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  1. #1

    *STICKY* Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    With so many outstanding DPS guides, there's no reason to make a new one; right? I disagree, there are few updated guides on the raid utility that a DPS (Arms) warrior can bring to a raid, and how to bring this utility without losing excessive amounts of DPS.

    This guide will assume that:

    • (1) You are the only warrior in your raid
      (2) You will be forced to interrupt at some point
      (3) You have a feral druid at your disposal whom has volunteered to keep up Mangle and Infected Wounds.

    Obviously, this isn't always the case, but I'm shooting for worse case scenario... In the even that you don't have a feral druid, that's easily resolved by a little more unique talent tree design. In addition, this guide will answer simple questions to rotations, caps, stat priorities, talents, with a slight spin on the desire to bring the maximum amount of raid utility. What kind of utility can you bring?

    A capable Arms warrior can bring the following to a raid:

    • -2.75% Damage dealt by bosses. (-50 Damage Per Second (DPS))
      +4% Physical Damage taken by bosses (+2000 Raid DPS (rDPS)).
      +30% Bleed Damage taken by bosses.
      +20% Armor Ignore when attacking a boss.(-500 DPS)
      +20% Armor Ignore for 20 seconds.
      +2,800 Health to all raid members. (-50 DPS)
      -20% Attack Speed of bosses. (-50 DPS)
      All while maintaining 4,000 to 6,000 DPS

    In the event some of my information (Especially in regards to "Unbridled Wrath" or "Demoralizing Shout") is wrong, let me know! Some of these talents (esp those mentioned) haven't been tested and posted since WoTLK, and it was pretty damn hard to find information on it. However, the information I do have would not be possible without help from quite a few individuals. So, a special thanks go out to the following websites/Individuals:

    Warcraftier -- My former guild, for forcing me to utilitasize my toon.
    Elitist Jerks -- For being an excellent source of information
    MMO Champion -- For being an excellent source of information
    Landsoul -- For practically leading the warrior forums on EJ in discovering new stuffs.


    I. Talents
    II. Rotation
    III. Q&A.
    IV. Interrupts
    V. Interface

    Something missing/incorrect? Let me know!
    Quote Originally Posted by Xheoul View Post
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  2. #2

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    I. [u]Step One: Talents

    There are a wide variety of specs for raid utility. However, for the sake of ease, we've assumed that you do not need to provide the above-mentioned (de)buffs, so we will not be exploring Trauma or Prot builds. If you do have to do this, then it's an easy fix (Remove points from Unbridled Wrath or Commanding Presence, and Anger Management; and place them in Trauma or Imp Thunderclap).

    Note: This is not a "DPS" guide, so we'll be ignoring the majority of the talents, and focusing on the "big" questions, and the utility questions. I'll assume that everyone knows (for example) that Second Wind is not a viable PVE talent.

    Axe Vs. Mace Vs. Sword

    Assuming the weapons are identical, differing only in genre, then Sword Sucks. Mace is acceptable, but inferior to Axe.

    Commanding Presence Vs. Improved Demoralizing Shout

    Commanding Presence 5/5 & Improved Demoralizing Shout 3/5

    Commanding Presence 3/5 & Improved Demoralizing Shout 5/5

    Which build is more attractive? Well, it's situational. I'm assuming that you have a ret pally with Improved Might, so we're looking at only the health aspect of Commanding Presence. As a result, commanding presence loses some of its luster. People assume that Commanding Presence is about tank health. It's actually not about the tank health as much as you would think. Yes, the tank does benefit from it, however the main benefit is raid health. The reason is effective health:

    • Bill is a tank.
      Bill has 40,000 HP.
      Sapphiron hits for 15,000 each time.
      Bill is hit for 15,000 (25,000 health left).
      Bill is hit for 15,000 (10,000 health left).
      Bill is hit for 10,000 (5,000 Overkill).
      Bill dies.

      Bill is a tank.
      Bill has 42,820 HP. (He is under the effect of Improved Commanding Shout)
      Sapphiron hits for 15,000 each time.
      Bill is hit for 15,000 (27,820 health left).
      Bill is hit for 15,000 (12,820 health left).
      Bill is hit for 12,820 (3,280 Overkill).
      Bill dies.

    The likely hood that a tank is 2,000 health (or less) from an effective health increase is slim on bosses. However, the likely hood that at least one (usually more) of 20 or so: DPS, or Healers is 2,000 health (or less) from an effective health increase from incidental or AOE damage is very high. This is not to say that tanks do not benefit from partial effective health increases (What if Bill had gotten a heal for 4,000 during that time, but not 7,000? He would have only have lived with Improved Commanding Shout), but to say that in my opinion the greater benefit is usually found in the raids' survivability.

    Improved Demoralizing Shout however, is almost solely used for tank survivability. However, tanks' are the keystone to any raid, more important than every other individual in the raid. Granted, without heals you cannot tank, nor without DPS can you kill it. However, the better the tank, the better the raid gets, quicker. So easing the role of tank survivability is always going to have high returns.

    In Burning Crusade, the "sweet spot" was 2/5 Demoralizing Shout, or 5/5 Demoralizing Shout with Curse of Recklessness, to negate the boss's AP to 0. However, based off of what I've read (in all 3 threads on the internet) there is now a return with every increase in Demoralizing Shout, up to 2.75% less damage taken by your tank (Note: Abilities based off of percentages scale!) (Reference: Elitist Jerks).

    Given the option of maxing out Commanding Presence, or Improved Demoralizing Shout, I believe that from a raid utility perspective, Demoralizing Shout wins. Going 5/5 Demoralizing shout, and 3/5 Commanding Presence grants you the highest amount of raid utility since the amount of health lost from 5/5 CP to 3/5 CP is only 300 hit points (and does not scale).


    Pericing Howl

    This talent is highly situational. If you come to a point where you have to kite (So far, I haven't encountered one), spec into it. Until then, save your talent points.

    Iron Will Vs. Tactical Mastery

    Tactical Mastery wins. In the event that you are Mind Controlled, dispells need to happen, or you need new raid members. As for the stun effect... save your bladestorm for when the stun happens; or suffer through it. The amount of situational gain you'll get from Iron Will is minimal. However, the ability to use a pummel interrupt (Don't think you'll have to? Wait to you get to General Vazex) without losing 90 rage; or the ability to disarm without losing 90 rage, can make or break your ability to provide utility or DPS in a raid, PVP, or farming environment.

    Unbridled Wrath

    5/5 in this talent grants you 100 rage or so per boss fight, if you never utilize your commanding or battle shout, this talent is good for helping you unlock Improved Execute without utilizing the Commanding Presence, or Booming Voice talents. Since nothing else grants a DPS increase except (lol -- Improved Cleave?), this talent is a must if you don't take Commanding Presence. (Example: this Spec).

    Blood Frenzy:

    The main benefit that Arms brings to the raid, is Blood Frenzy. So, when the question is asked by almost every Arms warrior: "Should I stay, or should I go [fury]?" The question can only be answered by taking a look at Blood Frenzy rDPS requirement. The numbers are averaged from WoL logs for the past months worth the Tuesdays.

    Physical DPS Percentages:

    • Rogue1= 46.5%
      R2= 47%
      Ret1= 43.2%
      Hunter1= 37.3%
      H2= 62.8%
      DK1= 47.5%
      DK2= 48.2%
      Enh1= 49.3%
      H3= 64.9%


    By this, we can extrapolate that:

    • Rogues = 46.8%
      Ret Pallies = 43%
      Surv Hunters = 37%
      Marks Hunters = 63%
      Unholy DKs = 48%
      Enh Shammies = 50%


    Assume an average of 8,000 DPS per person.

    Assume that everyone does 8,000 DPS and that everyone is present (read: heavier than normal comp).

    • 8,000 x .47 = 3680 x .04 = 147.2 x2 = 294.4 DPS
      8,000 x .43 = 3440 x .04 = 137.6 DPS
      8,000 x .37 x .04 = 118.4
      8,000 x .63 x .04 = 201.6 x2 = 403.2 DPS
      8,000 x .48 x .04 = 153.6 DPS
      8,000 x .50 x .04 = 160 DPS

    ===

    • Average gain of: 1,267 DPS.


    The following numbers were received from FESTERGUT (highest tank DPS fight).

    • Mundungu = <20%
      Lerr = 100%
      Brugg = 100%


    Assuming only the two 100% Phys DPS are present. Assuming average DPS of 5,500 (avg'd from last month of Festergut), we can extrapolate the following:

    • 5,500 x .04 = 220 DPS
      5,500 x .04 = 220 DPS

      Tank Gain = 440 DPS


    Obviously, if mund is present, the coeffecient for phys DPS would go down, resulting in blood frenzy rDPS loss.

    • Average gain of: 1,700 DPS.


    Let's add +300 DPS, just in case I fucked up somewhere, and to account for heroism, etc etc..

    • Assuming 8,000 DPS average there is a maximum gain of: 2,000 DPS.


    Incite Build:

    The incite build is a build used in ICC raiding meant to accompany the increase in AOE damage (thereby rage) and converting more HS into more frequent HS crits. There are several builds which will be listed below. However, first thing to note is the glyphing.

    Glyphing remains the same in normal fights (Saurafang, etc), but in high-rage encounters, such as Festergut or BQL, it may be beneficial (depending on your playstyle) to switch to "Glyph of Heroic Strike" in lieu of "Glyph of Execution." This benefit is furthered dependent on your frequency of HS, and (especially if you're low-expertise rotation (Which if you're Incite-Building, it is recommend you have <10 Expertise)) frequency of Execution.

    Incite Build W/o Glyphs.
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  3. #3

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    II. [u]Rotational Priorities

    Below are Arms "Rotational Priorities." This is just a guide, there are exceptions listed below.

    Key:

    Shaded icons are on CD (Taste for Blood & Mortal Strike), are not available (Sudden Death) or should not be used due to other, better, abilities being available (Slam/Sunder Armor).
    The yellowish orange bars are GCDs (Overpower causes a smaller GCD, however for simplicity I kept them all the same).

    How to Read the "Rotation"

    Basically -- It's an idea of what a rotation might look like. Stuff on the top has the highest priority, and stuff below it has lower priority.

    First GCD
    • Cast Rend

    Second GCD --> Overpower, Execute not lit up; Mortal Strike available.
    • Cast Mortal Strike

    Third GCD --> Overpower not lit up; Execute available.
    • Cast Execute

    Fourth GCD --> Overpower lit up.
    • Cast Overpower

    Fifth GCD --> Overpower, Execute, Mortal strike not lit up.
    • Cast Slam (Sunder Armor)

    Without Sunders:


    Note that overpower can be used at any time between the highlighted Taste For Blood procs (procs are above the second meter), but taste for blood CD will remain the same. For simplicity, I used overpower as soon as it was available.

    With Sunders:


    Note that this is the exact same rotation as before, with the same procs, the only difference is the subtitution of Sunder Armor for Slam. Once Sunder went on 5 times, Slam can be used again as a rage dump. Sunder Armor will be refreshed the next available GCD following rend refresh. (I.E. the first time Slam is an option following rend refreshment; Sunder Armor is refreshed)

    However, there are a few things that are not noted in this graphical representation:

    (1) This rotation is very RNG based, as such your rotation will differ.
    (2) This does not denote Commanding Shout, or Demoralizing Shout. These need to be kept up at all times. Ideally when environmental hazards keep you away from the boss, or during boss immunity times. If this is not possible, then refresh instead of Slam'ing.
    (3) This does not take into account DPS race scenarios. In scenarios where you must do X DPS in X seconds (XT hard mode during the heart phase), Sunder Armor takes precedence over your personal DPS. So, your Rotation is better serving your guild mates by simply "spamming" Sunder Armor.
    (4) This does not take into account environmental hazards forcing you to run from the boss. If at any point Sunder Armor has less than 5sec left on it's duration, it becomes your #1 DPS priority to refresh it.
    (5) This guide does not Queue Heroic Strike in rage excessive situations. Heroic Strike should only be queued during times when you have more than 70 rage, or times when you have more than 30 rage, and are "spamming" Sunder Armor.

    HIGH-Threat On-Pull Rotation

    CAUTION: This results in excessively high threat. While it can be used outside of BQL, it (personally) often results in my death. This is also done assuming you are an engineer (obviously omit engineering shit if you are not), and in an effort to perform as many actions/threat/DPS as possible to qualify for the psuedo random (read: who knows?) criteria for first bite.

    <---------5s-------------4s------------3s-----------2s-------------1s----------PULL-----------1s-----------2s-------------3s--------------5s---->
    +3,500 Armr Pot---Zerker Rage--Reckless---Bloodrage-----------------Charge-TClap------Rend------MS-----Bladestorm----/cancel--- OP
    ------------------------------Zerker Stance-------Battle Stance------------Heroic Throw-----------Sapper Charge-----------Hyperspeed------->

    To the left is pre-pull preperations. You down a 3,500 Armor Pot for +100 AP (Speed Pot tends to always put me over the edge from "pushing it" to "dead" - and since you're popping it 5s before the pull, rather than 1s, the armor pot lasts a LOT longer than the speed pot), pop zerker rage, recklessness, and then blood rage. On the pull you count to 1, then you charge/heroic throw, and thunderclap in that "I'm in range, but not melee range." The charge part requires excessive amounts of timing and good latency, but it is possible to get charge, HT, and TC off before you can actually engage. Then you open up with rend, hit Mortal Strike and Sapper Charge, then slam Bladestorm.

    /CancelAura Bladestorm after 2 seconds (should give you plenty of rage to start your rotation with a few HS's.), hit Overpower and Hyperspeed Accelerators, then continue your rotation as normal. This usually spikes threat to about 11k TPS, and spikes DPS/actions done to usurp the rogue getting MD'd on occasion. With the exception of putting Bladestorm on CD, you lose nothing but a 3,500 Armor Pot if the attempt fails.

    This will also synch up Heroic Throw and Zerker Rage to be used appropriately through the fight (One minute prior to air phase, and 5s prior air phase (so you can follow her and DPS, and then heroic throw when she flies up).

    INCITE BUILD-ROTATION:

    The incite build, as defined above, is merely the same rotation with the priority shifting from "Overpower when less than 4 seconds remaining" to simply "Overpower beats everything." In addition, you heroic strike more. It's really, as simple as that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Xheoul View Post
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  4. #4

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    III. [u]Simple Questions / Simple Answers

    O.M.G. Glyphs!?:

    Recommended glyph set up is: Mortal Strike, Rending, Execution.

    Bladestorm on Single Targets?:

    The only thing that makes Bladestorm better DPS is that it whirlwinds every second. Essentially, this is a "yellow" attack every second. Without bladestorm, you attack every 1.5s (GCD). In short:

    • Bladestorm gets 6 yellow hits in 6s.
      Non-Bladestorm gets 4 yellow hits in 6s.

    The only time Bladestorm is a DPS loss is when you have the rage to queue Heroic Strike with 2 of every 5, or more, attacks -- thus negating the extra 2 yellow attacks BS gets. In short, Bladestorm is for more than one target, or when you only have 25 rage, and Sudden Death and Overpower are on cooldown.

    Haste!?:

    Some situations, (such as XT hard mode) where you have heroism, speed pots, and/or engineering haste, your rotation get's very different. In situation's like this, personal CD rotation is very critical. For example, if you must use heroism and a speed pot at the same time, avoid using the speed potion while under the effects of other haste effects (such as Hyperspeed Accelerators). Best way to do this is to wait for the effects of your previous haste to fade before drinking the speed potion.

    In addition, using your Slam ability becomes much more detrimental. .5s delay on a 1.30 swing speed is a pretty big delay. So, you'll want to queue Heroic Strike for your rage dump (sometimes it'll need to be queued every second) and use Slam much more sparingly than before.

    What type of Buff food should I use?

    For Arms the ARP Hard cap is 90.00%, but the soft cap is 87.14% (1210 ARP, IIRC) Character Sheet ARP. This accounts for +10% from Battle Stance, and 2.86% from buff food. Why would you only bring your ARP to 87.14% and not 90.00% and eat str food? Simple question has a simple answer. This will cap your ARP quicker from gems, allowing you to gem 10str/10crit gems in for socket bonuses quicker.

    Shattering Throw:

    In the event you must Sunder Armor and Shattering throw (Yogg Brain room comes to mind), it is imperative that you do this in the right order. You'll want to apply rend, apply 5 stacks of Sunder Armor, Overpower, then Shattering Throw. Reason: ArP has a DPS increase that goes up in a curve. The more ArP, the better the return. Since it takes you ~7s to apply 5 stacks of Sunder Armor, and Shattering Throw only lasts 10 seconds, your "peak" time is only to 3 seconds. Whereas, by sundering first, your "peak" time is a full 10 seconds.

    Professions:

    The profession you pick is entirely up to you. For a pure passive bonus - JC / Blacksmithing is still the best combination out there. However: Alchemy, Engineering, Leatherworking, and Enchanting are all pretty competitive as well.

    • Engineering has the most raid utility; as well as added AoE (bombs), added mobility (nitros), and an additional cool down (Hyperspeed), all of which Arms lacks.
      Alchemy has mixology, which -- quite frankly is amazing. It's a huge money saver, and comes out to about +80 attack power when flasked.
      Leatherworking has their fur linings which are extremely versatile and cheap (ranging from 114 attack power to magic resistances).
      Enchanting has ring enchants.

    I would recommend Engineering/Alchemy as an arms warrior. With our DPS ending at the tip of our axe, and our lack of cooldowns, Engineering is an excellent way to counter our shortcomings. Alchemy is just a huge money saver. However, like I said, it comes down to your personal preferences and play styles.

    Stat Caps:

    Expertise:

    With no Weapon Mastery (WM) and no Strength of Arms (SoA), you need 214 expertise rating to remove the 6.5% dodge rate.
    With no WM and 2/2 SoA, you need 181 expertise rating
    With 2/2 WM and no SoA, you need 148 expertise rating
    With 2/2 WM and 2/2 SoA, you need 115 expertise rating
    Subtract 41 expertise rating if you're an Orc with axes or a Dwarf with maces.
    Subtract 24 expertise rating if you're a Human with sword or maces.


    Hit Rating:

    263 removing 8% miss rate.

    Armor Penetration (ArP): (Note that this section is still being discussed. This is Landsouls interpretation of the information, which can be found on Elitist Jerks.

    Unmodified cap =1232 rating
    Arms Cap = 1099 rating
    Arms + Mace Spec Cap = 907 rating

    Crit Rating (Soft):

    Soft cap for crit is 50% (the point where Overpower is at 100% critical strike chance)


    Stat Priorities:

    Stat priorities are based off of something called Strength Equivalency Points (SEP). Basically, this system assumes that Strength is "the" stat for warriors, and all other stats are compared to Strength. So, in essence, it helps determine which piece of gear is better, in relation to another.

    SEP Breakdown:

    • Strength = 1pt
      Attack Power = .45 pt
      Agility = .75 pt
      Crit rating = .90 pt
      Haste = .40 pt
      ArP = .85 pt

    Assuming this breakdown if you had two items with the following stats:

    • Item A (150 pts)
      +90 Strength (+90pts)
      +45 Critical Strike Rating (+40)
      +50 Haste Rating (+20)

      Item B (127 pts)
      +150 Attack Power (68)
      +56 Agility (42)
      +30 Critical Strike Rating (27)

    Item A > Item B for a warrior. However, SEP (especially in regards to Armor Penetration) is a fluid model, and sometimes (especially ArP) stat comparisons will change based on your spec, and/or gear needs. The most noted change occurs when you reach 40% passive ArP. At that point, it becomes advantageous to gem ArP over Strength, because the SEP of ArP becomes greater than 1.
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  5. #5

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    IV. [u]Interrupts -- FML

    We have two interrupts. They're both a massive pain in the ass, and will make you want to do naughty things to a light socket instead of raiding.

    Shield Bash and Pummel. Both are severe pains in the asses, and macro intensive. However, Shield Bash is superior to utilizing Pummel.

    Shield Bash

    I use a dual macro set up:

    /cast Shield Bash
    /equip Last Laugh
    /equip Wall of Terror

    /equip Worldcarver
    /cast Mortal Strike

    Contrary to split beliefs, shield bash is not on the weapon change GCD. So, provided you can mash the macro 3 times within the cast time, you can utilize this macro for all of your interrupting needs.

    Pummel

    #showtooltip Pummel
    /cast [nostance: 3] Berserker Stance
    /cast Pummel

    /cast Pummel
    /cast [nostance: 1] Battle Stance

    This macro is for interrupting when you need to zerker stance for another reason. (read: Recklessness, whirlwind, etc). On single targets, shield bash is superior.
    Quote Originally Posted by Xheoul View Post
    Send that bitch a smiley face...Bitches loooove smilie faces.

  6. #6

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    • V. [u]Your UI

      The UI is how you interact with the game. Everyone has different views on what's an attractive UI, or what mods are helpful, so on and so forth. Below are some useful macros, and mods that I use. The Screenshot (below) is a visual reference for showing Bartender, Omen, and Class Timers in action.

      Macros:

      "Cancel/Assist" (Will assist your focus target, or remove deadly/immunity auras)

      /assist focus
      /cancelaura Hand of Protection
      /cancelaura Sweeping Strikes
      /cancelaura Bladestorm
      /cancelaura Bloodrage
      /cancelaura Flexweave Underlay
      /cancelaura Enraged Regeneration
      /cancelaura Flash Freeze

      "Oh Shit!"

      /cast Shield Wall
      /equip Last Laugh
      /equip Wall of Terror
      /cast [nostance:2] Defensive Stance
      /cast Shield Wall
      /cast Shield Block
      /cast Enraged Regeneration
      /cast Fel Healthstone

      "Whirlwind"

      /cast Whirlwind
      /cast [nostance:3] Berserker Stance
      /cast Whirlwind
      /cast [nostance:1] Battle Stance

      "Disarm"

      /cast Disarm
      /cast [nostance:2] Defensive Stance
      /cast Disarm
      /cast [nostance:1] Battle Stance

      Recommended Mods:

      • Deadly Boss Mods
        Bartender
        Omen
        Power Auras

      Power Auras is a surprisingly helpful addon for Arms Warriors. You select "buff" or "when ability becomes available" then modify your image choice, size, color, and location to appear when your buff (battle shout) fades, or your abilities become available (overpower / execute).


      Battle Shout has just faded. Also: My rage is under 50 (look near the action bars)


      Overpower is now available.


      Execute is now available.
    Quote Originally Posted by Xheoul View Post
    Send that bitch a smiley face...Bitches loooove smilie faces.

  7. #7

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Nice. I have looked for someone who got the idea to just compile most of the good information out there and "trimming the fat" so to speak.

    Good work, copying this down now.

  8. #8

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Sticky please.

    My Awesome Sig Made By Shyama - Thank You!

  9. #9

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    i don't get the rotation images . they are too small to read or understand wtf is going on.

  10. #10

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Quote Originally Posted by failoth
    i don't get the rotation images . they are too small to read or understand wtf is going on.
    Modified the guide to include:

    Shaded icons are on CD (Taste for Blood & Mortal Strike), are not available (Sudden Death) or should not be used due to other, better, abilities being available (Slam/Sunder Armor).
    The yellowish orange bars are GCDs (Overpower causes a smaller GCD, however for simplicity I kept them all the same).

    Basically -- It's an idea of what a rotation might look like. Stuff on the top has the highest priority, and stuff below it has lower priority.

    First GCD
    • Cast Rend

    Second GCD --> Overpower, Execute not lit up; Mortal Strike available.
    • Cast Mortal Strike

    Third GCD --> Overpower not lit up; Execute available.
    • Cast Execute

    Fourth GCD --> Overpower lit up.
    • Cast Overpower

    Fifth GCD --> Overpower, Execute, Mortal strike not lit up.
    • Cast Slam (Sunder Armor)
    Does that help a bit more, failoth?
    Quote Originally Posted by Xheoul View Post
    Send that bitch a smiley face...Bitches loooove smilie faces.

  11. #11

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    yes that is helpful, thanks

  12. #12
    Deleted

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Helped me a whole lot
    Thanks for putting the time into making this.

  13. #13

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Item A (150 pts)
    +90 Strength (+90pts)
    +45 Critical Strike Rating (+40)
    +50 Haste Rating (+20)

    Item B (140 pts)
    +180 Attack Power (81)
    +56 Agility (42)
    +30 Critical Strike Rating (27)
    Thanks for a good thread. Just wonder. Arent this two items the same in points? I get Item B to 150pts aswell.

  14. #14

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Quote Originally Posted by Letharia
    Thanks for a good thread. Just wonder. Arent this two items the same in points? I get Item B to 150pts aswell.
    Fixed.

    Added: Table of Contents
    Added: Overview of Raid Utility discussed
    Added: References
    Added: Expertise Racials

    Fixed: A few incorrect ratings
    Fixed: Hundreds of grammatical errors

    Also, if there was something left out (or something, within reason, you would like to see in the guide) -- let me know. I'll throw it in there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Xheoul View Post
    Send that bitch a smiley face...Bitches loooove smilie faces.

  15. #15
    Mechagnome Direknyte's Avatar
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    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Very nice read, thanks for the time and effort you put into this.

    Sticky please!
    ;D

  16. #16

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    is it only me but isnt the hit cap for single weapons 9% and not 8%?
    atleast what I have read everywhere

  17. #17

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Quote Originally Posted by Carbunkle
    is it only me but isnt the hit cap for single weapons 9% and not 8%?
    atleast what I have read everywhere
    I've seen 9% and I've seen 8%.

    I just tested it, at 6.5% hit rating, after 100 melee swings, I missed 1. (1%)
    After 50 Mortal Strikes, I missed 0. (0%)

    So, I'm more inclined to believe the 8% posts. I could be mistaken though, if anyone knows if there's any new studies on the matter, I'll look into it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Xheoul View Post
    Send that bitch a smiley face...Bitches loooove smilie faces.

  18. #18

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    It was 8% all along, including TBC days.

    Somehow we all followed the person who said first that it's 9%. Just after WotLK kicked in, someone did the numbers again and came up with 8%. Then they [EJ most likely] re-did the numbers for TBC and yes, it was 8%.

  19. #19

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    please state the priority of abilities, assuming mortal strike, overpower and execute are all available

  20. #20
    Deleted

    Re: Raid Utility & You [Arms Warrior's Guide to Raiding]

    Arms is all about using every GCD.

    This is what I'm doing in raids with naxx 25 gear. I have poweraura's to see what attack is on cooldown, what has procced. All with TIMERS to see how long they are useable. I'm not claiming this is the best thing, but my guts tell me it's better than a standard prioritizing list.

    Remember that every fight is different and this is a most ideal situation on one static target and it only discribes priorities. And some fights that you can only use 3 GCD because that boss is almost down (or w/e) or you need to do a quick burst you should use the 3 most damage dealing abilities available for the rage you have instead of the best maintaining dps rotation. So don't use rend or MS if OP or/and SD are lit up. because OP and SD do more damage then MS and Rend.


    When prioritizing Overpower, Mortalstrike and Sudden death it all comes down to timers and rage.

    It's not a system that works like "Overpower > Mortal Strike > Sudden Death" and choose the one that's available if you want Optimum DPS. It does work good, but you could do better . SD does less damage with less rage and could mean you couldn't use MS on the next swing.


    • When rend does it last tick, use the first GCD to reapply. This above ALL!

    • Overpower becomes available every 6 seconds. So you need to use this ability every 6 seconds. Use it as a filler but certainly use it within the 6 second window. e.g. you have Overpower lit up, but also MS and/or SD (and rage>30), then use MS and SD first (which one I'll discuss later on). But if SD/MS lits up again just before the 6 seconds end and you have only 1 GCD left; you should use OP in stead. So you don't waste a OP proc but don't intervene with the other abilities as much as possible. so "use OP when you otherwise would have used Slam for the first time in the 6sec window or otherwise use it on the last GCD"

    • Sudden Death is a attack that's based on rage (max 30 ofc). So if you have low rage, like 10. You prioritize OP (assuming MS isn't lit up, and just used) and hope you get more rage so your SD does more damage. So "if you have low rage and your SD has the opportunity to get more rage and wouldn't intervene with an upcomming MS, prioritize OP".

    • Mortal strike has a CD of 5 sec. So this is predictable just like OP. To maximize your DPS, you should use your MS before your 6 sec OP window is close to it's ending and OP isn't used (if 35+ rage, else OP). Because now OP get's priority and you postpone MS with and extra GCD (maybe 2 because you need to reapply rend). So in the scenario you have to sit 5(?) secs without an MS and OP. While if you had prioritized it before SD, you'd had it 1/2 GCD earlier again. More MS = More attacks = More SD procs = More DPS. If MS and SD are lit up, I always use MS first because it has a CD. And the risk of leaveing you with <30 rage means you can't use a MS after the SD is a waste. usually when all are lid up and A few GCD are left in the 6 sec window and I'm at 50ish rage I do MS -> OP (hope to gain rage for a bigger SD hit) -> SD -> Slam etc

    So a few examples. (S/M/45) means SD and MS are lid up and I have 45 rage.

    (S/M/45) MS -> (S/30) SD -> (20) Slam -> (O/30) OP -> (50) Slam

    (S/60) SD -(MS refreshes)> (S/M/O/60) MS -> (S/O/40) SD -> (S/O/40) SD -> (S/O/40) OP -(OP and MS refreshes)> (S/MS/O/60) MS -> (S/O/10) OP -> (S/40) SD -> (15) Slam ->

    So a list of what to do in what situation:
    (S/M/O > 30)(last GCD) = OP
    (S/M/O > 30)(Not last GCD) = MS

    (S/M/O < 30)(last GCD) = OP
    (S/M/O < 30)(Not last GCD) = OP

    (S/M < 30) = SD
    (S/M > 30) = MS

    (S/O > 30)(last GCD) = OP
    (S/O > 30)(Not last GCD) = SD

    (S/O < 30)(last GCD) = OP
    (S/O < 30)(Not last GCD) = OP

    (M/O > 30)(last GCD) = OP
    (M/O > 30)(not last GCD) = MS

    (M/O < 30)(last GCD) = OP
    (M/O < 30)(Not last GCD) = OP

    (M > 30) = MS
    (M < 30) = Slam

    (S > 10) = SD
    (S < 10) = White hitz

    (O > 5 ) = OP
    (O < 5) = White hitz

    (any combinations > 70) = +HS
    (none > 15) = Slam
    (none > 70) = Slam + HS
    (Any Combination + Heroïsm/Bloodlust > 70) = HS
    (None + Heroïsm/Bloodlust > 70) = HS (so no slam!)


    It's always usefull to predict incomming rage! So have a swing timer to anticipate incomming rage and act acordingly. In the situation you have "(S/O < 30)(Not last GCD)" you should use OP. But if your swing hits just before GCD ends you should use SD! There are alot more of situations to discribe... Someone else?;d

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