Why do people hate SotA?

[Dragonwing]

Every time I read threads about battlegrounds, many people are saying "SotA is terrible", "SotA is never fun", "SotA is disfunctional". But I literally never see any reason why. Why is this battleground as terrible as people make it out to be?

Ive done SotA many times and it is really just like wintergrasp. Only, if you dont like vehicles, theres bombs on the ground you can use. I havnt seen any reason as to why the battleground is disfunctional. On my battlegroup, we dont get 5 people leaving immediately at the start like some people put it, we dont get people complaining, and there is actually generally less retards than in WSG. I actually vastly prefer SotA over WSG. The same battleground for 5 years with a generic battlemode, and easy for retards to screw up? Do not want.

So, MMO champion, id love to hear a valid reason as to why SotA is as bad as you make it out to be.

Here are some reasons i came up with;

1. Vehicles.
Warning. Change ahead.
Those words always come to mind when hearing vehicle arguments. Its actually quite funny, and sad at the same time, when i hear people complaining that they cant get used to vehicles, i rolled a rogue not a siege tank, the controls are clunky. Ill agree to the clunky part when it comes to siege tanks and demolishers (although when i see that word used in Oculus/Malygos arguments i facepalm). They do need to be able to strafe and mouse turn. But even in that case, you arent doing much turning in SotA anyway. Its just, charge up to the gate and shoot/ram spam. Nothing hard about it. Its quite funny seeing the vehicle complains, even though i feel sorry to the person who doesnt have the mental capacity to handle basic mechanics...

Also, the funniest part is, if done well, you dont even have to use the vehicles. You can just get a lot of people to carry bombs over to the gates. Herp. Derp. GTFO.

2. Bad Battlegroups and Losing.
My battlegroup is really good for the horde side in SotA (Reckoning). We dont lose much. However, i can understand that there are some people who are from much more unfortunate battlegroups for their faction, who would lose every single time in SotA. This is not really a valid reason to say the battleground itself is terrible however, as the problem is your Battlegroup.

3. ??

I honestly cant think of much else. Just, people love to complain. And people dont come to the forums to say how much they love something, they come saying how much they hate it. So all we see on the forums is the complaints. And some people just cant think for themselves if their lives depended on it, so they just go with the crowd and hate the same thing. Then it goes in a cycle of more and more people hating something just because it is the cool thing.

That, is the main reason why we see so many complaints. Nothing about the battleground, its the forum posters.

[Narfwak]

SotA is horrible for melee. Two competent ranged DPS in demolisher seats can tear through just about anything. I love it, but that's because the map is super unbalanced in my favor.

It was even more hilariously stupid when you could knockback the demolishers with thunderstorm... pretty much impossible to lose it back then.

[Merlinsback]

SOTA is a pve bg. If everyone played the game correctly there would be little to NO actual PvP! You are killing demo's and breaking through walls with demo's. It's not like the classic's (ab, av, wsg, eots) where you are fighting other people. And that's why it's no fun... If I wanted to pve I would go do ICC...

[Dragonwing]

SOTA is a pve bg. If everyone played the game correctly there would be little to NO actual PvP! You are killing demo's and breaking through walls with demo's. It's not like the classic's (ab, av, wsg, eots) where you are fighting other people. And that's why it's no fun... If I wanted to pve I would go do ICC...

That is not the meaning of pve. You arent fighting any npcs.

There is plenty of pvp in it. Defending the Demos, assaulting graveyards, defending the titan relics, stopping bomb disarmers. To be honest, it seems as if you havnt done SotA in a while, perhaps not ever.

[dennisd]

If I wanted to play Tower Defense I would go play on of the thousands of them out there in the internet..

on a more serious note: I am not a big fan of vehicles, or the idea around them(destroying the towers etc)

but I'm pretty sure that my first days in it when the Alliance always started made me hate it even more so even after the late fix I didnt mind.

[Boohaxx]

That is not the meaning of pve. You arent fighting any npcs.

There is plenty of pvp in it. Defending the Demos, assaulting graveyards, defending the titan relics, stopping bomb disarmers. To be honest, it seems as if you havnt done SotA in a while, perhaps not ever.

Atleast not the way it's supposed to be done,

[Deleted]

It only pisses me off because every time I que for a random battleground I get SoTA. I got arathi basin ONCE. True story.

[Merlinsback]

That is not the meaning of pve. You arent fighting any npcs.

There is plenty of pvp in it. Defending the Demos, assaulting graveyards, defending the titan relics, stopping bomb disarmers. To be honest, it seems as if you havnt done SotA in a while, perhaps not ever.

You aren't fighting the player, you are fighting the demo that the player is driving. And if you are defending a demo, then you aren't fighting a player that's trying to kill you, you are fighting a player trying to kill your demo... which takes ZERO skill. And just because there aren't npc's doesn't mean it's pvp. You are fighting an environment produced player controlled unit. But the control that the player has is also limited by the environment (ie. and demo has 2 attacks, and can only go in 2 directions).

edit typo

[Dragonwing]

If I wanted to play Tower Defense I would go play on of the thousands of them out there in the internet..

on a more serious note: I am not a big fan of vehicles, or the idea around them(destroying the towers etc)

but I'm pretty sure that my first days in it when the Alliance always started made me hate it even more so even after the late fix I didnt mind.

And if i wanted to play capture the flag i can go play halo instead. See where im going here? Also, you mention vehicles again, which i have already said, SEAFORIUM CHARGES BRO

---------- Post added 2010-08-02 at 10:54 PM ----------

You aren't fighting the player, you are fighting the demo that the player is driving. And if you are defending a demo, then you aren't fighting a player that's trying to kill you, you are fighting a player trying to kill your demo... which takes ZERO skill. And just because there aren't npc's doesn't mean it's pvp. You are fighting an environment produced player controlled unit. But the control that the player has is also limited by the environment (ie. and demo has 2 attacks, and can only go in 2 directions).

edit typo

You really arent making much sence. And once again, you clearly havnt been doing SotA much. What your saying is like saying its not pvp when fighting hunters because there is a pet involved. It is really stupid.

Every time i go into SotA i see horde fighting alliance. Players fighting Players. PVP.

[Merlinsback]

But the hunter isn't limited by the pet, the pet doesn't have 187k hp, other players can't ride the pet and be immune to targeting and free cast, and the main point of fighting a hunter isn't to kill the pet, it's to kill the hunter, ie. the player.

And sure you see people zerging on the beach, that's because it's the funnest thing about that bg. Screw killing demo's, screw busting through walls, screw defending a demo... I don't see how you can even compare pvp in SOTA to that of ab,av,wsg, or eots.

[Lightfist]

But the hunter isn't limited by the pet, the pet doesn't have 187k hp, other players can't ride the pet and be immune to targeting and free cast, and the main point of fighting a hunter isn't to kill the pet, it's to kill the hunter, ie. the player.

And sure you see people zerging on the beach, that's because it's the funnest thing about that bg. Screw killing demo's, screw busting through walls, screw defending a demo... I don't see how you can even compare pvp in SOTA to that of ab,av,wsg, or eots.

You sorta lost this entire argument when you said "PVE battleground".

[Netram]

PVE battleground? Are you dumb?

It's objective based PVP you silly goose.

[Merlinsback]

Well, you are fighting walls (environment), in a demo... woohoo! And once you cap a gy, it can't even be recapped.... You can't heal/cc/snare the demo's... I'm just sayin, he asked why nobody likes SOTA, I replied... flame me

[ComputerNerd]

Because strand is horribly biased towards the side with organisational skills, and that with less idiots.
I try to give basic instructions at the start to focus a specific gate, have melee drive the demolishers, and ranged/cc to take the passenger seats.
In the few times I can actually get people to listen and do just that, we tend to win and pretty comfortably, but is very different if they do not.

Most of the complaints are simply for the sake of it.
Much like Oculus, if somone cannot faceroll and do what they are used to, they complain and say something sucks.
It is the player that cannot adapt to new things that sucks.

If a demo goes undefended 1 or 2 melee will make short work of it, but if it is, then its considerably harder and so requires coordination to bring it down.
That is not a bad thing imo.

[Airlick]

SotA is terrible, and I'm not saying this because my battlegroup sucks for Alliance, in fact you can see my statistics, I'm sure I will have about 60% wins or more.
But, this BG is terribly bugged, boring, small, and I really can't call spamming PvE rotations while at demo or chasing a demo and getting pwnd by retarded boomkins a real PvP.
Why is it bugged? Well, last time we had about 1 minute left, and we were 2 people bombing the gate. It had enough HP to take 1 more explosion, then it would go down. So, we're putting bombs down, sit back and enjoy the win, when suddenly a wild 15k hp paladin appears, bubbles, disarms 2 bombs, and wins this BG for the Horde. Serious skill involved. That's the measure of a good BG?
It's incredibly retarded BG, I mean, it shouldn't be possible to shoot while at demolisher, or at least we shouldn't be immune to any damage or cc. I would understand if we had a buff increasing our hp or reducing damage taken, but we are IMMUNE to anything, we have our damage increased, to the point people are getting 1-3 shotted, depending on their gear.

This BG is just BAD, even worse than IoC, and the worse thing is, that you have random 50% chance to get into one. I wouldn't mind so much if I actually could hope for a BG other than this shit, but nah, when I queue, I am certain I will get into SotA.

Getting 100 wins in SotA was not hard, but it was extremely stressing, and I wouldn't do it second time. In fact, I only done it because of Call to Arms premades, I wouldn't even bother if I didn't win about 50 and did all other achievements in premades over the course of 2 times SotA was Call to Arms.

[HOTempest]

Battleground PvP is specifically Objective Based PvP.

For general PvP or player verse player, Blizzard relegated that to the arenas.

In war, the point isn't to always kill the enemy, but to take objectives that contribute to the overall goal. That is what separates Battlegrounds from Arenas. I doubt logically Horde or Alliance commanders would be willing to let their soldiers slaughter each other for no particular reason.

In AB, EoTS and IoC, they want the resources; in WSG and AV, they want the land; in SoTA and WG, they want control of the precursor titan technology. BGs have a reason, and to obtain those reasons they have to "control" the area.

People like to be romantic, and value skill. To overcome your enemies in a personal decisive victory to show all your own superiority. I would love this too, but life is life, and war is unfair.

I guess what most people dislike about vehicles is that they are also a part of war. War isn't about a person killing a dozen people skillfully and standing above them in triumph; war is about a person killing a dozen people skillfully and standing above them in triumph, to be suddenly and pointlessly cut down by a random artillery shell or a randomly fired arrow in the head.

Although I do have a problem with SotA, they should make the bombs do more damage, as well as give those cannons the napalm shells from IoC.

[Razorlor]

Every time I read threads about battlegrounds, many people are saying "SotA is terrible", "SotA is never fun", "SotA is disfunctional". But I literally never see any reason why. Why is this battleground as terrible as people make it out to be?

Ive done SotA many times and it is really just like wintergrasp. Only, if you dont like vehicles, theres bombs on the ground you can use. I havnt seen any reason as to why the battleground is disfunctional. On my battlegroup, we dont get 5 people leaving immediately at the start like some people put it, we dont get people complaining, and there is actually generally less retards than in WSG. I actually vastly prefer SotA over WSG. The same battleground for 5 years with a generic battlemode, and easy for retards to screw up? Do not want.

So, MMO champion, id love to hear a valid reason as to why SotA is as bad as you make it out to be.

Here are some reasons i came up with;

1. Vehicles.
Warning. Change ahead.
Those words always come to mind when hearing vehicle arguments. Its actually quite funny, and sad at the same time, when i hear people complaining that they cant get used to vehicles, i rolled a rogue not a siege tank, the controls are clunky. Ill agree to the clunky part when it comes to siege tanks and demolishers (although when i see that word used in Oculus/Malygos arguments i facepalm). They do need to be able to strafe and mouse turn. But even in that case, you arent doing much turning in SotA anyway. Its just, charge up to the gate and shoot/ram spam. Nothing hard about it. Its quite funny seeing the vehicle complains, even though i feel sorry to the person who doesnt have the mental capacity to handle basic mechanics...

Also, the funniest part is, if done well, you dont even have to use the vehicles. You can just get a lot of people to carry bombs over to the gates. Herp. Derp. GTFO.

2. Bad Battlegroups and Losing.
My battlegroup is really good for the horde side in SotA (Reckoning). We dont lose much. However, i can understand that there are some people who are from much more unfortunate battlegroups for their faction, who would lose every single time in SotA. This is not really a valid reason to say the battleground itself is terrible however, as the problem is your Battlegroup.

3. ??

I honestly cant think of much else. Just, people love to complain. And people dont come to the forums to say how much they love something, they come saying how much they hate it. So all we see on the forums is the complaints. And some people just cant think for themselves if their lives depended on it, so they just go with the crowd and hate the same thing. Then it goes in a cycle of more and more people hating something just because it is the cool thing.

That, is the main reason why we see so many complaints. Nothing about the battleground, its the forum posters.

This looks familiar....

[Lori]

Because SotA is boring as hell? These vehicles are absolutly no fun and if you lose round1, its over beacuse everyone goes afk. When i was farming honor, i /afked SotA strictly.
I hope in Casualclysm, you aren't forced to do Random BGs to get the most Honor/h.

[Shazzia]

vehicles...

[Magnett]

It's not like the classic's (ab, av, wsg, eots) where you are fighting other people.

lolwat

Few reasons why anyone would (and why I do) hate SotA:

1 - Horribly biased towards casters, whether defending or attacking. Especially during the attack phase. Dragonkillers with 18k hp sitting on the passenger seat can tear through anyone with 15k Arcane Blasts with absolutely no chance of retaliation. You know why that isn't supposed to happen? Because this isn't vanilla.

2 - I don't think many people mind vehicles in PvE anymore. In PvP they're horribly clunky. They keyboard turn, they can't strafe, they have awkward hitboxes (again, killing demos is an absolute nightmare for melee).

3 - "If you don't like vehicles, use bombs". "If you don't like any of your class' specs, go 20/20/31". A gate takes severe damage (or even goes down) with a single demo on it for only a few dozen seconds as long as you don't have literally the whole team nuking it. Try bringing down the Chamber gate with bombs only. Go ahead, I'll wait. Except I WON'T BECAUSE IT TAKES FOREVER.

4 - Speaking of taking forever. Lost the first round because you couldn't get the relic? No big deal I guess, maybe we'll get lucky next timOH WAIT YOU HAVE TO FUCKING SIT THROUGH THE NEXT ROUND EVEN THOUGH YOU CAN'T WIN UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES LOL

5 - When defending, a minor imbalance between the two sides at the beach is almost always a guaranteed loss. If no one goes LM at the start of an AB match, it's not really a big deal. You'll be at a disadvantage, but you'll have more people spread through the other bases and can go for it later. If you have 12 people at blue and 2 at green, the opposing team is going to steamroll the fuck out of it and by the time you stop them they'll have purple at least halfway down and the GY will be capped and there'll be a gajillion minutes left. I think you know what happens if anyone actually says "more to green". Note this isn't solely the BG's fault, nor is it a completely bad thing: obviously you have to be punished for having a retarded team. It's just far more frustrating than not having anyone go for the flag at the start of a WSG or whatever, because nothing else at the start of any BG is as crucial, and it's something you can't do shit about unless you're with 2-3 friends.

6 - Not a very convincing argument, I'm aware, but.. it's PvE. It's not all PvE, but a way too big part of it is. You use a PvE rotation against the demos, you use a PvE rotation on the passenger seat of the demos (which as I've said is a position that actually rewards you for using PvE gear, which is, IMO, the biggest offender in the whole BG), the only time where there's actually any fighting is when you get to the Chamber gate (i.e. at the very end) or when fighting over GYs (and once the GY is capped, the outcome of the fight doesn't matter).