Shadow priest dps

[syanid]

If you have such cool uptime of "black shit", why the hell do you bother to have any dot up except swp?

[Zoulis]

Lower Dps specc than shadow priests? that isn't a right meter of comparison cause u don't have the skill of the player in there....
also no other dps's in my raid aren't horrible... they are pretty good i could say.... it's just i am keeping up.....haven't seen my self below 5th in dmg meters in a long time...
So really stop hating Spriest DPS..if u get to master rotation etc it can be high.....
And yeh for me it is one of the funnest classes to play so even if we go down in dps i will go on playing Spriest...
Oh and ... blizz plx give us some kind of buff
Cheers
Zoulis

[Bizatch]

dps on SP is nice on some fights but i agree generally we dont compete enough.

BUT THEN
what other caster is basically invincible, we do no threat basically, we never lose health due to health regen. dispersion at the right time is pro.
now this makes us great for soaking dmg, IC hard etc.

one thing that does annoy me is being top 1-2 on almost every fight in 10m, yet in 25 we seem to not increase with raid buffs. dunno if thats just me but other classes seem to do alot more dps raidbuffed than in a 10m, we dont. IMO

all in all SP are gods of hardmode, especially 10m. are dps isnt terrible, (if it is its you, not your class)

just stop QQ theres so much more to us than dps.

[[-Spiritus-]]

Slightly off-topic... but has Spriest become a FotM somehow? I've never seen such an influx of Spriest topics at once...

[syanid]

In arena sp has become FoTM, paired with shammy and lock / rogue tho. Never met so many shadow priests and some are at 2.7k ratings. At least something's going ok for shadows

I guess people learned to love the purple color.

[crimsonclovers]

VE should be changed imo, The current version heals for a insignificant amount on others, its simply good for aoe damage that you can dps through for healing yourself, what it should be is a castable buff on 1 person in your group, that target is healed for 25% of shadow damage you deal and all other party members are healed for 5%, can only be placed on one target at a time, and the target can only have 1 buff on it.

Sooo That way you can't stack shadow priests and can help out on healing filler damage.

[Proletariat]

Spriest is hardly fotm, just because shadowplay works again doesnt mean you're gonna be swarmed by them

[fabian]

VE should be changed imo, The current version heals for a insignificant amount on others, its simply good for aoe damage that you can dps through for healing yourself, what it should be is a castable buff on 1 person in your group, that target is healed for 25% of shadow damage you deal and all other party members are healed for 5%, can only be placed on one target at a time, and the target can only have 1 buff on it.

Sooo That way you can't stack shadow priests and can help out on healing filler damage.

The problem with VE is that if you buff it too much, you could literally bring spriests in each group and have them do enough dps so that you don't have to bring a lot of AoE healers. Although I do agree that is should be a friendly buff instead of a debuff to the enemy, since the only time it would heal would be if you're focusing on the npc you put it on, which would make it a waste of fights with a lot of AoE.

[Gensui]

VE should be changed imo, The current version heals for a insignificant amount on others, its simply good for aoe damage that you can dps through for healing yourself, what it should be is a castable buff on 1 person in your group, that target is healed for 25% of shadow damage you deal and all other party members are healed for 5%, can only be placed on one target at a time, and the target can only have 1 buff on it.

Sooo That way you can't stack shadow priests and can help out on healing filler damage.

Umm...these #s are rediculous.

Assuming you can do 5k dps, then you would be healing the target for 1250hps and everyone else in the raid for 250hps bringing your total to 7250hps in a 25 man raid.

5kdps +7.25khps? You'd never need to bring a healer into the raid again!

[Sharaki]

If you have such cool uptime of "black shit", why the hell do you bother to have any dot up except swp?

Becouse scaling sucks and dots do higher dps than flay even if you stand on black shit?

[Kirkis]

My guild stategy is all ranged on the Snaplasher, the melee camp burn the two others down in the same period of time. I'm not allowed to multi-DoT anything, because it would pretty much wipe us.
Yet I keep seeing rogues and Death Knights beating me to it, if there's not roots or a tree they have to handle at the same time. FoK's unlimited range is just fucking stupid.
If you end up in Top 5 you either:
- Brought to little melee (moar rogues already!)
- Have terrible melee
- Have bad casters

Multi DoT what? My guild stategy involves only having 2 available Targets to DoT, and focus targeting one of those so constant we cannot affort to DoT junkbots for meter-whoring. It's not efficient damage, specially not post nerf.
Again, my guild stategy is different from yours, if I dps anything but the head it's more likely to cause a wipe than not. And we been doing Firefighter25 every week for a while.

I disagree, frost mages can do far more dps than us. However we're borderline with warlocks on this fight, so I guess that's alright for once.
I find my Mind Blast is interrupted to often due to movement, and our DoT damage is minimal compared to that of a affliction warlock. I don't think we shine more than any other caster on that fight, and we're terrible due to lack of burst for Constrictors.

Multi-dotting is just a wet-dream with the terrible-efficient melee my guild have. Doing focused damage on a big tenacle, rather than meter-whoring by doing useless dotting here and there, is so much more efficient from a overall-fight-perspective!
So to sum up, the efficiency of multi-dotting disappears with better fight knowledge, and becomes moot with different strategies, and is more a perspective of meter-whoring, than efficient damage.

#1 Keeping your dots up on all three adds causing a wipe? I have yet to see that cause a wipe. It's just about getting them all three dotted up, focus fire on snaplasher when that's done, and keep up dots. I don't really see why that is a problem. And I don't think my guild suffers from any of the points you mentioned.

#2 Let's go through the fight. Phase 1: Single target. Phase 2: Single target. Phase 3: focus fire on head, dots on assault bots. Phase 4: Dots on all three targets, and focus on whatever part you've been assigned to. I don't see why that would be the cause of a wipe.

#3 Maybe you are doing it wrong then. Try keep MB out of your rotation the next time you do vezax (granted it's hardmode and you're only casting in black shit). As it is now, it isn't worthwhile having MB in your rotation with such a huge amount of haste bonus you get.

#4 Sure you can't keep MB on cooldown with all the running, but other casters are having the exact same issue. Thing is, when you're doing +1 and +0 dotting all you see that pops up is really worthwhile and helps you in the long haul so that no shit is up on phase 3. If we talk about the +0 fight, you'll find that together with having dots running on yogg, and us being able to abuse mind flay a little, we're also needed for the heavy aoe damage that needs going on the guardians everytime a beacon hits. Okay, so maybe we're not outshining those bastard rogues, but we are certainly not not underperforming, not if you ask me.

This is merely my view on things.

So to sum up, maybe I exaggerated a bit when I placed SP's that high in all those fights, but in all honesty it is really doable to shine alot on these fights.

[dahighpriest]

VE should be changed imo, The current version heals for a insignificant amount on others, its simply good for aoe damage that you can dps through for healing yourself, what it should be is a castable buff on 1 person in your group, that target is healed for 25% of shadow damage you deal and all other party members are healed for 5%, can only be placed on one target at a time, and the target can only have 1 buff on it.

Sooo That way you can't stack shadow priests and can help out on healing filler damage.

I think in it's current state, it's OKAY. I think it could use a little buff to the party member's regen, but not too much. Remember, it's a % based on the damage you do. It's great for incoming AE damage, but at other times it's 95% overheal, and has been since BC.

[Kirkis]

Your guilds other dps classes suck if you have shadow priests coming in the top 3 regularly on all the fights.

Locks, DKs, rogues, hunters, Mages, all do significantly more damage on all fights. Some classes dont even need to be as equally geared as the shadow priest to do it either. Given equal skill and ilvl for everyone in the raid, a shadow priests will be roughly 5-10 on almost all fights. The couple of fights we do really well on are mimiron and Yogg.

I don't think I said we we're super ultimate awesome on every single fight in the game. I merely mentioned the fights we are noticable in. Dependant on playing style, some more than others.

[Kirkis]

Could u please link a wwsstat report or the like (atleast a screenshot) of ur highest vezax hardmode dps


lolret, fury warrior on fights were is no incoming ae dmg and boonkins dont do the best dps either.

We're not running any combat parses that I'm aware of. We did vezax today, unfortunately I only just checked this thread now. If you really want a screenshot of some damagemeter, i'd like you to write a pm to me, and i'll remember to make a screenshot of the next resets vezax.

[Kirkis]

Multi-dotting multiple targets to pad the meters is useless. If it makes you happy at the end of the day to make it look like you did a lot of damage done, then fine. I would agree that there is some fights where this would be useful, Mimiron p4 for instance. Regardless to multi-dotting being useful, I don't really see this as a reason to 'bring' an spriest.. as I'd rather pickup another lock.

Multi-dotting isn't something I do to "look cool on damagemeters" but to actually ease out the stress of everyones job in the fight. Let's say YS +0. If all our sp's, locks and other casters didn't focus at all on any of the corrupters at all, it would be a constant run against a brick wall that wouldn't move at all. With everyone multi-dotting and helping where they can, they make everything much easier.

But maybe we need a singletarget buff, maybe we not. I don't mind not being top5 on every single bossfight in the game.

[xSoul]

Nezoia I rly dont get your point. Im just wondering how u did such a progress with such a bullshits.

I will leave your blabling bout Vezaxx coz its pretty random fight, but still I can top meters while finishing fight with 5-6k mana. But ok, its fine.

But not tell me please why ar u soo fukkin against multidotting on mimiron or yogg lol?


Lets start with mimiron - p4 is to bursts his parts ASAP before either u die or ur teammates coz of unlucky fires or something like that. So tell me how can you wipe RAID with multidotting 3 parts and mindsearing it? Coz rly you will do 3x more dmg in p4 coz Sear is way better filler than MF so you wont loose any single target dmg srsly. Same with yogg - if you prefer to do more dmg via MF on crusher than do lets say 10x more dmg overall than with MF just by dotting small tentacles close to you then your playstyle is 1 big fail . Ofc no offence to you but if you do only what you ar ALLOWED then its not good, or maybe ur raid leader knows every class play mechanics way better than players itself.

AAh and highwind01 do you get difference betwen DPS and dmg done?

Mage can do on vezaxx lets say 12k dps, while I can do lets say 6k and I will still do more dmg than he, coz my dps uptime is 100% coz of ticking dots while mage is dpsing only while standing in black shits.

Anyways if you hate spriests so much then check some top wws on some fights and check best spriests in action. For example hav u ever thought that spriest cna put 18k dps on hodir?

What?

From this post I can say that you:

A. Are just a meter whore.
B. Probably Mind Sears on Emalons adds. (see A)
C. Probably have never done hard mode Vezax or has terrible mages in your guild. (won't bother to check your armory)
D. Only does Yogg + 4 and gets excited because you got 7k DPS.
E. Lies about Hodir DPS. Can I have a SS of that 18k DPS on Hodir? From a spriest, not a mage.

[MushroomBomb]

The way I see it, Shadowpriests are alright at the moment. We have lots of utility, but not the best single-target damage. Yes, I realise single-target damage doesn't count ridiculously much on many bosses, but most big raid instances usually have at least one or two bosses that are almost pure single-target exercises. So in that sense, we need a buff.

In essence, I'm more than willing to suffer a little single-target damage for utility, but I think that we're suffering too much at the moment. I am, quite frankly, just glad we're not what we were in TBC.

[Nezoia]

@Kirkis:

#1 Yes, because if I multi-dotted the other adds, they would simply, die to fast. Compared to the Snaplasher that is. It's easier for me NOT to multi-dot, than it is to tell our melee to stop doing damage.

#2 Again, if we have all casters focus on the head only, melee takes care of the rest pretty much. It would be pointless meter-whoring to multi-dot in P4, as the real effect on damage is marginal they way we do the encounter.

#3 Maby our mages just don't suck, considered that instead?-) The shadowpriests isn't bottom dps, that's not what I'm saying. I'm just saying that other classes benefit more, and the general itemization makes the haste worth less than it should. But lets all be headless chickens refusing to believe anything could ever possible be wrong. Ignorance is bliss.

#4 I'm not saying we're underperforming, far from. I'm merely saying that some strategies, including ours, makes shadowpriests as a class stand out much less. I would much enjoy having a higher coefficient on Mind Flay, and a lower damage on VT and SW:P.

That would also make haste be more equally in worth, compared to other casters, such as warlocks.

Still, I don't get the hostility in towards me relying my personal raid experience, rather than theory-crafting from a simulator. I've seen many different strategies, which each boosted different types of damage/classes. Why do everybody suddenly think there's only one way of doing things?

[Worshaka]

I don't discount what Nezoia has just posted... however is shadow priest dps so low as to compromise the raid? Is it so low that raids will refuse to bring shadow priests? I don't think so and I bet a lot of guilds don't think so either. If that is the case then what does it matter what your physical numbers are? I find i'm on average about 200 - 300 dps behind mages and locks on the average encounter. Of course we get blown out of the water occasionally, just think of our dps compared to feral druids on XT. But over the course of content i'm in the ball park to most other dps classes and definitely comparable to cloth dps casters.

It comes back to people feeling that meters are the only measuring tool, if I top the meters I'm the best dps in the raid... to me that's a bunch of crap. I don't need to top meters to know i've performed well nor do I need to top meters to carry my weight in the raid. I play a spriest due to the dnymaic spell rotation and the nifty survivability abilities we enjoy and I also get the ability to switch to Holy and do some very decent healing.

So again what Nezoia proposes seems quite reasonable but i'm not sure it's necessary unless your ego needs some stroking and the meters to confirm what you already think about yourself.

[Nezoia]

Is it so low that raids will refuse to bring shadow priests?

Our raid leader decided to swap one of the two shadowpriests out for a warlock, on the middle of our Algalon (25man) tries.

Simply because that's 1000 more dps (at least). Nothing we can do about it. With so many other classes having replenishment, the argument for our lowered dps in return for utility is rather small today.

A slight upgrade of the single-target dps, would make us more viable in encounters like Algalon, but also for Freya, Hodir and Yogg-Saron. A problem I've highlighted before is that our Mind Flay damage is to locked to SW:P, and it's not smart to put up SW:P to do two MFs and then the target is dead, and simply not maintainable either in terms of mana, as the nerfed replenishment also hit our mana pool.

I also feel our damage in Ulduar haven't scaled as greatly as the other direct casters, and the stats on the gear been less beneficial than they should have been, even including hardmode gear. As the Crusaders Coliseum is hardly started yet, it's to early to judge, but I'm afraid we'll be pushed even more back in the effective dps list, without a change to the mechanics of Mind Flay.

A removal of the SW:P link would be the least we can ask for!