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  1. #21

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Worshaka
    This is actually bad advice and while it will be true some of the time shows very little insight in to optimising your gear.

    There are 3 gems you will use, those being...

    Runed Cardinal Ruby (23 SP) worth 23 PP
    Reckless Ametrine (12 SP & 10 haste) worth 22 PP
    Purified Dreadstone (12 SP & 10 Spirit) worth 17.9 PP

    The way to work out what gems to use, work out what PP you would gain by using pure red gems, so 1 socket = 23, 2 sockets = 46, 3 sockets = 59. Then see if gemming for the socket bonus can get you a figure that is higher using the 3 gems above, if so, thats what you use.

    As I previously stated, in 99.9% of circumstances gemming for the socket bonus will be superior than flat red gems. The only time this won't be true is for single, double or tripple blue socket items. In which case a single blue socket that will have a 5 sp socket bonus is only 0.1 less than gemming for pure SP. I suggest losing 0.1 PP for some regen is worth while. It only becomes a signficant number when u have 2 blue sockets for 7 sp or 3 for 9 sp that the loss is too great to not gem for. Any other combination of sockets will generally give you a better PP figure than pure SP.
    i don't think its too bad, and is pretty much what you said. purified where you get a good socket bonus, i did say two however and you are saying pretty much every bonus. One thing i did not take in to consideration, much of the newer gear seems to have higher bonuses, so make sure you do some basic math before you decide.

    there is a point though where you really don't need any more regen I find that to be between 270 and 290 assuming shadow fiends are used at the right times, but i noticed different people have different results with this, this is where spirit loses some attractiveness in my mind. If you find yourself with 50%+ mana at the end of difficult raid bosses then chances are you have more than enough regen.

    Some allaround gear that fitts for both healing and dpsing (more usuall now with the new haste buff to priests) have, but it's not usuall Smiley
    And, never seen tho, if there is a yellow socket with a 4spi bonus you should take recless, not only cuzz the PP sais so but also cuzz extra stats is allways good ;P
    there are a few items like this but many times there is a better pure dps item available. cross gearing would make your gemming strat a bit different.


    (side note): i'm not completly gemmed using my theory because things changed with 3.3 and i didn't feel like spending the gold when i'll be replacing gear

  2. #22

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by redrage
    there is a point though where you really don't need any more regen I find that to be between 270 and 290 assuming shadow fiends are used at the right times, but i noticed different people have different results with this, this is where spirit loses some attractiveness in my mind. If you find yourself with 50%+ mana at the end of difficult raid bosses then chances are you have more than enough regen.
    You're missing the point... if you are spec'd and gemmed correctly, there is an equivalent amoutn of spirit that will provide the identical DPS effect + add regen... why you would forgo the regen to get the same dps effect from a SP gem is beyond me. Sure the regen may not be required but when the DPS effect is identical you take the regen because it's a free byproduct of your DPS itemisation.

    In the case of +5 SP in a blue socket item, gemming a purified Dreadstone results in a loss of 0.1 PP which will never ever be noticed. If you wipe on a boss because of that 0.1 PP (which wouldn't happen anwyays) something else went terribly wrong, not your gear decision.

  3. #23

    Re: shadow priest gems

    At the point .1 PP wipes you, a DoT tick would kill the boss, so you'd have one of those moments where vent bursts into laughter as the boss dies, but the raid wipes anyway.

    In any case, Worshaka is right, always opt for regen when looking at two identical DPS results. It may not help in ever fight, but then you'll come across something like Anub HM where your mana consumption sky rockets and it will help tremendously.

  4. #24

    Re: shadow priest gems

    there is a point though where you really don't need any more regen I find that to be between 270 and 290 assuming shadow fiends are used at the right times, but i noticed different people have different results with this, this is where spirit loses some attractiveness in my mind.
    If I had a red and yellow socketable item with a +4 spirit bonus. I wouldn't be putting a reckless in there to get more mana regen... I would be putting it in there to get more PP. Fuck mana regen... I have fiend, dispersion and engineering mana pots if I am that hard up for the blue stuff.

  5. #25

    Re: shadow priest gems

    assuming i'm wrong, which is a strong possibility, correct this for me.

    Purified dreadstone is +12spell +10spirt = 14spell power and an additional 3 spell power when the proc goes = 17 spell power with proc. assuming you don't need any more regen PP is not a factor(?). which means socketing purified if socket bonus is +6 spell power or haste would be fine. +7 crit (i think) would also be good. even better if you did need a bit of regen.

    EDIT: I found where I think i am going horribly wrong. Improved Spirit Tap is a 10% bonus to spirit not spell power (duno why i had spell power in my head) so every dreadstone will give you another +1 spirit + glyph of shadow. still same basic socketing but helps a bit.

    Reckless in any yellow to get a socket bonus. 12spell + 10haste = 22 + any spell socket bonus, even spirit will be greater than runed.

    Runed everywhere else.

    Like i mentioned before on newer gear I am seeing bigger socket bonuses which pretty much says i'll be using more purified as i get the gear.


  6. #26

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    23 spell power in red sockets
    12 spell power/10 haste in yellow sockets
    12 spell power/10 spirit in blue sockets that give a bonus of 7 spell power or more and only if its blue/yellow or blue/red sockets not blue/blue are its a dps lose.
    Again, it is more like 5-6 PP/SP needed for the socket bonus to be good enough to socket a blue(using stat weights on shadowpriest.com)
    23 PP from runed - 17.9 PP from Purified = 5.1 PP needed for the socket bonus to be good.

    Also, for a socket bonus to be good, you just need basic math. Add together the PP values from each socket needed to the get the bonus(a blue/red would be 0PP + 5.1PP) and compare this PP value to the PP value that the socket bonus would give. If the Socket Bonus PP value is higher, gem for it. If not, then do not gem for it. Again, like Worshaka and Harky has said, 0.1PP has little meaning in terms of dps.

    Red Socket: This is the standard gem, so we say the PP value needed to socket into red sockets is 0.
    Blue Socket: 23PP - 17.9PP = 5.1PP
    Yellow Socket: 23PP - 21.8PP = 1.2PP

  7. #27

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    Iv not seen a 6sp socket before but maybe Iv never notice, all the ones iv seen are 5, 7, and 9 so I was going by what iv seen in game. Like I said tho they may be a 6 bonus iv not ever noticed it tho.

    ps. I checked and they is 6 bonus for crit and haste but still don't see a sp one.
    Notice I said 5-6 PP/SP meaning that the PP value of the socket bonus is equal to 5-6SP, plus the fact that 0.1PP is very insignificant to dps, so gemming a purified into a blue socket worth 5 PP is ok.

  8. #28

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    Its a dps loss so its not ok.
    By how much? Harky explained it pretty well of why it would be ok to gem a purified dreadstone into a 5 PP value socket

    Quote Originally Posted by harky
    At the point .1 PP wipes you, a DoT tick would kill the boss, so you'd have one of those moments where vent bursts into laughter as the boss dies, but the raid wipes anyway.

    In any case, Worshaka is right, always opt for regen when looking at two identical DPS results. It may not help in ever fight, but then you'll come across something like Anub HM where your mana consumption sky rockets and it will help tremendously.
    Then you're also adding in the fact that there is no RNG by assuming you'll notice that very slight dps gain(~5dps).

  9. #29

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    A dps loss is a dps loss.
    Is it a dps loss? Yes
    Will you ever notice it? No

    You're ignoring everything and just restating what you've already said. It looks like you're just getting your post count up than providing anything useful to the thread.

  10. #30

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    I just provided the fact that its a dps loss, and you have admitted that as well, so it seems to me your just posting bad info on this thread.
    Seriously, you're just skipping over everything that tears your argument apart. Yes, it is a dps loss in the sense that if the game was not RNG, you could tell. Well guess what? Since it is a RNG game, you will never notice that dps loss.

  11. #31

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    I just provided the fact that its a dps loss, and you have admitted that as well, so it seems to me your just posting bad info on this thread.
    Having a triple digit ping is a higher DPS loss than that 0.01 PP. Also, having stronger Spirit means a little less time before you need Dispersion. Which is a larger DPS loss. More time with real damage going out = more damage done = better overall. Purified is not a DPS loss.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  12. #32

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    I just noticed you admitted its a dps lose.
    /facepalm
    Seriously, if you really can't see how you will never, I repeat, you will NEVER be able to see this dps loss.

    In a theoretical sense(rawr), you can see the dps loss, but in a practical(in game; what really matters) sense, you will never, ever see it. Plus, harky has explained why it doesn't not matter anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by harky
    At the point .1 PP wipes you, a DoT tick would kill the boss, so you'd have one of those moments where vent bursts into laughter as the boss dies, but the raid wipes anyway.

    In any case, Worshaka is right, always opt for regen when looking at two identical DPS results. It may not help in ever fight, but then you'll come across something like Anub HM where your mana consumption sky rockets and it will help tremendously.
    Then Kelesti has a very valid point, if 1 thing gives practically the same amount of dps as another but with regen, getting the regen one will be better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    If your having mana problems after the buffs to priest your doing it wrong.
    Seriously, it is not. The more haste you have, the more you burn your mana. This amplifies in multi-dot situations.

  13. #33

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    ^ it's still a dps loss.
    THAT YOU WILL NEVER SEE

  14. #34

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    ^ its still a dps loss.
    The difference in DPS between +/- .1 PP is smaller than the margin of error in spreadsheets by several orders of magnitude. Calling that a DPS loss is fundamentally flawed as it is something which can not be definitively proven within the game. It's a purely theoretical DPS loss. On the other hand is is a DPS gain on the hardest fight in the game. So take that theory with a grain of salt.

  15. #35

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    ^ its still a dps loss.
    I hear not casting for 6 seconds is a bigger DPS loss.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  16. #36

    Re: shadow priest gems

    I like how you deal 2 million damage and people are worried about 0.1 SP which equates to something like 50 damage on a 40million health boss... good work on wasting your energy on insignificance.

    Just forget about those occasions where you get brezed with hardly any mana, or those times healers drop and you're forced to use Divine Hymnn and throw a few heals that makes your normally ok mana pool very empty, or those multi target encounters that have annoying mechanics making you cast SW:P repeatedly making you spend mana on something u never usually burn.

    I mean don't think about diversifying your role and preparing yourself for the unexpected, just pigeon hole your role and never evolve and worry about doing that extra 50 damage in 40 million... you sure are a credit to your guild and raid.

  17. #37

    Re: shadow priest gems

    wow, here it is for the slow people:
    -red socket = runed
    -yellow socket which has spirit/spellpower/haste/crit for filling = reckless
    -blue socket where bonus is 6spellpower or more = purified
    -blue/yellow socket that doesnt fit into above two = runed

    hard game i know

  18. #38

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Vander Nars
    I like how all these retards admit its a dps lose then start tossing out all this regen bullshit, its 10 spirit that dont regen for much so either way its dps loss with lil regen or dps gain with lil less regen. A dps loss is a loss and yall must be some awful priest.
    Its this sort of ignorance that is a trait of 99.9% of the wow population... its no wonder the 0.1% are constantly being hindered and prevented from faster progression.

    0.1 of a SP is the difference between 23SP and 12 SP 10 Spirit with a 5SP socket bonus... that 0.1 SP is further lessened by spell coeffecients.

    Lets put this in perspective... it takes an entire 2 VT durations for the difference to register 1 point of damage. Thats how insignifcant the difference is. Take into account that stat weights are only 100% correct for a specific set of gear, it's very possible that in your particular set of gear that the a purified dreadstone is more PP, just because shadowpriest.com says its worth 17.9 PP doesnt make it so for your gear set.

    Seriously, these idiots who are claiming 'a dps loss' have no comprehension of the relative nature of this so called 'dps loss'. Thank god you aren't in my guild is all I can say.

  19. #39

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Nice 8)

  20. #40

    Re: shadow priest gems

    Quote Originally Posted by Worshaka
    In most circumstances it's benefical to gem for the socket bonus using Purified Dreadstones, Runed Cardinal Rubies & Reckless Ametrines. The only time this isn't true is for single, double or tripple blue sockets... in the case of a single blue the difference is usually 0.1 PP, its not until double or tripple that it starts to amount to something significant.
    This. /thread
    "any type of person converting RL money into WoW is retarded by default." - Choppers
    "That makes all of WoW players retards, since we all pay our monthly fee." - Kenjji

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