Class Discussions Panel

[Xentropy]

For casters, the changes really won't make a huge difference. Spellpower is just on every single cloth item in the entire endgame. Period. Removing spellpower and rolling it into intellect does absolutely nothing except shorten the item descriptions. Rolling mp5 and spirit together doesn't change a whole lot either, really, since as it is now spirit is just mp5 that only works for some classes instead of all. Melee has always gotten more out of raw stats than casters have, so it makes sense to make casters actually give a damn about a base stat.

[Thorgred]

Personally I am pleased about the Mp5 removal. Mp5 is boring, and it created the need for more different types of loot (ie, Mp5/crit, Spirit/crit, Mp5/hit, Spirit/hit etc etc)

I am a little worried that gear might start to look boring. 100 Stamina, 100 Crit, 100 Intellect.... Also unless the conversion rate is done well, I personally like having spell power as a visible stat and hate having to make the mental % conversions when I have talents that do that.



Number one thing that annoys me out of all those lists: Defense rating removal.
As a dedicated tank i plead PLEASE do not do this. It is useful for people to be able to throw on a set of tank gear and play well in it as a different spec, (especially as you can't rely on everyone to have dual talent spec). You consciously removed +Defense talents when WotLK hit so that it was possible (for example) to tank as a ret-specced paladin. You said you wouldn't balance the game around people having dual spec, but this seems like a step in the wrong direction.

[Pert]

not everyone enjoys drawing up spreadsheets to figure out stats. this will be much better and brings things back to the way they were pre-BC.

Does anyone actually do that? I feel like that's such a bullshit argument.

I stack int gems on my Paladin, I stack SP gems on my Warlock. Why? Because those are the stats that they scale best with.

So next xpack I can stack int gems on both toons, and that's supposed to be progress?

If anything it's simpler not to have to figure out how much SP you'll get from the int that's replacing SP on everything. I like to think that the whole reason they added these new stats to begin with is because it was getting stale.

[Dæs]

For casters, the changes really won't make a huge difference. Spellpower is just on every single cloth item in the entire endgame. Period. Removing spellpower and rolling it into intellect does absolutely nothing except shorten the item descriptions. Rolling mp5 and spirit together doesn't change a whole lot either, really, since as it is now spirit is just mp5 that only works for some classes instead of all. Melee has always gotten more out of raw stats than casters have, so it makes sense to make casters actually give a damn about a base stat.

QFT.... stats are not getting removed, they are making base stats more important for every class to simplify gearing, can't wait to see what is announced tomorrow and get more info.

[Ottius]

First off, I have to say for the record, Hunter weapon. Now that I have that out of my system, it's about time! Tbh, the legendary bow doesn't really count. Maybe 3 hunters per server had it, as well as rogues and warriors trying to take the bow too, which makes no sense at all. But anyway, besides the bow hunters have only been able to use 1 other legendary, Thunderfury, which wasn't something hunters used in vanilla anyway because for one Rogues Warriors and Pallies were getting the pieces well before hunters, which does make sense.

Back on track though, this will be the first legendary for hunters specifically, even if it is a dk weapon as well. Hopefully there won't be too many haters, so please just go with it. Anyway, who really expected to actually use THE Frostmourne? Very Very evil here people, I don't think the gods of WoW would want a player with that sword. I mean, come on, right now if you can solo stuff that used to take 20 people, you would become one huge badass, and turn into a superman version of the Lich King. Nobody wants that. So I, for one, am just gonna go with it, and enjoy the novelty. And I hope Blizz doesn't screw it up too bad. Have fun, and please don't be too flamish about it, It's really annoying to scroll through 15 pages of flaming just to see a decent discussion.

You are right. Except, everything. It will be the 3rd legendary for hunters. Otherwise, if we follow your logic, paladins did not have ANY legendary item. Hand of Ragnaros was in the times where there were no retribution paladins (except duels) and Thunderfury was in the times with no protection paladins (anywhere). Maybe 3 paladins per realm will have Val'anyr.
Same goes for casters. 3 casters (all classes combined, except Paladins) per realm had Atiesh. And 3 casters per realm will have Val'anyr (mages and warlocks won't even had that).

So, please, stop thinking that hunters are so poor and miserable that they deserve something more than any other classes.

atleast now with hunters not using mana, enhancement shamans wont have to roll against anyone for their gear

Yeah, and everyone will QQ and cry about int mail like they do now about spell power plate.

Ok, are you proud of yourself? You drove me to create an account on this website, because I was sick of hearing your verbal butthurt.

You're completely missing the big picture. Alliance also has one extra of a class, which balances, if not tips the scales in favor of the Alliance. Alli now officially, in the Worgen, has one extra what? What is this? Druid. The class that was limited to not 4, not 3 races, but one. There was originally ONE class per faction that could use a druid. And quite enjoying them, and knowing that there were only one per faction, kind of annoyed me as the alliance were getting another race that could use them. One more shaman on the Horde side (that could originally use them!) shouldn't be as big of a deal.

http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...trix_en_US.jpg

What tips the scales in favor of the Alliance? Alliance still gets 13 new class/race (43 overall) combinations, and Horde gets 14 (44 overall). So you kinda just embarrassed yourself and wasted your own time by creating an account.

[DaLeetPawner]

HOLY MOTHER OF CHUCK NORRIS GODS! I didnt see THIS coming! This is REALLY interesting! (I play since Vanilla) Imho this is the change WoW needed.

[Exhorder]

I find the "Itemization" part very scary.

[Combobreaker]

No more soulbags!! Yeees!

[Eärendil]

The focus thing for hunters....ripoff from Lord of the Rings Online? ;D

[rimmer]

AP gone, ArmP gone, mp5 gone, SP gone ...World of Easycraft! And that's because these damn casuals are to stupid to choose their gear well?

omg blizz has changed something is must be for people who only play 2 hours a week!

[Vigrans]

NO WORGAN SHAMMYS. BLIZZ YOU GOT SOME SPLAINING TO DO.

Dude, look at them, they are humans, they have the same classes as humans except for paladin, which is reasonable since they built a big wall instead of using the light against the scourge :P We saw in the trailer a worgen standing with a night elf. Mabye the Nelfs learned them a trick or two ? That explains the Druid imo

[rimmer]

Why do people act like Blizzard is going to change how things are itemized? What's with this notion that things are going to be obvious upgrades or obvious downgrades? It's going to be exactly like it is now, certain pieces will favor certain stats and you'll have to tradeoff to build a specific way.

To change your example, here's what I expect things like rings to be itemized:

Random Cataclysm Ring 1 (iLvl 300)
100 Stamina
85 Intellect
60 Spirit
Increases critical strike rating by 72.

Random Cataclysm Ring 2 (iLvl 300)
107 Stamina
70 Intellect
85 Spirit
Increases critical strike rating by 60.

Random Cataclysm Ring 3 (iLvl 300)
103 Stamina
74 Intellect
72 Spirit
Increases haste rating by 38.
Increases critical strike rating by 36.

You're still going to have to make choices for gear. Do you want:
A - A heavy spellpower/crit ring with low regen.
B - A heavy regen ring with low spell power/crit.
C - A balanced spellpower/regen ring with low crit, but with additional haste.

Please, let's try to think about this logically.

i havent read the following 5 pages yet but i'm willing to bet this post got ignored by all the QQing elitist wannabes

Edit: what a surprise, i wasnt wrong.

[Reverendo]

omg remove all bonus in item game

[rimmer]

I'm kind of curious as to how this change may effect Enhancement Shamans. As it is now they both share the same type of gear but if hunters no longer need mana will shamans see a decrease in mana cost on Shocks and Lightning Bolt or will they get a talent to increase their mana pool or improved mana regen?

This is of course assuming Intellect is removed from the physical dps mail.

i'd imagine the intellect = spellpower change has a lot to do with the change in hunter design, whereas it's still useful for enh shammies.

[Deleted]

Well there is alot of changes, but i am actually a little bit excited

[Dent]

As someone already mentioned; If Blizzard doesn't do anything new, people QQ about them being too lazy, if Blizzard [i]does[i] do something new, people QQ and whine their arses off, claiming they're ruining the game.
I myself must admit, I was quite sceptical to *ALOT* of the changes, but a couple of things (Or more ) seem pretty darn interesting, so of course I'll be giving it a shot, although, I must admit, Spirit on my Shaman? ??? =(

[G l o w y r m]

NERDRAGE INC , but seriously thats alot of stats gone. I guess it's easier for them to code gear into new raids now though!

Chest
314 Armor
+120 intellect
+81 Spirit

GG

1000 dkp plox

Do you guys realize that it's the SAME EXACT THING whether an item looks like this or as another 5 lines of green letters?

They are making the tooltips less confusing and jumbled. These changes will really streamline everything and make itemization for them much easier and picking items for us easier.

All good things so far. I can't wait.

[Riltia]

As someone already mentioned; If Blizzard doesn't do anything new, people QQ about them being too lazy, if Blizzard [i]does[i] do something new, people QQ and whine their arses off, claiming they're ruining the game.
I myself must admit, I was quite sceptical to *ALOT* of the changes, but a couple of things (Or more ) seem pretty darn interesting, so of course I'll be giving it a shot, although, I must admit, Spirit on my Shaman? ??? =(

Oh so freakin' true. But now you won't worry about having MP5 and Spirit on your gear

For those saying it's all about casuals, go get stuffed. It isn't. Most players (including myself, and I'm no means a casual) feel swamped with the number of stats we have, and don't give a shit about them. Anyways, most are still staying! It means more iLevel points for stats like Intellect, Spirit, Stamina... The ones people really care about. The removal of spirit for mages/warlocks brings back something missing in WotLK - Distinct gear. As a Warlock and a Priest, I basically roll on the same gear (apart from +Hit, ofc). DPS Casters roll on healer gear, and healers roll on DPS caster gear. That's not a great situation for either party. Sure they could bring back Spell Damage/Spell Healing, but where does that get us? Oh, more confused. I mean, come on, there's items in game (for level 80s) with Spirit and MP5 on. What on Earth is that about? Priests (And Druids/Mages/Locks) would benefit more from the Spirit, I think it's Disc priests would rather drop the spirit for MP5 (as would Holydins, Resto Shammies). That's not an item, it's confusion waiting to happen.

As for the warlock changes, I'm a little undecided. I think I'd like to see it in action first, before I decide if I like it or dislike it.

[Avshar]

with the removing of every single interesting stat from items, i am quitting and not buying this crap. It was the best thing wow, to build up ur own gear in the way you want to. Now... its gone. this is the worst idea blizz ever had

[Tunes1]

They better figure out a way to fix mage and warlock cc's then if every healer is getting a magic dispel.

Druids will have absolutely every tool to counter a mage unless they change the way sheep works. Shaman already have many anti-caster abilities, so a cc dispel will just make them an even bigger pain in the ass for casters.