To Tank ToGC10 or not...

[Trifande]

Armory Link: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Twilight's+Hammer&n=Malfursa
WoWHeroes Link: http://wow-heroes.com/index.php?zone=eu&server=Twilight's%20Hammer&name=Malfursa

Hi,

as the poll suggests I'm looking to see what more experienced dudu's think. Is my dudu geared enough to run ToGC10 as the Main Tank? If you think not I would greatly appreciate a reason why .

Bear stats (unbuffed - no motw either):
HP: ~39.7k
Dodge: ~38.8%
Armor: ~28.8k
Expertise: 39
Hit: 8%
AP: ~5.8k
Crit: ~42%

Disclaimer: It's an alt of mine and I know that I could use a bit more dodge, ap and armor to improve avoidance/mitigation but i've gone down the soaking path for now and will strain myself to get as close to the expertise hard-cap whilst maintaining 40kHP unbuffed and hit-cap.

Cheers.

[bavarcarus]

it's a bit annoying trying to translate cow stats into bear stats. your gear looks good enough I think.

[Deleted]

i've tanked it in worse.

[getefix]

Are you expecting tribute to insanity? Because I wouldn't count on it. If your healers are better geared then you then your gear can get you to anub before you have problems. A lot of your gear is ilvl 200, and you have some pieces that are 219, 226, and 232. I would still consider you undergeared for the encounters.

Now for the real problem: You've only beaten the first four bosses of Ulduar 5 days ago and you've never set foot in ToC 25 man. I get the feeling that you've never done any actual raiding with this character. ToGC 10 man is not easy. I hear from lots of groups (including our 2nd guild group) that wipe 10 times + on Beasts of Northrend. If you think you're going to walk into an identical encounter where bosses just have a few more HPs then you should chi-chiggity-check yourself before you wreck yourself.

1/3 in NS and 1/3 in KotJ is just weird. Put those in Feral Aggression plz.

[Trifande]

Are you expecting tribute to insanity? Because I wouldn't count on it. If your healers are better geared then you then your gear can get you to anub before you have problems. A lot of your gear is ilvl 200, and you have some pieces that are 219, 226, and 232. I would still consider you undergeared for the encounters.

Nope just a clear.

Now for the real problem: You've only beaten the first four bosses of Ulduar 5 days ago and you've never set foot in ToC 25 man. I get the feeling that you've never done any actual raiding with this character. ToGC 10 man is not easy. I hear from lots of groups (including our 2nd guild group) that wipe 10 times + on Beasts of Northrend. If you think you're going to walk into an identical encounter where bosses just have a few more HPs then you should chi-chiggity-check yourself before you wreck yourself.

Done ToC25 upto Anub, just haven't got Anub25 down yet. Don't really have time for Ulduar on an alt atm. And yes, i know ToGC from a dps PoV.

1/3 in NS and 1/3 in KotJ is just weird. Put those in Feral Aggression plz.

Ouch :S, been meaning to respecc but keep forgetting...how embarrassing to have posted my char link before :S. Anyways, if i have an imp demo shout warr in my group (lets assume i do) i think going 2/3 in KotJ wld be better than FA, right? 1/3 NS was just a BAD BAD mistake i haven't yet fixed.

Cheers, and thanks for any and all input.

[Sunshine]

Anyways, if i have an imp demo shout warr in my group (lets assume i do) i think going 2/3 in KotJ wld be better than FA, right?

Yes, 2/5 FA won't overwrite the imp demo warr, and 2/3 KotJ is fine. Might also be worth considering imp bash, for things like jaraxxus (interrupting fireballs when dps is killing portals) and faction champs.

[bavarcarus]

yeah I run with imp bash, considering it's our only real way to interrupt what we're tanking I consider it a requirement although I may be alone in that.

[Hethor]

Gear help here, but it all comes down to skills

[Trifande]

hmm 30sec CD, 5sec duration bash....
- good for Jaraxx + Mistress, is it useful on Infernals?
- great for fact. champs.
- great for burrowers on Anub

vs

2/3 KotJ
- 10% dmg increase for 10secs every 1min.
- can only be used when not under heavy melee fire (-armor debuff) or have to waste Barkskin CD with it.

Conclusion:
I think the Imp. Bash idea was great, wouldn't have bothered looking into it myself... Thanks .

[bavarcarus]

charge doesn't interrupt infernals, bash does. bash is also nice for offtanking on anub.

[Trifande]

Ah well, as an update I managed to successfully MT ToGC10 tonight/this morning (started at around 3-4am?) in a PuG and we reached Anub with 41 attempts remaining (it got to 7am after a few wipes on Anub, so we called it :P ). As a addendum, 50% of the PuG had only ever done ToC in normal mode, and that too did not have any ToC25 gear. Only 3 had some ToC25 gear (1 healer, 2 dps).

[Degrador]

I've done the first few bosses of 10 TotGC with very similar stats (just under 40k HP unbuffed, ~40% dodge). Was a while ago and my feral gear is probably better now (yay for offspec rolls), but still, it's doable.

[Fbl]

personally i'd remove brutal impact for anything basically... maybe even improved demo (if you're so concerned about your tanking)
as for chest enchant... 18 stamina gives you slightly more hps than 275 health... difference is really small but 18 stamina is usually cheaper than that enchant

and now to answer your question : ) i guess you can tank 10 men gtoc... it's more dps race afterall

[Hoopdreams]

Gear help here, but it all comes down to skills

Gear is extremely important for a tank.

[Degrador]

Gear is extremely important for a tank.

Agreed. Moreso than any other role. Skills are good, but they can't prevent you from getting instagibbed because your effective health is too low.

[Trifande]

hehe it's funny , i replied here stating that I have now successfully tanked ToGC10 and there are still MMO-champion members who are voting to say that I can't/shouldn't...

I created this topic/poll for two reasons:
- firstly, to actually gather advice from experienced (dudu) tanks on how I should modify spec/gear/enchants/gems. And the replies here, so far, definitely helped with that.
- secondly, pre-topic creation, I was denied joining a ToGC10 group as OT as my 'gear' was too bad according to the Raid-Leader (or perhaps the the other members in that raid who armoried me). I was interested in seeing how many more members of our dear community thought the way he/she/they did and (hopefully) WHY. Given that I have MAIN-tanked ToGC10 now (and that too in a PuG), in EXACTLY the same gear as I was rejected in, I feel I have proved (even if only to myself) that these nay-sayers were wrong. Perhaps those potential Raid Leaders will read this post and see the errors of their ways (wishful thinking? ).

I'm going to leave the poll open to see how many more community members continue to vote against my gear. Hopefully they can also reply here as to why they think so.

Lastly, a big thanks to all those that replied here constructively so far, including those that said they managed ToGC10 in worse gear than mine.

Update: I've upgraded my OS BoE ring to the Triumph emblem ring now (AFTER ToGC run) and switched the 1/3 KotJ + 1/3 NS -to- 2/2 Imp. Bash (BEFORE ToGC run).

Cheers.

[DaLeetPawner]

Ive tanked TotGC before with worse gear.

DW

[getefix]

I still think you're undergeared to do the instance, but you're capable of pushing through it. Ensidia and other progression guilds killed Yogg Saron in mostly Naxx 25 gear. The worse your gear, the less room you have for error. It sounds like you're a good player and you pay attention. Grats to you and GL on Tribute to Insanity.

[Auroro]

hehe it's funny , i replied here stating that I have now successfully tanked ToGC10 and there are still MMO-champion members who are voting to say that I can't/shouldn't...

I created this topic/poll for two reasons:
- firstly, to actually gather advice from experienced (dudu) tanks on how I should modify spec/gear/enchants/gems. And the replies here, so far, definitely helped with that.
- secondly, pre-topic creation, I was denied joining a ToGC10 group as OT as my 'gear' was too bad according to the Raid-Leader (or perhaps the the other members in that raid who armoried me). I was interested in seeing how many more members of our dear community thought the way he/she/they did and (hopefully) WHY. Given that I have MAIN-tanked ToGC10 now (and that too in a PuG), in EXACTLY the same gear as I was rejected in, I feel I have proved (even if only to myself) that these nay-sayers were wrong. Perhaps those potential Raid Leaders will read this post and see the errors of their ways (wishful thinking? ).

I'm going to leave the poll open to see how many more community members continue to vote against my gear. Hopefully they can also reply here as to why they think so.

Lastly, a big thanks to all those that replied here constructively so far, including those that said they managed ToGC10 in worse gear than mine.

Update: I've upgraded my OS BoE ring to the Triumph emblem ring now (AFTER ToGC run) and switched the 1/3 KotJ + 1/3 NS -to- 2/2 Imp. Bash (BEFORE ToGC run).

Cheers.

I still think you are undergear, however with a right team you can push it. There should been three choices; You can do it, You are undergear but can do it, or you can't do it, get better gear. Look at my gear, I know I can push ToGC 10 man, Auroro.

[Pascal]

Ah well, as an update I managed to successfully MT ToGC10 tonight/this morning (started at around 3-4am?) in a PuG and we reached Anub with 41 attempts remaining (it got to 7am after a few wipes on Anub, so we called it :P ). As a addendum, 50% of the PuG had only ever done ToC in normal mode, and that too did not have any ToC25 gear. Only 3 had some ToC25 gear (1 healer, 2 dps).

I was gonna say dude, I've been tanking ToGC25 (only NRB so far; huntard ran into a charge so we wiped at 6% enrage - what a pro rite?) with stats probably just as good as yours (a little less health, little more AC, etc); there's no way you couldn't handle ToGC10 if I can manage to not die tanking NRB 25 HM.

I'm guessing people saying you're undergeared for ToGC10 probably haven't tanked it. Everyone thinks you need to overgeared for an instance, as if being entry level geared for that raid makes it impossible to do it. How else would people have ever done it in the first place if they needed to be in the gear that drops from the bosses they're trying to kill?