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  1. #421

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements


    Truly a complete overhaul of the raiding system, it's a big change.

    I have to say, I kind of like it. It will definitely save on burnout from raids, and if you don't make it into the guild's 25 man run that week, you don't feel left out if you're running a 10 man with the guildies.

    This will ONLY work if Blizz does a good job matching the difficulty levels though. I have faith that they can do this.


    That is all.
    I've played a balance druid and an arms warrior since the release of Vanilla WoW, simply because they are fun and I like the play styles. Do NOT complain to me about how much blizzard hates your class, or has nerfed your class, or how underpowered your class is. Been there. Deal with it.
    Enjoy the game.

  2. #422

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Quote Originally Posted by trilog
    lol if anything Cataclysm is avoiding free gear, but I suppose asking you to grasp the concept of 1 lockout = less gear is a little too much for a degenerate such as yourself. grats though! the equivalent of doing heroic ICC is the equivalent of running t4 content in TBC.

    oh what's that? you only made it to t4 content in TBC? that would explain everything. come talk to me when you've done anything remotely challenging.

    more butthurt please it's amusing to watch morons like yourself get mad.
    Twins in Vanilla
    Quit for the original Naxx, not the one you wiped in at level 80.

    Server first Illidan, Archimonde, Vashj and Kael. Server second Kil'Jaeden (pre nerf, not that you would know who he is either)

    Rank 13 Hunter.

    Cleared everything in Wrath before it was nerfed.

    Keep trying you shitty, you and your "10 man guild" are terrible.

    Now call me a nerd for accomplishing all of the above playing 15-20 hours a week tops.

  3. #423
    The Lightbringer Snes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Quote Originally Posted by wooshiewoo

    When you think it through, you will realise the only thing that changes are hardcore guilds will find it mandatory to do 10 man's to get World kills, nothing else changes.
    The news has always been separated for that.
    "World first Lich King 10 man by.."
    *week later*
    "World first Lich King 25 man by.."
    I bet 1k gold that they will still be doing 25's.
    Take a break from politics once in awhile, it's good for you.

  4. #424

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    No one who says 25 man are harder have done 10 mans without 25 man gear. Regardless of this, its a moot point because per the post, the content will be tuned to be identical in difficulty, with the incentive for 25's being more gear, more badges, and more gold (ala faster progression and gear up, and meaning all the lil ignatz my gear is better than yours children will still want to do 25 to be first).

  5. #425

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Quote Originally Posted by Cathercy
    I like it.
    Nerdrage-15 Minute Cooldown. You enter a berserker rage, increasing typing speed by 75%, chance to hit CAPS LOCK by 50% and decreasing chance to get laid by 100%. You feel no pity or remorse and can not be stopped unless banned.

  6. #426

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    This is great news in my opinion.

    Less gear inflation.
    No need to raid more than a couple nights per week.
    Older raids may still see action (see TK and SSC in Burning Crusade.. still cleared weekly by BT guilds pretty often)

    HOPEFULLY it will mean 10 mans will be made harder, not that 25 mans will be made easier.

  7. #427

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    This is the biggest fail from Blizzard _ever_. This will make 25 man raids useless, who wants to raid them if you get the same loot from 10 man? And the difficulty is gonna be the same? Goodbye "the real challenge" all hardcore raiders want from 25 man heroics, it's all gonna be gone now. Sure you can raid the 25 hc and get like 20 spell power more from an item, AWESOME. And of course an achievement lol.

    And this one lockout? So fucking stupid, people kill all the bosses from a raid in one or two nights and then sit idle the rest of the week? Good job, Blizzard, goob job.

    I so wish Blizz is gonna change this before cata, and if they don't, think what went wrong when all they hear is QQ about casual playing.

  8. #428

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    It astounds me the preconceived notions that people have in regards to raiding. As someone who has done hardcore 25-man raiding, and someone who has done only 10-man raiding, I welcome this change whole heartedly. 25-man raiders do not deserve better gear because they managed to find another fifteen people to attend their raid. The difficulty level between 10-man content and 25-man is essentially just people. In 25-mans, you might find an additional mechanic during a boss fight, but the biggest difference is typically the amount of health the boss has. They will usually do more damage, as well, to make up for the fact that they assume that 25-man raiders will have better gear then 10-man raiders.

    I want you to think about that for a moment. The only reason 25-man content is harder is because it's artificially harder due to the additional number of moronic people you might be bringing with you. It's harder because there are more people to screw you over. How is this fun? How is this exciting? 10-man raiding right now is given no respect due to the fact that 25-man raiders can come in and just roll it as soon as it's out due to their gear level. 10-man instances were never made to be difficult for people who out-gear them. 10-man content shouldn't be viewed as a training ground for 25-man content, or to get a few easy pieces to make up for what you don't have to make 25-man content easier. This lessens greatly the accomplishment of a 10-man who is a close-knit group of friends who work well together and can accomplish things without having to spend hours upon hours in a 25-man instance.

    So, at this point, "hardcore" raiders are complaining because they're no longer given the prestige of managing to find fifteen additional players who will, at some point, cause wipes for them. They're complaining because now 10-man raiding means something. It doesn't take away from you. If anything, it promotes your style of play. An environment where every single player in the raid has far more impact on what's actually happening, rather than having the ability for several people to go afk, screw up or DC and you still accomplish your goal. If anything, this promotes competent, progressive raiding. We have more time for learning and dominating content rather than sitting around scrounging for players. I understand that the progression-minded, world first raids already have the players they need, but Blizzard doesn't build content expressly for those people.

    Shame on you.

  9. #429

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Quote Originally Posted by McSqueezy
    Silly bitch is silly, 25m's= DOUBLE TO TRIPLE the amount of loot, badges, GOLD IN 10m's. 25m's aren't dead unless shit heads like you ran the raiding community en masse.
    Silly troll is silly.
    And DOUBLE the people competing for loot.

    And there is no way they will "balence" 10 and 25, it will always be easier to control 10 people then 25, always be easier to find 10 good players than 25, always be more room to spread out(BQL) etc etc.

  10. #430

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    This is just... silly imo.
    Means people will have less content to play with.

    25 man raiders who normally do 10 mans for extra badges, will get bored real quickly, or split off into 10 man guilds, and later on quit.

    Bad, Bad move by blizzard.

  11. #431

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Quote Originally Posted by Nykez
    This. And raid comps are so much easier to cheese in 10 mans, so i think 10 mans will be by far easier in the end and there is absolutely no reason to do 25 mans. I'll miss you serious raiding :'(
    Who says 10 mans will not be serious in Cataclysm? If Blizzard does what they say they're going to do, then it will be as serious as the 25 man version. Cheese the raid comp? With 10 players/classes to choose from there's really not much room to have variety when you seriously min/max your tanks, healers, melee dps, ranged dps, and have a solid balance of buffs possible. With 25 man it's much easier to cheese imo. Yes, I have raided both 25 and 10 man and this is my opinion so sue me.

  12. #432

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Quote Originally Posted by Biged781
    How about linking your heroic 10 man LK kill for us.
    How about linking your normal mode LK kill for us?

  13. #433

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    I dont like this in the least, I do 25 mans in the guild where we bring all our members and give Fester all our gold, and then i run in our main group to roll 10 man. What this is telling me is we now have the choice between running with the best 10 people in the guild ... or everyone else

    The only result i see in this is now i can raid on all 4(5 in cat) of my toons get equal gear and all the alts of our top raiders will raid for all our alts rather than our lesser members ever seeing raid content. Great for me bad for 15 other people.

    And yes i raid all 4 of my toons through 10 mans every week. 3 guild 1 pug, yes i have no life, but i enjoy it.

  14. #434

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Just when you thought gear couldn't become more available

  15. #435

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    A sad day. I will miss alot of people, but thanks for the heads up - i can pretty much quit wow now. 10 mans aint fun and it will not be possible to keep a 25-man guild going. I did enjoy this game, but without raiding i dont see the point anymore.

  16. #436

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Thats the most stupid idea from loooong time.

    It will kill all 25 man raiding, since it easier to carry 9 men with with instead of 24 :O

    GJ Blizzard.

  17. #437

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Main does 25 man with the guild 3 times a week, alt does a 10 man alt run with better players from the guild once a week;

    ow lol my alt is better geared than my main lol!

  18. #438

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    Sad change, even if i'm in a R25 guild, i enjoy playing R10, either in pugs or with guild. Now i will be forced to choose between the 2.

    Can't they just let ppl play the game how they want to?

  19. #439

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    LoL 25 mans are dead!

  20. #440

    Re: Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

    okej: think about it this way:

    let's say people raid ICC 4days in a week now, both 10 as 25. Now you got 2 kinds of raids with the same difficulty..

    you raid instance 1 2days, and instance 2 2days in a week. That means you will be doing the same amount of raiding, and you can even vary per week if you're going to do 10 or 25.

    Yay, I love me 10man guild suddenly.

    have to make the instances a lot harder then

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