Patch 3.3 PTR Notes Update - 10/23

[superstargoddess]

they cant stun someone who has been active in BG's and arena since season 5 that has atleast full furious, if you dont have the gear, then you dont have the experience and you wouldnt know what to do if you did survive the cheap shot kidney or garrote. Everytime someone complains about dying in a stun (tons of people) all good pvp players hear in there head when they read that is hes terribad at pvp, not that theres an issue with rogues. Rogues are usually 1st chosen targets in arena because they are very squishy, they have just as many weaknesses as strengths. What if you cast a spell and when the cast bar was done nothing happened, or you hit hammer of wrath and nothing happened but the cd was blown, or you pennance and it channels but didnt heal. Vanish should atleast work, its like the blink bug where you move forward 2 inches and the cd is blown. These basic bugs should have been fixed a long time ago.

I was more talking about BG, not arena.

[Awinee]

Honestly, the buttons with the races / classes look rushed. Looks like some one just started photoshopping and found out the "Bold" and "Shade" button. Aka, utterly shit.

The flags behind it are quite nice tho.

[Baenre]

this is going to make no diference at all any shards or crystals that coe from a dungeon atm are rolled for at the end and any green/blues that drop are greeded on atm and who ever wins them are going to go and get a enchanter in there guild to disenchant them for them (i do it all the time for my guild mates). so either way there going to get there "free mats". but if you want to cut your wrists go ahead im sure the world will keep spinning with one less emo twat crying in it

What about those of us that nev er told the grp we could DE and just greeded on everything like normal so we could later DE stuff to make some bloody money? It's not like people actually tip or anything when they ask for enchants. I guess they figure it cost us NOTHING to max out our skills and get the materials to max out our skills.

Wake up pal and realise they are BONING enchanters.

[link_991]

Says the rogue? It's okay, we all get nerfed sometime or another. You'll live.

Is it really a nerf if it the original buff never went Live in the first place?

[Chimbles]

Is it really a nerf if it the original buff never went Live in the first place?

Your reasoning is unwelcome here.

[hosehead]

Disenchanting items is what gives enchanters money and if the game starts doing that automatically for everyone enchanters lose that. Also not everyone keeps reserves of mats on hand to deal with people who forgot so that is a baseless arguement. All this is doing is bringing the prices of mats down by removing the need to actually be an enchanter to create them. What is the point of being able to disenchant item when by process of a built in game mechanic anyone can do it?

If you've managed to pull of charging people to DE their drops, all the power to you. We never argued that morons don't exist. Maybe you're realising that this change means you can't do that anymore.

But personally, I'd never pay anyone to DE drops. It's not like I go around demanding gold when someone has to repair/buy reagents before I lay a jeeves/repair bot, or my elixir master charges you extra for you to keep your bonus procs off your own supplied materials. I don't charge leatherworkers to follow me around and skin my corpses while I get me some tasty rhino meat (or leave trash loot on them so they can't skin them). I wonder how many Arctic Fur have proc'd off the bodies we leave behind.

You would think enchanters would welcome this change because it makes their lives less miserable, having to manually DE loot.

Also, you'll need to back your theory of reducing the cost of materials with some sort of anecdote or data.

So now you don't click 4 buttons when I want something DE'd. And the market is ruined- lolwut?

Go back to selling your 900G Scroll of Enchant Weapon: Berserker and stop crying.

Perhaps you need to be a little more aggressive in your marketing. Enchanting and JC are the two most sought after profession in the game (yes, I'm guessing here..).

Q: As a raider, what's your primary goal of playing this game?
A: To get better gear so you can perform better, so you can move onto the next level of content and get more gear.

Q: What do you do immediately after getting new gear?
A: Enchant and gem the items. (also correct: "Dance.")


I think the real story here is that ENCHANTERS will begin to realise that the real money maker is the ENCHANTER ONLY craftable vellums. Go search for the prices of the most sought after enchants on your realm's AH and get back to me. We'll compare economies.


And ask an engineer how s/he feels about all the engineering buffs in the last couple of updates.

Your reasoning is unwelcome here.

QFT. So sick of the tug of war that is fixing rogues.

WE GET IT, ROGUES WERE DESIGNED TO BE GREAT IN A WAY THAT MAKES ROGUES APPEAR EVEN GREATER IN A MECHANIC THAT WASN'T AROUND WHEN ROGUES WERE DESIGNED. (PvP outside of "world pvp")

Can't fix this for PvE, it would make rogues too powerful in PvP!
Can't fix this for PvP, it would give rogues an advantage in PvE!

HOW ABOUT A SEPARATE SET OF MECHANICS FOR ACTUAL PVP/PVE DIFFERENCES!

I understand "what a nightmare" it could be to "maintain two of every spell" (their cookie-cutter response) - but they could definitely come up with a way that changes spell behavior whether in an instance/the world/arena/battlegrounds. It wouldn't be that hard, you just need to brainstorm and come up iwth the best way to do it.

Although I'm sure the Blizzard turds feel kind of stupid when they have to pull back things they put into the PTR. With respect to the vanish change, the first thing I thought of was using a well-time vanish to escape some sort of Nova Blast 1-shot-aoe type of damage. But they'd still need to time it correctly, and they're blowing their cooldown instead of just moving over like they "should". You can probably bet Fel Fire to Frost Wyrms that the change was revoked due to PvP implications outside of having come up with the laziest possible way to 'fix' vanish. (which I'm sure most rogues have given up on)

[emoroan]

I think the real story here is that ENCHANTERS will begin to realise that the real money maker is the ENCHANTER ONLY craftable vellums. Go search for the prices of the most sought after enchants on your realm's AH and get back to me. We'll compare economies.

Why would someone buy an vellum off the AH when they have the mats already and can find an enchanter to do it for free?

[blukkie]

Lag is what breaks Vanish, not the spell. So if the spell Vanish was triggered + the new effect, lag can still come first and hit you before Vanish + the new effect got in place. Even if it's a few hundreds of a seconds.

[Pokchop]

How to really "fix" vanish.

Make it so vanish does not activate until the server actually receives your command to vanish and replies. That way rogues will get it that its lag causing them to break out of vanish and not some supposed "bug." Because all it really is is lag, but the client is not actually showing it to make it appear smooth and responsive. It's a common thing done in a lot of multiplayer games.

Then rogues that experience this "bug" often will realize they have a shitty internet connection.

[Ascendant]

i dont understand why they would revert the vanish change theres no point to keep a broken skill its pretty much just used to vanish 1 attack blind, polymorph etc or get out of a movement impairing effect.

Yes please remove Vanish so Rogues are completely and utterly destroyed in pvp.

[Mord13th]

http://shadowpanther.net/roguechanges.htm

Read. Learn. Don't be a fucking moron. Profit.

Just to clarify, most of rogue changes were nerfs.

Haha

QQ little stealthy rogue, I say nerf rogues more, nerf them into the ground like Blizz has with several other classes. It's just a chicken shit class to play anyways. Blizz has you sucking off it's teet because you can't do anything without stuns, admit it.... stuns are a crutch. Oh noes now you have to actually think before engaging someone? Thought processes within the rogue class? Inconcieveable! No matter what Blizz gives you for talents you're not a ninja, stop pretending to be one. Hopefully in the future Blizz wil just get rid of vanish. Again QQ little bitches, may your day be full of Hunter Flares, Invis breaking AOE's and tears.

[FoF]

Words

Thats a lot of words for ignoring what everyone keeps saying. No one is debating this changes nothing on BoEs. This change most people are concerned with are BoPs where people who don't always get the DE mats from them now get it regardless.

[chrion]

Haha

QQ little stealthy rogue, I say nerf rogues more, nerf them into the ground like Blizz has with several other classes. It's just a chicken shit class to play anyways. Blizz has you sucking off it's teet because you can't do anything without stuns, admit it.... stuns are a crutch. Oh noes now you have to actually think before engaging someone? Thought processes within the rogue class? Inconcieveable! No matter what Blizz gives you for talents you're not a ninja, stop pretending to be one. Hopefully in the future Blizz wil just get rid of vanish. Again QQ little bitches, may your day be full of Hunter Flares, Invis breaking AOE's and tears.

yet there is a massive difference between a pro rogue and johhny average rogue, its not like a ret pally where you blow sac if someone is spamming you with CC, freedom for snares, hold the W key and spam your 4 button blindly. Rogues are not a simple class to master, there is a ton of CD management, and you cant just attack blindly, coordination with your mage or lock partner has to occur, damage has to be set up! unlike alot of the big plate melee class's which are quite mindless and skillfree to play. Your poor analysis and anger towards rogues is far off base with reality.

[Pasture]

Fine, I'm cool with that, if you're cool with rolling on the herbs, skins and ores you get WHILST INSIDE THE INSTANCE. What's that? You don't want to do that? How come? Because you spent hours levelling that prof to be able to obtain those mats, and you don't think it's fair to just hand them out to anyone? Hypocrisy isn't attractive.

And for the record, I've been in a number of PuGs where people have donated their cloth drops to the tailor, and gladly given their greens to the enchanter. Just because you're an asshole doesn't mean the rest of the world is.

For the record, I have a max level enchanter (just recently maxed him out). I DE the items that drop in a group and share the shards and abyss out on a /roll basis because that's fair. You, however, want to keep everything for yourself. So, you're selfish, and I'm not. Doesn't that make you the asshole?

Don't make assumptions about what I will or won't do while in a group, or about how little or great my altruism is. You don't know me.

[FoF]

For the record, I have a max level enchanter (just recently maxed him out). I DE the items that drop in a group and share the shards and abyss out on a /roll basis because that's fair. You, however, want to keep everything for yourself. So, you're selfish, and I'm not. Doesn't that make you the asshole?

Don't make assumptions about what I will or won't do while in a group, or about how little or great my altruism is. You don't know me.

No one said keeping everything they said not disenchanting everything. So people who won the items over you end up with a blue that vendors for 7g or an epic that vendors for 15 and not a shard that sells for 3 times as much. This removes the individual enchanters choice (or possibly the enchanter entirely) from the equation as it will automatically shard it and give it to who ever won the roll denying the enchanter the choice to protect profit. You could say he is being greedy but he is just protecting his markets. If enchanters are forced to DE for you, then I want all ores/herbs/skinning rolled on just as equally. None of this bullshit I leveled my skill to collect these it works both ways.

[Jacobim]

You, however, want to keep everything for yourself.

Where did I say that? I only said that if you want free enchanting mats from instances, I want free herbs, ores and skins from instances. Is that really too much to ask?

What pisses me off is people acting as if enchanters owe you something. If you don't ask at the start of the instance or at the very least after the first boss if anyone can DE and then sort out rules for the shards/crystals, that's your damn problem. As I have stated numerous times in this thread, I always say at the start of a PuG that I can DE, and if it's alright with everyone I would like to keep any shards for buying recipes or crafting high-end enchants. Generally people are happy with that - money isn't hard to come by but on my server at least shards cost upwards of 25g so keeping a good supply can be very costly. If people are not willing to do that, then I ask if they would rather just roll greed and do what they want with it. It's very rare that people will have a hissy fit about not getting mats they deserve once you've made your position clear.

One final question - do you give strangers free enchants with your mats? Because that is the same principle as this. The argument that people in the PuG put in the same effort you did so should get mats simply does not hold water when you understand that they didn't put in the work to be able to DE loot, just like I didn't put in the work to mine or herb or skin.

[Gamerhenry]

I'm really excited about the changes to Frost mages !!! i cant wait to pve frost again.

I'm kinda bummed that they took away the frozen core change atm... that was going to be so OP in pvp :P haha

one thing im curious about in regards to the Deep freeze change... do you think they'll include Deepfreeze in the talent "Chilled to the Bone"? cause that would be cool.

i guess ice lance would become kinda useless in pve tho... seeing how it would prolly make much more sense to tack on a deepfreeze after FoF inplace of it. Meh.

[Faralia]

i guess ice lance would become kinda useless in pve tho... seeing how it would prolly make much more sense to tack on a deepfreeze after FoF inplace of it. Meh.

Not necessarily, if Deep Freeze is on cooldown. If I remember correctly (correct me if I'm wrong), the spell is going to have a 30 second cooldown.

[Pasture]

Not necessarily, if Deep Freeze is on cooldown. If I remember correctly (correct me if I'm wrong), the spell is going to have a 30 second cooldown.

After the Frozen Core buff was nerfed Frost mages are back to spamming frostbolts. Icelance is back out of the rotation, though you'll be throwing the odd Deep Freeze.

[Xiangu]

Jewelcrafting is a Gathering proffesion!Without prospecting, we wouldnt have gems!
Inscription is a Gathering proffesion! Without Milling, we wouldnt have inks!

While your general argument is not utterly flawed your examples are -> gems can come from several sources - mining/mob-drops/bought from vendors for emblems/honor etc.. so JC is surely not a gathering profession - being able to gain additional gems from prospecting ores is just a bonus - the gathering in this case is done by the mining people.

Now to inscription. Inks are not created from milling but from "crafting" pigments. So this example is flawed - those before mentioned pigments come from milling true.. and to my knowledge only from milling so that would per se be gathering. However, in order to mill for pigments you will need herbs - which are the true gathered material in this case - done by herbalists.

So to summarize that - JC's will need miners to get their ores, inscribers will need herbalists to get their herbs. An enchanter doesn't need any other primary profession to "gather" their material.

You get the point.

Now to a more personal view of this - Having more than one character (like most of us) I have at least all gathering professions at 450 and most of the crafting professions (that I need) at 400+ so I couldn't care less which profession is better or worse off. But I do agree that I don't really like the trend that an enchanter is obligated to disenchant for his dungeon group.. I mean.. wtf is that shit with the recent changes people are rolling greed either way ask if there's an enchanter in the group (when the run is already over) then I say "sure" and he's trading me due to the 2 hour time window and asks me to disenchant those items - not for the group though just for his personal use oO wtf.. and now I am the greedy one because I roll greed myself to disenchant those items? (or vendor them if I think that gives more profit...)