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  1. #321

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by darkenrahl
    ohreally?
    check my alt char tavore, eu daggerspine..
    geared EXCLUSIVELY via pug, currently sitting on 4/5 toc 25 hc (we did toc25 hc just 5 times with this group and managed to get to anub with 48 try left a few weeks ago) VIA he forementioned "mixed group that plays together JUST once a week and without vent//ts"..
    we play once a week (sunday) from 20 gmt+1 to 23:30//24:00 gmt+1..
    first two times the group was set up, we just ran toc 25 norm +uldu..
    then switched to toc 25 norm + toc 25 hc (where ppls did unexpetactly well, downing 2/5 on our first toc 25 hc together since a few hadn't ever been in hc toc)..
    next week toc 25 norm + toc 25 hc (4/5, anub with 43 try)
    next week toc 25 norm + toc 25 hc (4/5, anub with 46 try)
    next week toc 25 norm + toc 25 hc (4/5, anub with 48 try)
    then icc came and we stopped doing toc 25 hc, and skimmed to icc25, clearing the content every week, save this where as i say we bought putri in p3 in the best try, and we have 6 try left but i doubt we'll use 'em since the policy is just raiding once a week..

    and if you don't believe me, ask about Relg, he's the "organizer"//rl, although no real strategy is ever issued apart from sporadic healer-->dps//tank-->dps switch and general strategy..
    people are expected to have watched a vid and have a general comprehension of the inc they are about to engage.. they are free to ask any question in case..
    that's how it works and it has worked FINE indeed so far

    Not to boast, but if you're a decent player playing WITH decent players (i won't lie to you, the peeps in here are "invited", not found via /LFM icc25... iirc lowest dps we have is sitting most time at 5.7-6k on non gimmick fight), there is no "badly tuned inc", there are incs that might get a bit chaotic in the end (ooze spawning rhytm increasing a LOT at the end of a boss for example is stressing..) but nothing so far stroke me as impossible..

    @nardog dps-wise the numbers are good looking, out of curiosity what buff did you have?
    unholy dk (how + 13%)
    mm huntard (ap)
    pala (bless+haste + replenishment iirc)
    mage (3% dmg neglibile, since you had the pally)
    veraan boomkin maybe?
    arc+eeragon tanks..
    so if you had a shammy healer and priest healer and kilroy as a pala healer, buff-wise you were nicely covered
    correct me if i'm wrong, i'm trying to guess your raid buff just out of curiosity, since it striked me oddly that dps-wise your numbers are in line with our 10men guild run, but you felt the need to run with 4 healers.. usually we run with 2 + 1 healer switching to dps when un-needed.. i'd ask the healers to cuts with the slacking if you feel the need of a fourth healer even remotely :L
    He has the right to call bullshit on that one. Pug has always implied going in an instance with randoms you found throughout the world. If most of your players are "handpicked" and do raid at least once a week then you are not really different from a guild right

  2. #322

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    @Kenmoo
    i beg to differ about the definition.. unless you're calling "guild" 25-30 able peeps that raid together but once a week..
    anyway i didn't call that PUG, i called it literally a "mixed group that plays together JUST once a week and without vent//ts".. a REAL pug is a trivial LFM, this is a group that i'm underlining is able to do the encounter the op was whining about without any sort of coordination of sort pulling solid dps from all sides..
    in my first post i underlined that good players with good gears should be able to do it at ease, and i double-checked it saying that i downed it with my alt with a group of ppl that play together BUT ONCE A WEEK..

    but back on topic.. i get "i call this bullshit @first few lines" by killarta..
    so either he think i've not downed it on my alt (wich i can prove at ease), or he thinks that festergut isn't a simply gearcheck (shame@him) or he thinks that a mixed group of ppl (provided i didn't EVER say it's a group gathered via /LFM ICC25 just be PR0 chat) can down this encounter (and again i can prove it wrong easily)..

  3. #323

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    our 213-226 geared alt bear tank whose main spec is restoration tanked festergut with my paladin on 10man alt run. (GS around 4.4k if anyone is interested).

    And only way putricide is actually hard is because it only allows 10 tries. takes 5-6 attempts to iron out the tactics and people learn how to move. after that it just takes a good try and its a kill. we wasted 2 tries because of insane lag, couple more with some of our dps disconnecting and a few fails on malleable goo. best try was at 12% with plenty of time to kill him when suddenly ranged died to goo.


  4. #324

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Impurath
    The tuning is just about right BUT I think the difficulty jump from The Entryway to The Plagueworks is too huge (in 25man). The Entryway should have been harder in first place.
    I don't think anyone on the planet would argue this, definitely true.

    Killed him in ten on my alt in mixed 219-232 gear last night for laughs. Such a joke on ten. And not a very funny one

  5. #325

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    This fight is as much a check for brain functionality of you guild as it is a small gear check. If you can't down this boss then your players/ guild just suck .And even if it was said 10thousand times, i'll say it again : "Stop the whining and l2p".

  6. #326

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    I like the fight, but what I dont realy like is how I as a moonkin will be able to output 7.5k dps while moving getting while gas screwing up the rotation etc. I can output 8k dps no problem on a stationary fight. This is not a stationary fight for casters.

    And what will happen on Heroic 25 man, say his HP is increased with 25%, 9300 dps, 50% 11k dps. Maby its time to recruit 13 more rogues to the guild, run with 15 rogues one enh shaman one warrior and one ret paladin.


  7. #327

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Razulath
    I like the fight, but what I dont realy like is how I as a moonkin will be able to output 7.5k dps while moving getting while gas screwing up the rotation etc. I can output 8k dps no problem on a stationary fight. This is not a stationary fight for casters.

    And what will happen on Heroic 25 man, say his HP is increased with 25%, 9300 dps, 50% 11k dps. Maby its time to recruit 13 more rogues to the guild, run with 15 rogues one enh shaman one warrior and one ret paladin.

    and you would get the nauseous pile and 3 spores in melee and wipe. this boss favors melee, perhaps some other boss favors casters. the boss still goes down with your dps and thats what matters right?

  8. #328

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Farosarg
    and you would get the nauseous pile and 3 spores in melee and wipe. this boss favors melee, perhaps some other boss favors casters. the boss still goes down with your dps and thats what matters right?
    This.

  9. #329

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Ad a ret I appriciate your buffs. 3% spell hit (exo and first con tick and holy wrath if I manage to somehow get it in) crit for exo and hw, 5% armor debuff.

    Oh and the not having 3 spores on my head.
    Pondering returning.
    Nikoll - Retribution Paladin

  10. #330

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Festergut (10) isn't really that hard. We had 3 "Let's see what he can do"-Tries and after that we killed him with 50 seconds left. (6 DPS, 2 Heal) And DPS wasn't really THAT good.





    I don't know about 25 yet (Raid is tonight) but I guess you just need good players and a little bit movement and this boss isn't that big a deal.
    Thank's for the honey, father bear.
    Nom Nom nom!

  11. #331

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Razulath
    I like the fight, but what I dont realy like is how I as a moonkin will be able to output 7.5k dps while moving getting while gas screwing up the rotation etc. I can output 8k dps no problem on a stationary fight. This is not a stationary fight for casters.

    And what will happen on Heroic 25 man, say his HP is increased with 25%, 9300 dps, 50% 11k dps. Maby its time to recruit 13 more rogues to the guild, run with 15 rogues one enh shaman one warrior and one ret paladin.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...=17156&e=17332

    10 man festergut I did yesterday (no difference tactic wise from 25), didn't log festergut 25 as I just started logging again. Anyways I was slacking a bit and I'm not totally used to the fight yet since it's new, but it wasn't very hard to do 7.5k dps on that one.

    This will probably be percieved as a bragging post, but it's just to show that it's pretty easy to do 7.5k dps or higher on this boss as a boomkin.

    edit:

    before anyone asks, no I didn't stay in melee and the lock was the spore target for ranged.

  12. #332

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Farosarg
    and you would get the nauseous pile and 3 spores in melee and wipe. this boss favors melee, perhaps some other boss favors casters. the boss still goes down with your dps and thats what matters right?
    care to gimme a list?
    marrowgar favours caster?? pfttt who's breaking the bone spikes?
    deathwhisper favours caster?? pffftt, with the excuse that "ranged don't loose dps while moving" hunters, casters and dk (spreading disease fun..) are on the adds usually..
    saurfang favours caster? yeah.....
    ohnoes then it's festergut that favours caster amirite?
    na! maybe it's rotface a tad!
    and then back to putricide, where CLEARLY ranged have sooo much advantage given that rogues aren't even considered for target switching...
    of course, icc so far doesn't favour melee, that guy is clearly imagining things ;D

  13. #333

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Farosarg
    and you would get the nauseous pile and 3 spores in melee and wipe. this boss favors melee, perhaps some other boss favors casters. the boss still goes down with your dps and thats what matters right?
    1.Two with the spores move out 16 continue to dps.
    2.PROFIT!!

    And no boss favours casters, if you are not one of those focused on lady deathwhisper shield burning. And even there you will as lucky to be dispelled from your main school of magic, or if you are lucky as me, get both of your magic schools dispelled. "OHOH I can sit here for 8 seconds"

    And the boss will not go down with my dps because i will not reach the 7.5k mark when moving.

  14. #334

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Razulath
    And no boss favours casters, if you are not one of those focused on lady deathwhisper shield burning. And even there you will as lucky to be dispelled from your main school of magic, or if you are lucky as me, get both of your magic schools dispelled. "OHOH I can sit here for 8 seconds"
    You seem to be talking about the curse correct? Because I guarantee that the curse is at least as bad for rogues (probably melee in general) as it is for you if not more. Lets see what is the worst thing spell that can get the CD for you, AB? Well for me its Sinister Strike, and I guarantee you that if I have to shiv for my main attack, you could do far more damage replacing AB with another spell.

    @dark: Putricide does favor ranged. The most important part of Putricide is getting the adds down, it is not dpsing Putricide (until p3 which is basically a gimme burn the boss phase). If you are using a strat where rogues don't get off the boss you are already realizing the crappiest part about being a rogue: target switching. The reason you might have a rogue stay on the boss is because they are near worthless if you don't (though my guild has us switch), meaning they are worthless on the most important part of Putricide. Idc what caster you are, you lose far far far less dps than a rogue by having to kill adds on Putricide.

    Also I dont see how Rotface favors melee at all. Ranged stands in the group with the melee, so ok you lose a little dps when you have to move from the slime spray where melee doesn't lose as much. However, when melee gets the debuff and has to run to the OT we are doing 0 dps to the boss.

    I would say that Marrowgar favors casters. I don't see why you don't see this as you mentioned the mechanic that clearly favors casters. You can shoot the spikes without moving. If marrowgar screws anyone its not melee or casters but hunters.

    Saurfang basically can favor casters too. From either way you look at it, either you are a caster doing the most important job in the fight: killing blood beasts, or you are a caster sitting on the boss doing the exact same thing melee does. Melee can not easily kill blood beasts and so are basically funneled into only being allowed to do a single thing on the fight, since you risk some one getting hit unless you can perma stun it so you might be able to have melee kill 1 of the 4. Casters can do BOTH, that is can efficiently kill blood beasts or chose to sit on the boss in melee range like the melee and negate any sort of favoritism that you claim the boss has for melee in relation to the casters sitting on him.

    BTW you can have casters sit with melee on festergut also.

    Honestly you seem to be whining that your class has the option to do multiple different roles in many of the different fights. I would be extremely happy if there was another role I could do on a lot of these fights as a rogue, i.e. tanking on RoS in BT.

    If you want to sit on the boss, take it up with your raid leader because there is no reason you can't.

  15. #335
    Warchief DirewolfX's Avatar
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    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by darkenrahl
    care to gimme a list?
    marrowgar favours caster?? pfttt who's breaking the bone spikes?
    deathwhisper favours caster?? pffftt, with the excuse that "ranged don't loose dps while moving" hunters, casters and dk (spreading disease fun..) are on the adds usually..
    saurfang favours caster? yeah.....
    ohnoes then it's festergut that favours caster amirite?
    na! maybe it's rotface a tad!
    and then back to putricide, where CLEARLY ranged have sooo much advantage given that rogues aren't even considered for target switching...
    of course, icc so far doesn't favour melee, that guy is clearly imagining things ;D
    Maybe you need to change your strategy a bit.

    Marrowgar: Everyone groups up near the boss's butt so both ranged and melee can see and take down spikes fast. Melee lose just as much on spikes (killing spikes is more important than bloating your meters on the boss) and can't DPS as easily during bone storm.

    Deathwhisper: Your guild is doing it a bit backwards, but whatever works for you. Melee on Deathwhisper makes the D&D on her a pita. We have ranged nuke Deathwhisper except for myself (mage), a boomkin and a hunter (for killing reanimated fanatics and kiting zombies), who kill her and switch to help for those specific adds.

    Saurfang: Favors melee for bloated meters, but as another poster pointed out, the damage you're doing to the beasts is more important than the fact that the melee is doing higher DPS on a single target. No one is going to stack only rogues and melee so they can burn the boss down and ignore beasts.

    And hell, even in the second wing:

    Festergut: Requires 6 ranged/healers to take the DPS/HPS hit and move. Two of the eight that stay ranged can be designated collapse points and never move. The rest of your ranged and healers can stand with the melee and never move. So if you're caster heavy, you can make some of your casters 'melee' for the fight. If your heals are rock solid, you can even make more of them 'melee' (but I'd lean towards putting tank healers in the melee group before DPS, given the amount he hits for).

    Rotface: No real difference for melee and casters. You're both boned if you get the infection and you both have to move for slime spray and unstable ooze explosion.

  16. #336

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    It's hard to say really. I'm in a semi-casual raiding guild (whatever that means), we only did 2/5 TOGC before ICC released and never did any serious Ulduar Hardmodes.

    We played with Festergut the first night a bit, and found we had too low DPS overall. Stacking only our best DPS we managed to do him in only 4-5 attempts the 2nd night but we were really tight on the enrage. In 10 man it was an easy 1 shot with 3 healers (2 of us being off spec).

    I personally think he's OK, but probably a bit on the tough side. It's unlikely that any PUGS are going to get him before the nerfs. But I'd rather see someone like us take a few more attempts but then be able to get him with more than 1-2 seconds left before enrage.

    Rotface seemed strange. We couldn't get him below 40% in 10 man and I still don't understand why. In 25 man it was at most 4 pulls, and at the end of the night when everyone was tired, and he died. Didn't seem that bad. Maybe we're better at coordination than maxxed out DPS.

  17. #337

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by darkenrahl
    care to gimme a list?
    marrowgar favours caster?? pfttt who's breaking the bone spikes?
    deathwhisper favours caster?? pffftt, with the excuse that "ranged don't loose dps while moving" hunters, casters and dk (spreading disease fun..) are on the adds usually..
    saurfang favours caster? yeah.....
    ohnoes then it's festergut that favours caster amirite?
    na! maybe it's rotface a tad!
    and then back to putricide, where CLEARLY ranged have sooo much advantage given that rogues aren't even considered for target switching...
    of course, icc so far doesn't favour melee, that guy is clearly imagining things ;D
    you are not getting my point: I don't really care who the hell tops the damn meters. Like one of the posters above said its casters who do one of the important jobs on Saurfang and deals with the adds. So if you wish to kill the boss they need to know what the hell they are doing.

    On Festergut raid needs casters too. And they will need to know what the hell they are doing and move and actually pay attention to their surroundings (whoa dude!) and still pull the best dps they can in that environment. The boss dies and raid progresses forward. If Rogues and DK:s feel high and allmighty and flex their e-peen on the meters after doing nothing but spamming their rotation then just pity the fools and concentrate on how you can improve yourself on that fight and the next ones.

  18. #338
    Mechagnome ejzo's Avatar
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    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    just killed him in exactly 5 min.

    tuned perfectly imo
    ....................................................................................

  19. #339

    Re: Festergut tuned like shit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by PvE_Mage
    lowest we got him was around 50%

    Additionally, all the moving around is fucking cock-blocking my DPS >
    Q_Q my guild sucks and i'm a bad dps

    Suck it up. Do better.

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