Mechanics: How much damage does my SW: P actually do per second?

[JohnGalt]

Assuming this spec (please ignore procs such as imp spirit tap, lightweave, trinkets, etc... other than shadow weaving)
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?prie...6,wJy-RO,10522

The tooltip at 80 says: 1380 damage over 18 seconds
If the character has 2420 Bonus dmg, does SW: P do 3800 dmg over 18 seconds now?

In addition to this, when do we tack on Shadow power +10%, Improved SW:P 6%, shadow weaving 10%, Twin Diciplines 5%, and Shadowform 15%?

This is just a mechanics question. I'm trying to calculate how haste will affect my toon.

Will the formula be: (1380 + 2420) * 1.10 * 1.06 * 1.10 * 1.05 * 1.15 = 5885 (rounded)

5885 / 18 = 326 (rounded) Per second
5885 / 6 = 980 (rounded) Per tick (current)

With 20% Haste
Per tick: 18 seconds /1.2 = 15
5885 / 15 = 392 (rounded) per second
Is my math correct?

[Naphomci]

Two things. One, SW:P has a higher than 100% spell power coefficient (sp?). I believe 105%, but am not sure. Two: I am not sure the DoT haste mechanics are entirely clear yet. There may be odd things to do with the timing such as the 18 seconds becoming 15 would mean 1 tick every 2.5 seconds makes sense, but 21% haste might throw things out of whack and still be 2.5 seconds, until it becomes a better mathematical time (i.e 2.45). I'm sure once it is out on the PTR some extensive testing will commence.

[Worshaka]

Two things. One, SW:P has a higher than 100% spell power coefficient (sp?). I believe 105%, but am not sure. Two: I am not sure the DoT haste mechanics are entirely clear yet. There may be odd things to do with the timing such as the 18 seconds becoming 15 would mean 1 tick every 2.5 seconds makes sense, but 21% haste might throw things out of whack and still be 2.5 seconds, until it becomes a better mathematical time (i.e 2.45). I'm sure once it is out on the PTR some extensive testing will commence.

SW:P should have a coeffecient of 1.2 but it's been penalised to 1.1. That means if you had SP equal to 2420 that SW:P would be 1380 + 1.1(2420) = 4042 over 18 seconds... of course this is ignoring thinks like shadow weaving, 13% magic damage, crit, 6% SW:P damage talent, Shadow Form, Twin Disciplines... all that is applied to the 4042 damage.

Assuming standard buffs you would have 1.13(13% magic damage debuff)*1.06(SW:P Talent)*1.15(Shadow Form)*1.05(Twin Disciplines)*1.1(Darkness)*1.1(Shadow Weaving)*4042 = 7074

Now you need to factor in your chance to crit... with my gear when i'm raid buffed I have a 31% crit rate + 6% from Mind Melt on dots + 5% crit debuff which is 42%... I have a lot more SP so with that in mind lets scale the crit back to 35% which may be roughly where you are at as a complete guess.

7074 would be the total damage at 0% crit, that means 35% of the 7074 would deal double damage or 35% of the total damage will be applied on top, 7074 + 0.35 * 7074 = 9550

9550 damage over 18sec is equal to 530.55 dps, so if we factor in 20% haste using the haste formula;

New Casting Time = (Base Casting Time)/(1 + % Spell Haste)
New Casting Time = (18)/(1 + 0.2)
New Casting Time = 15 seconds

9550 damage over 15sec is equal to 636.67 dps which funnily enough is a 20% dps increase... so the dot haste effect is going to provide an increase in dps = to the haste %.

Off the top of my head, my SW:P is about 15% of my total damage for the average encounter... and I have something like a 17% raid buffed haste rate... so this change would provide a 2.5% total damage increase.

[JohnGalt]

Outstanding response Worshaka.
That clears up a lot of my questions.
Now... please convince Bilzzard to have haste affect all our dots. (I'm sure they can find free text space on the Shadowform talent)

[walach]

(I'm sure they can find free text space on the Shadowform talent)

qft ;p

it would be nice to see all our dots boosted by haste; imo we are a dot class and its kind of a shame our raid dps is mostly MF/MB

[Worshaka]

Considering VT gets double the coefficient it should don't expect VT to get haste scaling or if it does the coefficient will be nerfed.

[JohnGalt]

lol

•Shadowform now let the periodic damage of your Shadow Word: Pain, Devouring Plague, and Vampiric Touch spells benefit from haste.

[Worshaka]

I still expect VT to be nerfed... perhaps not immediately because it will provide the fix they are after but long term having double the coeffecient, critting dots and now haste scalling will make the spell incredibly OP.

[Abandon]

Incredibly overpowered in PVP or PVE? Or both?

[Nezoia]

Everything will obviously be balanced to not be overpowered, but the change will ensure our spells will scale more linear (like the other dps classes), in the future.

This is a big plus. The reduced mana cost is also pretty win in combination with solo grinding, and the upcomming levelling period for Cataclysm.

[Worshaka]

Incredibly overpowered in PVP or PVE? Or both?

Less OP for PvP based on the fact that once you put PvP gear on the lvls of crit/haste and SP are so small as to make the scaling effect rather muted.

Still if you understand the mathematics behind dots you'll understand just how well they scale even before they had the ability to crit or tick faster. Now that they can crit and tick faster and VT scales doubly as well from SP as it should, it makes for a spell that is extremely powerful. As Nezoia pointed out it may stay like this for the moment because it will place overall spriest DPS at a decent point, but in terms of micro analysing spells VT is well above the curve and it will get nerfed at some point in the future.

[xxf2dxx]

I give it two more patches and the tool tip for shadowform will cover the entire screen.


That or it'll pop up with "TL;DR" really big.

[harky]

Yeah, VT is unfortunately looking to be in the old 'Shadow Bolt' levels of super-scaling. It might be needed for now, but it's quite possible that some changes will need to be made. Hopefully up the MF, or making that 4p T10 baseline.