to show up and half ass it...  All you are is omg can I please be frost so I can entertain myself and screw 24 other people.

Even on the EJ forums this is not a wildly held viewpoint.  Its true for a progression/cutting-edge guild, but not everyone is in one of those.  Nor should they be.

The current content (minus a few achievements) is not balanced towards max dps specs.  There's no point, unless you think its the difference between clearing Naxx in 3 hours vs. 3 hours and 15 minutes is a big deal.   The difference between 3500 dps and 4500 dps for one player in a raid (especially one who brings other benefits because of it) isn't going to cause a wipe.  

Min/maxing at this point in the game is kinda pointless.  I'm not going to say I don't do it, hell my spec gives up Blastwave just so I can have one more point in WiF and I check my recount parse after every boss pull, but I certainly don't press my personal gameplay style on others and say its the only way to play.

Btw.Glyph of frost bolt is pretty nice but i prefer not to use cause of torment.

Hmmm, the only time I could see this being a big deal is in 5-mans.  When soloing/grinding you can use FFB to start the fight (mob should be dead before the 8 second slow wears off anyway, plus FFB has a 40 yard range), and in raids there's going to be some sort of TtW effect on the boss, like FFB slow from an FFB mage, or next patch TC/JotJ/etc.

Still, I think the Glyph is a PITA, and should be reworked.

[Emiex]

I am not telling anyone to spec anything. I am expressing my viewpoint on raiding. I know people will be frost and other horrible off specs and show up to raids. Most people in general are morons, after all what would the world be without them.

[sf49erfan55]

I like how this dps arguement (emiex especially) keeps going on....the content in wotlk now is so retardedly easy you could show up with no talent points spent and your group would clear the content. This crap about gimping the raid and showing up to raid pve as a certain spec is stupid. With content this easy you just look like a moron going on and on. gg.

[Instant]

You are missing the point entirely raiding isnt about playing what you like or don't like. Its about playing as a team and helping each other. Why would you go to a gun fight with a knife, cause you like it? If you don't show up the proper spec there is no point in you showing up. Just cause you want to be frost why do the other 24 other players have to suffer with less dps for your entertainment. Stop being selfish idiots and play the game properly.

That is most stupid thing i ever read. Really. That means we should have 3 tanks, 6 healers and 16 hunters in raid, cause atm they do biggest dps.

If raiding isnt bout playing what you like, then this whole game has no sense at all. We're not paid for doing raids (maybe you are, so you need cookie cutter spec above one you'd enjoy). Someone enjoyes playing frost, thats good for him. Lucky enough that friends from his guild support it.

Just because most dps enjoys cookie cuter over anything else, doesnt mean its moronic to play differently. And saying that you cant play what you like is most selfish thing ever.

[Nirual]

I think the better question is why you would ever be frost in pve............... Dont even say the water elemental gives the raid mana because we all know that, and it isnt worth the dps loss for you to pewpew frost bolts

Imba kiting skills maybe? It might not be needed as much these days but I've saved quite a few near wipes by freezing enemies and frost mages are one of the best classes to use to handle zombies on Gluth. Add a water elemental that is up nearly half of the time and restores mana to everyone (stacking with replenisment unless I'm sorely mistaken) and you have a nice group player, even if his dps on single targets isn't the best.

And believe it or not, there are actually people who don't mind being highest dps as long as they bring some added benefit instead. Many of them play healers but as far as DPS specs go frost is pretty nice in that aspect.

[Malentra]

I believe its pretty obvious Emiex is just trolling the thread.  Time to move on...

Is it usefull in PVE?
Does it work with fingers of frost?

An interesting thing to check (apologies if I missed it somewhere in the thread) is whether the "phantom slow" effect that's allowing Frostbolt to proc Fingers of Frost and Frostbite, also still procs the TtW effect.  I guess if 3.0.8 is out tomorrow, we'll know soon enough.

[Sausagefan]

Hopefully in Ulduar this will actually be a relevant argument. As is, I could show up to a raid specced for Silence and Imp Renew and still put out enough DPS to down bosses.

[Deleted]

I think the better question is why you would ever be frost in pve............... Dont even say the water elemental gives the raid mana because we all know that, and it isnt worth the dps loss for you to pewpew frost bolts

When you're still with bad gear Frost specs produce better results than Frostfire spec.
Also, with 3.0.8 the difference between the awesome Frostfire spec and deep frost Spec will be reduced (while Frostfire will still remain the best, most likely).

Why should someone go deep frost in PVE, you ask? Well why, let's see... To be different from the others? For the challenge? For fun? They all seem pretty valid reasons to me.

[naowin]

:P is the generall opinion that frost sux ass dmg wise atm? cuz for all i can see our frostmages in guild are keeping up pritty well on totall dmg? :P ok they dash out almost everything on the trash packs which blizzard just cuts thgourgh like an overpowerd knife but still? frost isent rly that bad compared to other specs. due to its high mana efficency u can pritty much stack upp insain amount of haste. when the normal casts starts to go down to like 2sec casts or even less it isent rly somthing to be ignoreing anymore. frost was the best spec in late tbc due to all haste attained in sunwell and after the patch it will have another huge dps increase so i wouldent doubt it to be fairly sufficent again.

[qpon]

frost



ffb

arcane

[KDirtMcGirt]

FTW, PizzaBaggle ^

Before mages have the requisite crit for FFB, Frost is probably the best choice: good utility, completely acceptable dps. The OP wasn't asking if the Glyph of Frostbolt was the best glyph in the game, he didn't say Frost is the best endgame spec, he simply asked if it's worth it.

OP - I'm Frost. I *DO* plan to go FFB when I can, but I don't have the crit yet, so it's pointless, and I out-dps *undergeared* FFB mages more often than I out-dps undergeared frost mages. Personally, I am *NOT* taking the glyph, because I still have a lot of farming to do, and the chill effect really comes in handy there. So that's my two cents.