"Working the system": Small guild leveling for the friendly "5-man demographic"

[Omedon]

Edit: It seems copy-pasting from the phone notepad generates random asterisks, will likely fix it when I get home...

The most notable addition to the latest beta version would have to be the guild leveling system. *It's a seriously important part of Cataclysm that, to be honest, has metaphorically cost me a lot of sleep. *I am happy to say, however, that with the details released with the commencing of beta testing of guild XP, most of the concerns I had have been put to rest, but replaced by some forecasted social understandings that small guilds allied in friendship will have to observe in order to thrive in the Cataclysmic future.

Here are THE four routes to guild XP (GXP) come cataclysm, a direct quote from blizzard staff:

"1. Completing quests / daily quests that reward experience
2. Killing any dungeon / raid boss with a guild group/raid
3. Winning a rated battleground with a guild group/raid
4. Earning a guild achievement (these are nice, fat chunks of experience so they feel great when you get em)

A guild group/raid is 4/5, 8/10, 12/15 or 20/25 members of the group/raid being guild members."

Number 1 and some of 4 are the bloodstream that every guild WILL receive, hands down, no question, and that's good, very good! *Number 3, and the "raid" aspect of number 2 are beyond the scope of guilds like mine and our closest allies without some serious recruiting that most members of guilds like ours would be uncomfortable with, so I'm going to focus on the other aspect of number 2, which happens to be my favorite content, and the most potent example of the social perspective shift I spoke of: 5 man content.

First and foremost, small guilds allied in friendship need to let each other advance when possible, while also realizing that it won't always be possible. *Basically, this means that if you can only assemble 3-4 people for heroics between your guilds... then do that, run for hero points and have fun! *It's not like anyone is missing out on GXP opportunities anyway. *If it just so happens that one guild can bring four, or has the option to form their own group of 4 (possibly/likely filling the 5th spot among their allies) or 5, LET THEM! *If your guilds are so small that this isn't a regular occurrence, nobody wins if somebody stubbornly frumps that "you're just favoring your guild", that's just as silly as the RP guild that gives characters grief for missing RP events in favour of chasing the level cap when everyone else is at the cap already. *You wouldn't ask your friend to stop leveling their character, so don't ask them not to level their guild. *Of course, the ideal setup is where both/all guilds in a circle of friends have the manpower to consistently bring 4/5, and when this is the case, those allies are a great source of that trustworthy *5th that will prevent people from rolling the dice on a PUG.

This brings us to the second realization that hit me as I was lying in bed last night: 4/5 is greater than the number you can bring without supplying a "pressure role" (tank/healer). *While raiding guilds often don't mind recruiting by class/role, many small guilds (like mine) are small because they don't recruit characters or classes, they recruit people, and often people they know and like for the quality of the person, not the class they play. *This makes the 4/5 condition of GXP instancing a considerable hurtle at first glance. *I am one of four people in my guild I can think of off the top of my head that are willing to consistently perform one or the other pressure role, and in my case, I have multiple alts to feed, my direct secondary character being a pure DPS class. *Most small guilds I know of are overflowing with DPS, and some of those DPS do so because it's the only role they enjoy, which they are more than entitled to, and their guilds don't and won't ever judge them for it. *When I discovered how much I loved 5-man content, and how powerful a tank is to enable it, I turned my main into a tank, but kept a DPS offspec for when someone else wanted a turn at tanking, which doesn't happen often (the operative distinction being WANTing a turn hehe). *Given all of these considerations, straight up, the single greatest help for GXP acquisition that members of "5-man demographic" guilds can offer will be multiple role options, be it by dual speccing or maintaining alts. *Since every GXP 5-man run requires at least one pressure role, leaving it up to the handful (or less) of regular pressure players in the guild to provide that while sitting firmly in the "I only DPS" category, while completely and honestly everyone's understandable *right, is counterproductive if you are at all concerned with guild levels. *I have a tank and two healers, I'm good to go, but I'll be frank here, I don't want to be, nor do I think it's fair to my guildies that I be *the* GXP on/off switch, as I'd like to DPS to relieve the pressure of tanking, and I know I'm not alone in that. *No one in any of the guilds I know of in the "5-man demographic", least of all me, wants anyone playing in a way that isn't fun for them, but 4/5 means we can't all queue as DPS if we want guild XP, keep
that in mind as you make your cataclysm plans. *In truth, the "barrier" stipulation for most "less willing" pressure role players I know is a group full of friends, and that's the one really positive aspect of the 4/5 distinction: it's a group mostly if not completely comprised of friends.

The most common fear or concern I hear in relation to the guild leveling system (as it effects small, friendly guilds) is the opinion that it makes grouping with one's friends "the wrong answer", in the context that not all of one's friends are in their guild. *On the contrary, if your guild is full of your friends, the guild leveling system rewards you for grouping with your friends, and the 4/5 distinction allows you to include friends from other guilds. *As long as we're all friends between guilds, we should all be understanding of situations when we aren't that 5th, and furthermore, happy for the times when our friends' guilds can throw together 5 people. *Besides, in the context of the guilds this entry is directed to, it's not like that's every day, and there will be plenty of times when there are only 3 people online between both/all guilds involved, and we can still, among our allied friends, run our "unkickable majority" runs just like we do now.

So, to recap:

-Let your friends instance-level their guilds, especially if those opportunities are rare.

-If you want your guild to level faster via instance content, have multiple roles (tank/heal/DPS) ready to go in your personal roster.

-Don't panic. *You're all still friends, and you're not abandoning each other! Sometimes, (heck, in my own experience, I'd even say "often") no one can assemble 4 people of the same guild. *Do whatcha do, and have fun.

Finally, get motivated! *This system is encouraging that old kids' song "the more we get together, the happier we'll be"! *Organize guild instancing night, (already planned here! ) quest in your spare time, realize that, for altoholics like me, anyway, a second XP bar is a great motivator in times like RIGHT NOW (pre-expansion/patch lull) when you're left with few goals, and that nothing but good things can come from incentivizing togetherness and guild pride!

Heck, if that doesn't work, you can always join my wicked hand-wringing as I anticipate what this is going to do to immature and abusive players that treat the community like crap, and think that their guild can go ahead and kick them if they don't like them dropping the n-bomb in trade chat... Their day of reckoning is coming! Mwahahaha!

Thank you for reading.

[Danur]

For someone who seems so self admittedly casual about the game, you sure put a lot of thought into this.

---------- Post added 2010-08-17 at 02:54 PM ----------

anyway to address your across the board concern of alienating your friends, and not having tanks/healers... well sorry but that's what a guild is about. One or more of you should be willing to slap together a healing or tanking set (which will be even EASIER in cataclysm if you can believe that. No more needing to be def capped lolwut?). Otherwise why should your guild progress, if you are merely a group of friends who play on the same server? You're certainly not a guild if you can't accomplish anything without pugging important roles.

[Omedon]

For someone who seems so self admittedly casual about the game, you sure put a lot of thought into this.

---------- Post added 2010-08-17 at 02:54 PM ----------

anyway to address your across the board concern of alienating your friends, and not having tanks/healers... well sorry but that's what a guild is about. One or more of you should be willing to slap together a healing or tanking set (which will be even EASIER in cataclysm if you can believe that. No more needing to be def capped lolwut?). Otherwise why should your guild progress, if you are merely a group of friends who play on the same server? You're certainly not a guild if you can't accomplish anything without pugging important roles.

I've heard many many definitions of "guild" in my years of being an officer, and yours is certainly one of, if not the only one. :$

[Danur]

I've heard many many definitions of "guild" in my years of being an officer, and yours is certainly one of, if not the only one. :$

You're right, no it's not. But I ask you, what is the purpose of a guild that cannot accomplish anything? Sounds more like a glorified chat room than a guild. But that's just my opinion.

[Omedon]

You're right, no it's not. But I ask you, what is the purpose of a guild that cannot accomplish anything? Sounds more like a glorified chat room than a guild. But that's just my opinion.

To be respectfully honest, that you are the sort of player to ask that likely means that the truthful response I would give would not address the problem you perceive, so I believe we'd just be best to agree to disagree. This post was actually motivated as a response to complaints I deal with often, so the demographic is very real, I assure you.

[Danur]

To be respectfully honest, that you are the sort of player to ask that likely means that the truthful response I would give would not address the problem you perceive, so I believe we'd just be best to agree to disagree. This post was actually motivated as a response to complaints I deal with often, so the demographic is very real, I assure you.

Well I'll agree to disagree on the definition of a guild. But let me rephrase the question. In your opinion what should be required for guild "progression" if what they are asking is a bit too high of a bar? I feel that progression is non-existent, if you don't have the basic people to "progress" through anything.

I should also add that Blizzard is allowing you to progress via questing (a solo endeavor) and in rated bgs which do not require a cemented composition the way PvE does. Not to mention the guild achieves as you mentioned. 3 out of 4 ain't bad, and half of the missing one is easily fixable by finding even a mediocre player to join with you for dungeons.

[Omedon]

Well I'll agree to disagree on the definition of a guild. But let me rephrase the question. In your opinion what should be required for guild "progression" if what they are asking is a bit too high of a bar? I feel that progression is non-existent, if you don't have the basic people to "progress" through anything.

I should also add that Blizzard is allowing you to progress via questing (a solo endeavor) and in rated bgs which do not require a cemented composition the way PvE does. Not to mention the guild achieves as you mentioned. 3 out of 4 ain't bad, and half of the missing one is easily fixable by finding even a mediocre player to join with you for dungeons.

Indirectly, I agree with you. *The reason this entry is called "working the system" is because guilds like mine are on the lower border of "supported", as far as the GXP system is set up. *The purpose of such a longwinded post is to show how guilds like mine and those mine work with regularly can indeed make this work for them, because some of my allies think it works against them, which I disagree with.

Trust me, "GXP comes from questing too!" is a common point I refer back to in discussion on this topic, and I'm very grateful for that!