3.2 holy

[apokteino]

PvE problem: Paladin healing routine is boring.
Solution: Make Beacon usable on more targets.
New PvE problem: Paladins are too good because mana regen is too high.
Solution: Nerf Illumination (+1 for Beacon -1 for Illumination = 0).

/sigh

is there really anyone out there who thinks rewarding mindless overhealing is more "interesting" or "skillful" than the way beacon currently works? this change honestly doesn't benefit you unless you have a hard time judging the dmg intake of your raid or are horrible at knowing how your raid healers react (read "are a scrub"). ironically in hardmode fights such as freya/hodir/XT, this is actually a large nerf to our raid healing capabilities as a steady stream of HLs is no longer viable.

so if these changes go live we end up we much weaker tank healers and raid healers... fml

[Dareios]

I think the outcoming of these nerfs are more like:

Nerf Illumination (+1 for Beacon -2 for Illumination = -1).

then again, I'm looking forward to the new BoL. Don't like the mana regen so much, but that's because I think that a 50% nerf to illumination is over the top. If this change goes through as it is now, then we'll just have to think about what we're doing. And I don't think this is encouraging anyone to overhealing, we overheal so much anyway.

[iktankniet]

could be the holy paladins we have, but they are asking alot for an innervate. how can they go oom if their regen is op?

[Nametaken]

As it stands, Beacon is just not a reliable way of keeping the MT up while you pop off heals on the raid. Any overheal on any member won't count, and won't transfer. This is why the new Beacon will help remedy this. Even if your heal target gets sniped, you can be rest assured it'll land on the tank, not to mention the range update.

@iktankniet: depends on their micromanagement (25 or 10 man by the way?). Standing at 75% mana during a phase transition and not popping DP just isn't too bright. Most holy pallies don't make enough use of SoW either...depending on the encounters I gain more from SoW than Illumination in Ulduar 10 (shhh).

I have to crunch some numbers, but Illumination gives me ~30% of my total regen. 15% will get knifed, but MP5 gets a 25% buff..then again we get a 5% intellect nerf...I can't wait for some numbers from the PTR.

All in all, even if they cut my total regen by 50%, I'm still gaining more than holy priests...now there's a problem area :

[nwo]

As terrible as the new holy pally changes are, at least when it comes to mana regen, a lot of people forget the fact that we have seal of wisdom. This is extremely OP because it gives 700-1k mana per swing proc. So, as long as seal of wisdom doesn't get changed, I think I'll be OK with the new changes now that I think about it. However, I am willing to be that seal of wisdom is definitely next on the list and sooner or later, it will be changed to a horrific and low base mana % which will be complete crap compared to what it is now.

[iktankniet]

As terrible as the new holy pally changes are, at least when it comes to mana regen, a lot of people forget the fact that we have seal of wisdom. This is extremely OP because it gives 700-1k mana per swing proc. So, as long as seal of wisdom doesn't get changed, I think I'll be OK with the new changes now that I think about it. However, I am willing to be that seal of wisdom is definitely next on the list and sooner or later, it will be changed to a horrific and low base mana % which will be complete crap compared to what it is now.

best tactic in 3.2 for holy

stand next to boss/mobs so you can hit him with SoW to get mana back while not healing

[Proffessor]

..beacause there is so much time to run up to a mob and smack it while your spamming your face off on a tank/raid member, moving out of fire, getting boiled to death/picked up like a snack.

I'm on the fence about these changes, copied my pally to the PTR tonight, but haven't got it installed just yet. They could work out, but I'm not making assumptions till I toss some heals around.

In the meantime, I'm gearing up my hunter... 4pc 7.5 + Arrowsong aquired this weekend woo!

[Raniz]

As it stands, Beacon is just not a reliable way of keeping the MT up while you pop off heals on the raid. Any overheal on any member won't count, and won't transfer. This is why the new Beacon will help remedy this. Even if your heal target gets sniped, you can be rest assured it'll land on the tank, not to mention the range update.

@iktankniet: depends on their micromanagement (25 or 10 man by the way?). Standing at 75% mana during a phase transition and not popping DP just isn't too bright. Most holy pallies don't make enough use of SoW either...depending on the encounters I gain more from SoW than Illumination in Ulduar 10 (shhh).

Agree, SoW is a great source of mana if you know how to use it properly, DP can be used more often than most people think aswell, just because you used it doesn't mean you can't click it away after a few ticks.

I have to crunch some numbers, but Illumination gives me ~30% of my total regen. 15% will get knifed, but MP5 gets a 25% buff..then again we get a 5% intellect nerf...I can't wait for some numbers from the PTR.

I did some quick calculations earlier today and for me the Illumination/int nerf combined with the mp5 buff will be about 10% - which is a significant amount, but it won't stop me from using HL a lot either.

All in all, even if they cut my total regen by 50%, I'm still gaining more than holy priests...now there's a problem area :

I think we burn a lot more mana than Holy Priests aswell, we're not a very mana efficient class since we rely on getting mana back from our casts.

[darthreaper]

This BS who else get nerf every patch beside a holy pally. They took illumation down form a 100% to 70% to 60% and now 30% why does blizzard hate us so much. I probably am going to stop raid with my pally switch to my ele shammy. I playing a holy pally for over 5 years now and I sick of all this BS. Great job blizz your make player not want play their character they leveling and raided with.

[apokteino]

As terrible as the new holy pally changes are, at least when it comes to mana regen, a lot of people forget the fact that we have seal of wisdom.

the only reason this hasn't been nerfed yet is b/c blizz is too stupid to figure this out. did you see GC's breakdown of paladin mana regen? lmao. as soon as they catch on, you can say goodbye.

also, nametaken... beacon IS a reliable way to keep your tank capped on most of the fights in ulduar. if you 1) understand the dmg intake of your raid group 2) know how your raid healers will respond to the damage and 3) always keep a close eye on your tank as you "raid heal" you should almost never have any problem. what blizz did is dum the game way way down for you. maybe paladins weren't having "fun" because they have a hard time using the spell mechanics to their advantage? the only thing that needed tweaked on beacon was the range. overlap is nice too now.

[Taotao]

best tactic in 3.2 for holy

stand next to boss/mobs so you can hit him with SoW to get mana back while not healing

Maybe it is just me but on 90% encounters i there is no way i have time for more than _maybe_ 1 melee hit.Talking about hard modes or tough achievements as pretty much only those count (since normal mode is pretty much faceroll , doesnt matter what you do and im not elitist here ;/), pretty much every single fight is very intensive and im casting almost whole fight ,stop even for couple seconds means something will die.

[Raniz]

Maybe it is just me but on 90% encounters i there is no way i have time for more than _maybe_ 1 melee hit.Talking about hard modes or tough achievements as pretty much only those count (since normal mode is pretty much faceroll , doesnt matter what you do and im not elitist here ;/), pretty much every single fight is very intensive and im casting pretty much whole fight ,stop even for couple seconds means something will die.

Raidbuffed you will usually get a hit in every time you cast an instant and we actually have plenty of those that we should use quite often.

Beacon, Sacred Shield, Judgement, Holy Shock and Flash of Light after a HS crit.

Holy Shock will guarantee that you get one melee hit every 6 seconds when you're standing next to the boss.

[sfortune]

PvE problem: Paladin healing routine is boring.
Solution: Make Beacon usable on more targets.
New PvE problem: Paladins are too good because mana regen is too high.
Solution: Nerf Illumination (+1 for Beacon -1 for Illumination = 0).

I think its lazy to do that to beacon and the Nerf, in my opinion has ruined all the synergy in the holy tree (based around crit).

I also think that if they are now going to force us down the root of the prot tree for divine guardian they need to sort the high end of the tree out. Why the hell should we spec anticipation, stoicism and toughness for holy pve.

[iktankniet]

Maybe it is just me but on 90% encounters i there is no way i have time for more than _maybe_ 1 melee hit.Talking about hard modes or tough achievements as pretty much only those count (since normal mode is pretty much faceroll , doesnt matter what you do and im not elitist here ;/), pretty much every single fight is very intensive and im casting almost whole fight ,stop even for couple seconds means something will die.

i know. was being sarcastic

[nwo]

..beacause there is so much time to run up to a mob and smack it while your spamming your face off on a tank/raid member, moving out of fire, getting boiled to death/picked up like a snack.

It's a lot better than saying "oops, I'm oom, sorry I can't heal you anymore".

I think that if you time it right, you could technically stand right next to the boss, melee him, and cast in between while waiting on your next melee swing.

I'm not saying that you will be able to do this 100% of the time on every boss fight, but it sure is a good backup strategy and theoretically, an infinite source of mana regen which everyone seems to be QQing about even though holy paladins have never had mana issues.

This BS who else get nerf every patch beside a holy pally.

DKs.

[Proffessor]

About the only time that would work is during transitions where you have the time to beat on some adds that need cleanup, or when needed healer count drops, like when Razor comes down.

I'm not saying its totaly un-viable, but it has very limited applications, and isn't really something to count on. The only time during most fights that matter I acctualy try to hit stuff these days, is to refesh ye ole' haste buff, thats usualy it. I just don't typicaly have time to do much else, but I'm a bit of a 'holy crap these other healers are slllooowwwww' kinda guy, and try to heal as many as I can as fast as I can :P.

[Jathro]

PvE problem: Paladin healing routine is boring.
Solution: Make Beacon usable on more targets.
New PvE problem: Paladins are too good because mana regen is too high.
Solution: Nerf Illumination (+1 for Beacon -1 for Illumination = 0).

Beacon and mana regen are in no way related aside from the fact they're both associated with pallys. Beacon has always been usable on all players anyway. Any good healer was already managing Beacon well without needing to overheal to make it effective.

How about this way instead...

PvE problem: Paladin healing routine is boring.
Solution: Suck it up. Heal the tank and quit complaining.

And besides - The Beacon change isn't a +1. Illumination is a -2. So 0 - 2 = -2 overall. Thanks for nothing, blizz.

[Caean]

The problem with balancing out beacon and the nerf to illumination like that is that putting a beacon on someone and only healing them doesn't come close to matching the nerf.

What would balance it out would group beacon where whatever you cast on the MT is split over 5 people.

[Mutin]

Change beacon to something like the HL glyph.

"Whenever you heal that target, 50% of the healing done is split over 5 raidmembers"

50% is not that OP, if you fx. heal 10k, you heal 5 raidmembers for 1000 each.

[Caean]

5 raid members within 8-10 yards with a CD would be interesting.

It would make us have to strategically choose whom to beacon and when.

Of course we already had something similar and they nerfed it and it required us to actually pick and choose whom to heal for the splash on HL.

I don't see them revisiting that, unfortunately.

Therefore the answer, should there be one, is probably to limit it to the group the paladin is in.

That kills the idea of it being a beacon though, unless you're going to force beacon to be group only at all times.