Prot Paladin T8 4 Set Bonus

[Daez]

who... you? http://www.wowarmory.com/character-a...e&n=Evereghalo

Even more importantly, just because you care about such things doesn't mean that the poster or his guild gives a crap about them so stop judging him on them.

[Daez]

If it is applied afterwards (which is much more likely) then it really is a lacklustre bonus.

Apparently you haven't kept up with the blue posts about this very aspect of our T8 set bonus. It is implied as part of SoR. Its an added bonus to SoR and then 3 seconds after that. It makes every SoR have more block value added to it.

[Daez]

The bonus is less BV than you would gain swapping out the two pieces of non-BV gear with BV gear in general, making it useless for BV-stacking mitigational tanks; the BV is going to hardly be noticable in an avoidance set, because you'll be probably only using 3 pieces of T8 (the three avoidance heavier pieces) which means.... no bonus.

What you fail to notice is that you are already going to hit the avoidance soft cap with T8 in a block value set. Getting avoidance soft capped will be easy to do. You can do so while still maximizing block. So far, I have seen 2 pieces of T8.5 that isn't best in slot. I know we don't have all gear out, but assuming nothing changes it will come down to head and chest as your off slot options. The heads are actually very close (the tier and the non tier) which cause the chest to be your off option.

[Daez]

Plus, Daez is supporting the 4-pc, thus we can say that it's probably not good, especially as he fails to take into account the relative power, only taking the uptimes into coonsideration, and neglecting talents for reducing CDs.

Funny. You see the problem is. Rather you like to admit it or not, when it comes to paladins I'm normally right on. I can't help people like you are clueless or still want to live in TBC. That is your problem not mine.

I have already mentioned that anything that allows us to do more damage and cause more threat while adding to our mitigation is good. Our only off slot options where the t8.5 is not currently best in slot is head and chest. The chest is the best off slot option leaving you with the helm. Right now the choice really comes down to http://ptr.wowhead.com/?item=46175 vs http://ptr.wowhead.com/?item=45502. The T8.5 has better over all avoidance while allowing you to keep the set bonus.

So, the set bonus will probably default. The very fact that I'm supporting a set bonus means its pretty damn good because I don't get tier gear simply because it is tier.

Granted, we have probably not seen all the loot in Uludar which means that there might be some other off slot items where the T8.5 doesn't come out ahead and if that is the case I will reconsider my stance.

[Daez]

a warr is better suited to adds on fights like Sarth I feel.

This is true to an extent. It really comes down to how many adds you are tanking at at given time. In 3.1, 4 will be our maximum number to tank without the dps ever coming close. Hammer of Righteousness does a lot more for our ability to tank multiple mobs than consecration does. Also, when the mobs are undead we come out ahead because of holy wrath. When they are not undead and there is more than 4 then a warrior can come out ahead of us. However, I have seen so many warriors fail at add tanking its not even funny.

[Daez]

I won't use 4 pieces because there are better options. I mean, T8.5 is ilevel 226 when there are ilevel 239 off-set pieces. Plus, i won't use that extremely ugly chest I'm a paladin not a belly dancer.

Soprobably it'll be 2 pc bonus or even no T8.

Those 239 off set pieces come from HARD MODES. If you think you are going to walk into Uludar and just walk right over HARD MODES then good luck with that. Chances are we will need 226 gear to get 239 gear. Granted, once a guild has hard modes on farm then of course a 239 is going to beat a 226 regardless of any of the set bonuses on tier (assuming that both are itemized appropriately).

[Krakenskulls]

In terms of BV, the VHH BV trinket is worse than the two BC equivalents you know - it's the lack of BV compared to what BV you have to drop for it that's the issue with the bonus IMO. Plus, Daez is supporting the 4-pc, thus we can say that it's probably not good, especially as he fails to take into account the relative power, only taking the uptimes into coonsideration, and neglecting talents for reducing CDs.

Sry i meant the BV libram, not the trinket from H VH

[Evereghalo]

Even with homogenization their is still some specialization when it comes to tanking. I don't think this that bad because its the ONLY 4 set that increases BOTH threat and mitigation. Shield block is on a 1 minute cool down lasting 10 seconds. That means warriors 4 set doesn't affect them for 50 seconds out of every minute (its down 5/6 of the time). The dk bonus is 10% absorbed by magic shell. Which is a 45 second cool down that last 5 seconds. That means its down 40 seconds. Its down 8/9 of the time. Druids survival instincts is on a 3 minute cool down and will last 28 seconds (up from 20 seconds). Its down for 2 minutes and 32 seconds. I'm going to be lazy and just call it 30 seconds so the numbers will actually be a tad more generous. By that generosity its down 5/6 of the time.

In conclusion, the warrior 4 set is down 5/6 of the time, the dk 4 set is down 8/9 of the time and the druid 4 set is down 5/6 of the time. The paladin 4 set is UP 100% of the time and the effect from it is up 1/2 of the time. I don't know but something that affects me 1/2 of the seems much better than something that affects me 5/6 or 8/9 of the time (especially when that affect both helps my mitigation and increases my threat).

On a side note, I didn't even bother with the 4 set T7.5 because I wanted avoidance and the itemization of the pieces were poor for pure avoidance and the bonus honestly did SUCK. T8.5, however, has some very well itemized pieces (mostly because we will be avoidance capped while using block value anyways) that are worth getting and this set bonus is completely worth getting.

yea, but how often are you going to block it with a 3 second uptime?

Logic would dictate half the time, but who knows how if that will hold true.

Warrior, DK, and Druid T4 give definitive buffs to Mitigation. Ours is speculative at best because yea you might get a block at the same time but there is no guarantee. On one boss fight you might block with it up every time, on the next you might bliock without it ever being up.

[Draco cracona]

An analysis of what BV gear there is at BiS level is currently meaningless IMO - we've seen six plate pieces of 236 gear, pretty sure there'll be a lot more up there to beat the tier gear tbh, especially as the two tanking items are both avoidance heavy and the next lowest ilevel items listed are from 10 man hard, badges, 25man trash and normal modes - hard mode loot is likely to beat the tier gear generally IMO tbh. As for getting tier gear to gear up for hard modes, I just don't think we'd be keeping the set items long enough relative to other classes for it to be worth going for tier bonuses. I could be completely wrong on that ofc, but we'll see.

And Daez - the comment regarding you was meant jokingly, although you've shown a complete lack of knowledge in other threads, specifically about rotations.

[Bluerelic]

Funny. You see the problem is. Rather you like to admit it or not, when it comes to paladins I'm normally right on. I can't help people like you are clueless or still want to live in TBC. That is your problem not mine.

I have already mentioned that anything that allows us to do more damage and cause more threat while adding to our mitigation is good. Our only off slot options where the t8.5 is not currently best in slot is head and chest. The chest is the best off slot option leaving you with the helm. Right now the choice really comes down to http://ptr.wowhead.com/?item=46175 vs http://ptr.wowhead.com/?item=45502. The T8.5 has better over all avoidance while allowing you to keep the set bonus.

So, the set bonus will probably default. The very fact that I'm supporting a set bonus means its pretty damn good because I don't get tier gear simply because it is tier.

Granted, we have probably not seen all the loot in Uludar which means that there might be some other off slot items where the T8.5 doesn't come out ahead and if that is the case I will reconsider my stance.

Your opinion of BiS gear is seriously different than my opinion of BiS gear, since you're still hung up on stacking block rating ridden gear. I have 53 Block rating in my current gear, thats 28 from my maly neck and 25 from Bindings of the Hapless Prey, with the amount of avoidance i carry I reach 102.4% while fully raid buffed in Naxx level gear. There is no way in hell I'm equipping any gear with block rating on it until they either make it worth something to stack beyond 102.4%, or the item is SO good, I can equip it anyway and not worry about the wasted item budget spent on a worthless stat.

T8 isnt terribly itemized, it could be better, like replacing the block rating on helm and shoulders with a real stat, but all around its decent. But, this is what it comes down to, there are 2 items off Algalon the Observer, Gloves and Leggings, that are BiS for all 3 plate wearing tanks, period. If your guild can kill Algalon then there is no way to get our 4 piece bonus, prior to killing him, however, our T8 gloves and leggings are 2nd BiS and will suffice until you get your drops. The set bonus is nice, it will add ~500 damage to a ShoR, and considering the gear isnt that bad, its worth getting til you down Algalon.

P.S. For the love of god, learn how to multi-quote, there's gotta be a forum rule against 5 back to back posts.

Also, it occurred to me just recently, that because the 2 pieces off Algalon are BiS for all 3 plate wearing tanks, this means we get to sacrifice a mediocre 4pc for better gear. War/DK have to sacrifice a 4pc that's worth a damn, and if they don't we'll be better tanks than they are because of it.

[cappytoi]

Also, it occurred to me just recently, that because the 2 pieces off Algalon are BiS for all 3 plate wearing tanks, this means we get to sacrifice a mediocre 4pc for better gear. War/DK have to sacrifice a 4pc that's worth a damn, and if they don't we'll be better tanks than they are because of it.

i like this optimistic view