why does dps in feel the need to pull trash/bosses?

[superstargoddess]

I'm really curious to see if this whole attitude of 'easy mode heroics' goes away in cataclysm with the changes they're making. I for one hope it does so egotistical idiots like yourself can shut up and let the tanks do their jobs.

Not everyone is a geared as you. Not every is as 'skilled' as you. People have varying levels of play and just because you think you're hot shit in your 277 gear doesn't mean you should be a prick and not let a tank do his job no matter how agonizing it is for you to not have the spotlight.

Amen, well said. When I go into a heroic and people have a gs of like 1.5k-2k higher than mine, I make sure that I am doing my best and doing everything that I can to do my job. Which may include lining up my pulls in a perfect way and positioning once I am in the pull. If I need to do certain things to ensure than I am able to keep aggro off of these people in super duper epic gear, then I don't think that should be a problem. I have the skill, but I'm still working on the gear for this toon. Once I get to the same gear level as others, it will be easy for me to blaze through. But until then I think that people who are a little less geared need to get a little more respect.

[Timanggi]

Some scrubs seem to have misunderstanding about how well a good player with gear performs in HC. They dont go there to watch the tank to think does he press number 1 or 2 before he pulls. If im not happy in the speed of the tank ill just do my best to make it faster & bullshit about tanks micromanagment. If the tank lacks skillz or is slow im going to push it go faster. Or If I tank im running till the last boss dragging whole instance behind me. that's how easy heroics r. If I heal I barely n 2 heal cauz heroics r easy mode and 1 rejuvenation outheals the mobs by a mile. cba to spam wrath on 1 target when you can pull the whole instance and one shot the mobs at once,

---------- Post added 06-22-2010 at 03:59 AM ----------

Some people are bad. end of the thread. Good players dont sit and watch mobs to roam to them.

---------- Post added 06-22-2010 at 04:00 AM ----------

2) You don't talk to scrubs because you may get aids in your mouth

[draticus]

I agree, wtf is up with the whole "ZOMG we should be done with this total whole instance in 2 minutes!" shit? I know people want to get badges, so do I, but I would rather do it correctly and also enjoy it than to just rush through like a bunch of zombies. BRAINS BRAINS BRAINS.

Its honestly not that they're trying to get done faster. Its that they want to announce to everyone that this dungeon and the rest of the players in the group are far beneath them and they're put out to have to go slumming in this place with you people. People like this are usually insecure because they're not that good but they want you to think they are. If the other people suck then they'll be on the top of the DPS charts and they can announce to the rest of the group that they're better than them by pretending to have recount disabled and asking someone to link the DPS. If they're not on top of the damage meter then they're forced to create a problem so they can complain about it loudly. They usually just pull extra mobs or try to pull aggro by stunning a mob away from the tank and then single targeting it. This creates an opening for them to bitch about how the tank can't hold aggro vs their mighty dps. And if anyone calls them out for fucking shit up and slowing the run down they get to say "zomg heroics are srsbsns amright nab." They feel this also alerts everyone to the fact that they're leet.

Maybe if we just identify these people right away and say "omg, you're so pro, can I be like you some day" then they can go through the rest of the instance without sabotaging it so they can complain.

[Cjros]

I'm really curious to see if this whole attitude of 'easy mode heroics' goes away in cataclysm with the changes they're making. I for one hope it does so egotistical idiots like yourself can shut up and let the tanks do their jobs.

Not everyone is a geared as you. Not every is as 'skilled' as you. People have varying levels of play and just because you think you're hot shit in your 277 gear doesn't mean you should be a prick and not let a tank do his job no matter how agonizing it is for you to not have the spotlight.

As soon as heroic mobs start hitting me for more than 5% of my HP per swing in a heroic and my healer has more fun healing me than the tank (I mean seriously, even if I heal a heroic, I cast riptide on the tank maybe every two pulls and die of fucking boredom the rest of them.) I'll stop pulling literal trash mobs. I did the whole vanilla crap of being sat for fucking five mans because of my class. I did the whole BC shit of being sat for fucking five mans for my class. I know when tanks are needed and quite frankly, unless it's like PoS or HoR, a tank has the advantage of being able to pull TWO TO THREE TO FOUR packs at a time. I mean, not that they ever fucking do that. "hurp durp let's pull 1 pack bit by bit." Tanks are not the centre of the universe, contrary to popular belief.

Without the tank the boss runs around killing people.
Without the healers the boss kills everyone.
Without the DPS the boss never dies.
Everyone is needed.
High horse.
Off it.

[Endus]

Here's something all you DPS should consider. Tanking IS harder than DPSing. DPS for most classes is faceroll (I should know, my main is a rogue). New tanks take time to learn. They need to learn to hold aggro, learn to pay attention to threat on each and every mob that the various DPS are nuking, manage their CDs, keep track of positioning, and many other things.

What do DPS need to do? Pick a target and zerg. Tab target, zerg. Tab once more, zerg. Boss time, guess what? Zerg.

This is absolutely ludicrously false. Have you ever raided? It doesn't look like it.

Sure, tanking in heroics is "harder" in that you actually have to not be a retarded monkey, as a tank, while a decent tank and healer can easily carry three retarded monkey DPS. But this doesn't mean tanking, as a role, is more difficult, it's a measure of how much people outgear heroics by these days.

Tanking is NOT more difficult than DPS. I've healed with a priest and a shaman, I've tanked with a warrior and a DK, and I've DPSed with all four, at least through ToC. I only play my Shaman and a new mage I've just gotten to 80, because I changed servers with my guild a couple months back and didn't feel like dropping $25 per alt, so I haven't tanked in ICC, but I know the fights, and the class mechanics.

Tanking is not harder than DPS. By any measure. You've got a rotation/priority queue for threat/defensive CDs, just like DPS have for their pewpew. You're managing CDs, they're managing CDs. You're positioning, they're positioning. You're holding aggro, they're watching aggro (at higher gear levels, at least, it's becoming an issue again). As well, DPS are handling interrupts, often do more cleansing/curse removal/etc than healers because healers are busy with raid damage, and all the players BUT the tanks have generally more difficult times with raid positioning. The tank finds his spot, but the healers and DPS are having to position around that, and then have more in the way of boss attacks that need to be avoided or responded to via positioning. I'm speaking in general terms; some bosses are weighted more one way or the other.

I also tanked through TBC, so my tanking experience isn't just in WotLK. Tanks today have it dead freaking easy. At anything but 25-man raids in top gear, threat is basically a non-issue unless you're asleep at the wheel. You've got far more ranged and AoE threat options, in general, and better snap aggro. I played a paladin tank in TBC, and my warrior in WotLK has more reliable AoE threat than the paladin did during TBC's heyday, when paladins were considered to have overpowered AoE threat. Even in TBC, tanking wasn't more difficult than the other roles.

Tanks aren't that special, and you aren't that much more awesome just because you play one. I'm not saying tanking's easy, or that tanks aren't under pressure, but if you think DPS is easy, you've never been in a progression raid fight with a tight enrage timer and some critical attack avoidance to handle, like Festergut before the 20% buff, with the gear levels at that time, used to be. If the DPS aren't on their game and pushing performance to the limit, you wipe. It's just as important and critical as tanking is.

[draticus]

Sure, tanking in heroics is "harder" in that you actually have to not be a retarded monkey

This thread is in fact about heroics and for the record tanks are only asking DPS to stop being retarded monkeys.

Tanking heroics can be unnecessarily difficult only when DPS are going out of their way to make it difficult for tanks. I don't even tank anymore and I'm constantly getting annoyed at other DPS slowing the run down by not letting the tank do his job. DPS pulling extra mobs NEVER MAKES THE RUN GO FASTER. All it ever does is screw up positioning, prevent others from AoEing, and cause the healer to start healing instead of doing 2.5k dps which was speeding the run up.

The only bad tanks I see anymore are DPS spec'd and geared DKs, Fury Warriors, and Ret pallies queueing as tanks just to skip the line. They just run in and start single targeting one mob while the others all go to the healer, then they run off and pull another group while the last group is still beating on the healer. They think they're great tanks because they pull fast.

DPS on the other hand are always screwing shit up and making the tanks life hard and slowing us down. When you ask them to stop they start cursing at you and trying to sabotage the run in any way they can. Its like kids are so bored with the game that they're just trolling the LFG system trying to ruin the game for others. And they're always DPS or DPS queueing as tanks.

[Gunmist]

I don't pull for tanks. I let them pull and get decent aggro before I attack. I also use tricks.

However, I have no patience for tanks with a godlike mentality.

If I somehow get aggro, it's your job to get it off of me. It's not my job to tank it. I will feint and vanish if it's off cooldown. If i'm helpless however, don't just let me die please.

That is all.

[Gemkin]

all i want is a answer. why does the dps in 5 man heroics feel the need to pull and tank trash when your still buffing. if they want to tank why not roll a tank?

Normally it's me as tank who starts pulling before everyone is done buffing..Never heard anyone complain about it, at all.

When running heroics on my healer i have no problem at all with pulling before everyone is buffed..It's not like i'm going out of mana on the first pack because i had to Prayer of Fortitude+Spirit the whole party...

I think it's more frustrating when the tank is going at a snails pace..Most of the time they eighter notice i'm fooling around and start to speed it up a bit, or they get a whisper from me and the speed up :P

[draticus]

Normally it's me as tank who starts pulling before everyone is done buffing..Never heard anyone complain about it, at all.

When running heroics on my healer i have no problem at all with pulling before everyone is buffed..It's not like i'm going out of mana on the first pack because i had to Prayer of Fortitude+Spirit the whole party...

I think it's more frustrating when the tank is going at a snails pace..Most of the time they eighter notice i'm fooling around and start to speed it up a bit, or they get a whisper from me and the speed up :P

Dual spec reduces you to 0 mana so watch for people switching specs. Other than that you should be good to pull instantly as long as you're a geared tank. I've had to switch to prot on my pally before and then had a DPS pull when I had 0 mana and bitch because I didn't get aggro of everything.

[Sylv_]

Tanks cry to much. I could solo heroics no problem.

The tank is there for the speed, same with the healer. So we can all hurry up and finish.

[sctrojans1112]

Because you god damn tanks jerk off for 5 mins at the beggining and after every GD boss, takes forever

[Adysux]

As dps i usualy only queue with firend ( 1 of em is ethir healer or tank ) so i ethir pull the entier instance myslef and tank it with meh friend healing me or dps as usual cuz the tank and me overgear it and he can non-stop pull
As tank i idd wait to long befor pull sometime but thts mainly because certain classes dont know they have tools like MD and ToT

[DeusX]

While I was playing my DK until recently, I liked good dps pulling ahead. Was giving me something to do.
Especialy I enjoy when the DPS knows how to pull the mobs towards my position (in case I am allreayd busy with another group). Used to have a shaman in the group (also RL friend) he always did this and we ended up having fun over skype pr whatever.

[lorddrakefox]

I would LOVE to hear then "Tanks ain't necessary talk once Cataclysm hits and every one is low gear once again-.- and see how much people whine then... "blarg blarg I am a dps I can do EVERYTHING with out a tank" wake up sherlock, NO YOU CANT! we are needed in order for idiots like you to gear up, if we ain't there, YOU don't get any badges or gear period, and its idiots like that, there didnt have to gear up at the start of Vanilla, TBC or WotLK, they came later and just harvested the free lewt, with out working for it like those there was there from the beginning, and every time a dps tells me, My main have xxxxGS, I tell em my main have xxxxGS, yours might be higher, but that does not mean you aint a retard.
and YES no FUCKING matter what any fuck tard dps noob says Tanks and Healers are the MOST important jobs in the game, if the aint there, idiot dps cant do shit(no dungeons no gear, no shit) and with the current dps tank do, yes a group of only tanks and healers can EASY do any dungeon WITHOUT a dps specced player, so no dps you aint really needed
PS; have done ulduar and ToC with only healers and tanks(in the current content gear) without dps'ers just to see how freaking easy it was... let me tell you this, it WAS easy without guys, no one squishy enough to die in fire or cleaves or anything.

[Birdflu]

I have honestly been waiting for blizzard to give us rogues a taunt. Hi i can tank. Get over it.

[kriS411]

simple answer to the ops question:

if the tank is slow on pulling the DPS has to speed it up.

[Gumbomcnasty]

why does the dps in 5 man heroics feel the need to pull and tank trash when your still buffing. if they want to tank why not roll a tank?

Because it is a 5-man and buffs are unnecessary. Because I get stuck witn undergeared tanks I'll pull agro anyhow so I might as well get the ball rolling. Because when we have wintergrasp I don't want to play patty-cake at the entrance. Because I generally do 60% of the entire run's damage I'll get the instance done significantly faster

Because in bloodspec the tank is hardly a factor in the instance simply due to the target already being dead when the tank establishes agro.

[lolipopp]

Being a good tank is an art. Being an average tank any idiot can be.

I agree with you but its the same thing for being dps or a healer. Tanks are not the only one with tools to prevent a wipe. Also the dmg u can do with full 264 lvl gear is just absurd nowdays. that's why no one is going to stand there and watch the next group of mobs for too long ...including healers haha

[Araun]

Because it is a 5-man and buffs are unnecessary. Because I get stuck witn undergeared tanks I'll pull agro anyhow so I might as well get the ball rolling. Because when we have wintergrasp I don't want to play patty-cake at the entrance. Because I generally do 60% of the entire run's damage I'll get the instance done significantly faster

Because in bloodspec the tank is hardly a factor in the instance simply due to the target already being dead when the tank establishes agro.

why don't you just queue as a tank then?

[Gumbomcnasty]

Most of the time I do. Other times I couldn't care less. Sometimes I just feel like pissing off bad tanks.