Affliction PVE

[Deleted]

I believe a dmg debuff is a dmg debuff. Doesnt make sense that 2 dmg debuffs work differently, but I go check right away. But I really doubt it works any different then CoE. Wouldnt make sence from a designing point of view either.

I would have agreed, but with the way corruption has run recently I no longer trust myself to interpret tooltips

Edit: Yeah, I tested too and I think you are right.

[gherkin]

The buff is exactly the same as CoE, so it also works the same. Dots check this each tick. And since its a 5% buff, you need 20 ticks in order to make up for the 1 tick you loose rougly. So its not hard to see imo that you dont have to apply the 3 stacks in the beginning.

http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-warlock/affliction-learning-to-corrupt/

It updates. I'm still fully debuffing my target first just out of personal preference and the fact that the dps difference is negligible.

[Fecys]

http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-wa...ng-to-corrupt/

It updates. I'm still fully debuffing my target first just out of personal preference and the fact that the dps difference is negligible.

Meh I prefer to keep it simple and do it as normal. The dps difference is small, but its one so why not. Imo.

[Nam]

Thanks for the replies so far, I'll work them into the first post soon.

To the starting sequence discussion: First of all, the patch is not live yet, so I stick to the current starting sequence for now. Second, Fecys wins the thread in my opinion:

"The buff is exactly the same as CoE, so it also works the same. Dots check this each tick. And since its a 5% buff, you need 20 ticks in order to make up for the 1 tick you loose rougly. So its not hard to see imo that you dont have to apply the 3 stacks in the beginning."

This is exactly the point. By firing SB first, you loose uptime. While casting Haunt first is reasonable (+28% damage buff), SB first is NOT a clear case. As a side note this is only the first 10 seconds of a fight, so who cares anyway. I will look into this deeper when I find the time.

To Decads post:
You will feel offended, but as far as I can see you do NOT know what you are talking about. Putting Corruption up before doing anything else means you do not understand the whole problem about rolling corruption at all, 250 haste once per minute for 10 seconds is NOT better than 63 sp permanently and finally Tuskarr's does not give 10% runspeed - if it did, none would ever argue about that enchantment. I appreciate discussion and pointing out mistakes, but please do your homework beforehand.

[Warlocomotif]

With GoLT 1 spi = 0.5 SP (30% from fel armor, 20% from GoLT)

At hit cap icewalker gives 12 crit which is less valuable than the 18 spirit (9SP)

Tuskarr's value is very situationally dependent, and thus fairly difficult to assess for comparison, though I agree that it's probably the best choice, given the relatively minor benefit from the alternatives.

This is wrong, 1 spirit from gear or gems = 1.1 spirit in raids due to blessing of kings. As such with Fel armor and Glyph of Life Tap, 1 spirit from gear is 0.55 spellpower in raids. (Add another 3% if you're human, making it 0.55*1.03=0.5665)

[Hammerbeard]

I made this 264BiS list some time ago, maybe it will aid you in some way: http://www.wowhead.com/?profile=20748327

In what universe is this BiS? You have 13.80% hit (362 rating) before talents and buffs. In a raid setting, you have 19.80% hit (+3% from Suppression, +3% from Misery/Imp. FF), 20.80% hit if you're playing an Alliance toon (+1% heroic presence).

You can drop hit by swapping Valanar's Other Signet Ring for Ring of Rapid Ascent, swapping Amulet of the Silent Eulogy for Blood Queen's Crimson Choker, or swapping Wand of Ruby Claret for Corpse-Impaling Spike.

Furthermore, past 3300 spellpower self-buffed, SP/haste gems are worth the same DPS as a pure SP gem (not EXACTLY the same, but the difference is something like 0.2 dps), meaning that it is advantageous to match all gem sockets that are red or yellow, as well as blue if the socket bonus is greater than 6sp/6haste/9crit.

TL;DR
Someone was wrong on the internet and I was compelled to respond.

[Deleted]

This is wrong, 1 spirit from gear or gems = 1.1 spirit in raids due to blessing of kings. As such with Fel armor and Glyph of Life Tap, 1 spirit from gear is 0.55 spellpower in raids. (Add another 3% if you're human, making it 0.55*1.03=0.5665)

Very true, I hadn't considered this. I'm used to raiding ten man with an unreliable composition, so I always consider personal values. It hardly devalues my point, however.

Edit: rather than post again. I'll just add a thanks to this one. I'll remember that in future.

[Warlocomotif]

Very true, I hadn't considered this. I'm used to raiding ten man with an unreliable composition, so I always consider personal values. It hardly devalues my point, however.

For 10 mans you could atleast take 8% from drums of forgotten kings still. And I didn't mean to suggest your point was wrong, just correcting a mistake that a lot of people tend to make.

[nocturnus]

In what universe is this BiS? You have 13.80% hit (362 rating) before talents and buffs. In a raid setting, you have 19.80% hit (+3% from Suppression, +3% from Misery/Imp. FF), 20.80% hit if you're playing an Alliance toon (+1% heroic presence).

You can drop hit by swapping Valanar's Other Signet Ring for Ring of Rapid Ascent, swapping Amulet of the Silent Eulogy for Blood Queen's Crimson Choker, or swapping Wand of Ruby Claret for Corpse-Impaling Spike.

Furthermore, past 3300 spellpower self-buffed, SP/haste gems are worth the same DPS as a pure SP gem (not EXACTLY the same, but the difference is something like 0.2 dps), meaning that it is advantageous to match all gem sockets that are red or yellow, as well as blue if the socket bonus is greater than 6sp/6haste/9crit.

TL;DR
Someone was wrong on the internet and I was compelled to respond.

Wrong profile, sorry. I swapped out the neck and wand too see whether I would be hitcapped as destruction and saved the profile under that same name. It should be updated now.

I guess you haven't looked closely at the profile, because every single red/orange socket is gemmed accordingly. Blue sockets with a socket bonus equal or inferior to 7sp contain a 23sp gem.

When the 10 man hardmodes are released, some things might change. (bracers and neck for instance)

By firing SB first, you loose uptime. While casting Haunt first is reasonable (+28% damage buff), SB first is NOT a clear case. As a side note this is only the first 10 seconds of a fight, so who cares anyway. I will look into this deeper when I find the time.

I assume you mean 'by firing the second sb first'. Whether you decide to apply the third stack of SE before having applied your dots or after, you should always start with a sb to apply the 5% crit debuff as soon as possible.

It would also be nice to have professions added to the thread and maybe explain that when clipping DS, this should be done right after a tick.

[Simbert]

To Decads post:
You will feel offended, but as far as I can see you do NOT know what you are talking about. Putting Corruption up before doing anything else means you do not understand the whole problem about rolling corruption at all, 250 haste once per minute for 10 seconds is NOT better than 63 sp permanently and finally Tuskarr's does not give 10% runspeed - if it did, none would ever argue about that enchantment. I appreciate discussion and pointing out mistakes, but please do your homework beforehand.

As far as i know, Tuskaars gives 8% runspeed. While this is significantly lower than 10%, i do not believe that the case with running speed is so clearly cut that 10% is a clear buy, while 8% is not. I like to have Tuskaar more than having 18 spirit, though, since situations where running that bit faster is more beneficial are probably more numerous than situations where that tiny amount of spellpower is the thing that makes or breaks something.

[iLive]

The guide should contain a link to Affliction: Learning to corrupt.

[fatman]

Corruption's damage will increase even if Shadow Embrace isn't applied until after corruption is.

what is that mean?

does corr take effect of SE even not recast?

[Deleted]

Corruption's damage will increase even if Shadow Embrace isn't applied until after corruption is.

what is that mean?

does corr take effect of SE even not recast?

Yes, that is what it means. (so will all your other dots)

[Darkrobinson]

Great guide, however there's some things i'd like to add:

* 2 points in suppression is generally considered a more viable choice than Imp.SD
Reasons behind that are simple. Two points will lower your HR cap by 52, thus allowing you to invest into other stats, like haste, spirit or crit. It also lowers your affliction spells' mana cost by 4%. That opposed to 20% less threat generation really isn't comparable, as affliction warlocks arent renoun for their burst potencial, and Soulshatter CD decrease down to 3 mins makes threat on bossfights easily manageable. If you're still having problem, you can always just ask for a Hand of Salvation, or request a Vigilance (mainly applies to raids, for which Vigilance should either go to hunters or warlocks anyway).

And as far as Heroic dungeons are concerned, Improved Drain Soul might actually be viable there, but to my experience, heroic dungeons are a massive aoe fest nowadays (with the exception of Pit of Saron).



* Soft haste cap (1sec GCD/50% haste) is quite easy reachable with Eradication proccing, or with usage of a Haste potion, Heroism/Bloodlust or a haste trinket (Like Scale of Fates). Thus saying that it has a small effect on decision making isn't 100% true, especially with Icecrown iLvl gear, when haste obtained from gear itself can soar up to in excess of 1000.

Since this is a guide, a pointer to the fact that if your spells have a spell cast of less then a second, it's actually a dps loss, because you'll have to wait a moment to be able to cast your next spell, due to the GCD being a minimum of 1 second.



* With glyph of Life Tap being essential for a typical affliction warlock, there's really no point not to spec into it. The way the game works for affliction warlock at this moment, means that Dark Pact is simply a wasted talent point, and thus even mentioning a build that specializes in that should be scrubbed off and thrown into a bucket of Blizz's failed ideas.


Again, I'd like to point out that you've done a nice work so far, and it's definately recomendable to someone who's new at playing a warlock. Keep it up

[harky]

* Soft haste cap (1sec GCD/50% haste) is quite easy reachable with Eradication proccing, or with usage of a Haste potion, Heroism/Bloodlust or a haste trinket (Like Scale of Fates). Thus saying that it has a small effect on decision making isn't 100% true, especially with Icecrown iLvl gear, when haste obtained from gear itself can soar up to in excess of 1000.

Since this is a guide, a pointer to the fact that if your spells have a spell cast of less then a second, it's actually a dps loss, because you'll have to wait a moment to be able to cast your next spell, due to the GCD being a minimum of 1 second.

Shadow Bolt, Drain Soul and Corruption are all completely unaffected by the soft cap and that's 65%+ of your damage. The ratio of DPS gain is very high well beyond the soft cap. It basically takes haste from working 100% on 65% of your damage and being worth ~20% on the other 35% to still working 100% on 65%, but not working at all on the other 35%. So a 72% impact to a 65% impact and only with specific procs up.


[/quote]* With glyph of Life Tap being essential for a typical affliction warlock, there's really no point not to spec into it. The way the game works for affliction warlock at this moment, means that Dark Pact is simply a wasted talent point, and thus even mentioning a build that specializes in that should be scrubbed off and thrown into a bucket of Blizz's failed ideas.
[/quote]

Dark Pact procs the glyph of Life Tap and allows you to gear full Crit/Haste with less reliance on your weakest stat in Spirit. It's not wasted at all and 56/0/15 builds with DP are the current highest DPS spec available to Warlocks.

[jazx]

alright i got some fairly noob warlock questions here, just trying to better myself.

first, if i have the eng 340haste per min enchant(or any haste buff like scale of fate and whatnot) is it better to just use it right off the bat in a fight and just use it every CD, OR is it better to use it just before my corrp to get the full 10seconds of haste on corrp? since i have been told haste doesnt stick too corrp like crit or spelldmg wld after the buff has fallen off me

second, on fights were you run around constantly like putricide, should i reaply CoA while im running so i dont have to do it later or let it fully tick down?, since it gets stronger the less time it has on a target.

again i apologize if theses are fairly common questions for warlocks, and iv always played a melee class so i dont really understand the lingo of casters. "clipping" is one im still a little unsure about, that would be kind of wat im talking about CoA and reaplying it before it falls off, that would be "clipping". plz correct me if im wrong

edit: answered my own noob question about haunt

[Fannyd]

I wrote a little Affliction guide for the locks in my guild:
It's not comprehensive but just gives some little tips and tricks that I use:

1. Never
Ever
Ever
Let corruption drop off.
Ever

2. Make sure that you are always doing something. If you have to run at all - hit dark pact, CoA if it need refreshing or nightfalled Shadowbolt

3. Shadowbolt is still your best friend, not only that but he's been updated to refresh corruption too. This is an amazing change which means that achieving point 1 is possible even on huge movement fights like Rotface.

4. Use nightfall procs intelligently. Remember that they refresh corruption so if you have a NF proc and have to run, save it until corruption needs refreshing.

5. Haunt is the key to our DPS. If it even looks lie it might drop off you have failed. it is far better to re-cast as soon as it comes off CD than try and squeeze in 3 more SBs and let haunt drop off.

6. This is probably the most important, and one that applies to all lock specs. PLAN YOUR FIGHT.
Demonic Portal is an amazing talent when used well, but it means you have to plan it, which of course changes with every fight.

7. Recast Corruption under 35% (so it benefits from death's embrace) and make sure that you keep all DoTs up in the final 25% Drain Soul execute phase. Time your DoT reapplication with your DS ticks, what I mean by that is - watch the damage coming off the boss and only reapply a DoT when you see a 15-20,000 drain soul tick.

8. Use your Haste Pot in the final 25%, and make sure you recast Corruption when you've popped it.

9. Dark Pact is far better than Life Tap with the way that gear is itemised in T10.


OK so Openers.
This is what I usually use, it works for me:

5 secs Before pull
Dark Pact
Pop potion of wild magic - If you pop a pot before the pull then you can also pop one later in the fight. Why this is great for us is that because we roll our Corruption it will keep the potion buffs until you either refresh it manually or let it drop off much later on in the fight.

On pull
Whilst running in cast Corruption and CoA
Haunt
Shadow Bolt
Shadow Bolt
UA


And then settle into the usual Affliction rotations, refreshing DoTs when needed (make sure you don't clip - i.e. refresh before a DoT has run it's time)

[Deleted]

second, on fights were you run around constantly like putricide, should i reaply CoA while im running so i dont have to do it later or let it fully tick down?, since it gets stronger the less time it has on a target.

always let it fully tick down. i'm sure there are some cases when it's effectively a dps gain to reapply it early, but they will be extremely rare and certainly if you are looking for a 'general rule' clipping CoA will not be it.

[Warlocomotif]

About engineering glove enchant: just use it on cooldown.
About CoA: try not to clip it, but also try not to be doing nothing. In general Life tap/dark pact is preferable- or even deathcoil if you don't need it for the self heal.

About Fannyd's opening sequence: You're throwing 5% crit right down the drain because you use corruption before shadow bolt. That's a really bad idea.

[Vicieus]

Is there any point in which switching glyph of life tap with say corruption (to keep SE stacks up during drain phase [after about 8 secs of draining]) is worth it? Im currently in four set. 3/4 sanc (one 251 set item). with almost every item 264 (save wand and trinkets) and my spirit is pretty awful self buffed. My thinking is with corruption stacks of SE wont fall off, and I can cast sbs on the run (lots of fights with constant movement).

I've read EJ forums a lot but the one post I read about using the glyph is that it's not worth it because it still costs a GCD, however, with nightfall+glyph procs there's no cast time. With regular sbs theres a cast time + GCD...