Flexible Raid Lock System in 4.0.1

[Argroth]

I forgot that they are getting super lazy (same loot, same lockout) and lame with the raid system in Cataclysm. Now it seems like they are introducing a system that should have been implemented from the start, are we supposed to be ecstatic about this?

[Sai978]

Will you be able to get quest items from 10m icc? Shadowfrost shards?

[ordhor]

For those that see this as being complicated, for example, when stats rating was first introduced in pre-TBC patch (before that we had stats in % ) people were finding it hard to do its math.... does anyone even talk about that anymore?

Just like all other changes that will come with 4.0.1 people will adapt and move on. It's that simple.

Oh, and loved the fact that this info was first released Europe side
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread....13237976&sid=1

[Sulika]

Here's the big question they didn't address:

Are they normalizing loot as well? It would only make sense considering they are locking you to both 10 and 25? It almost eliminates the desire to go to pug 10s if a persons only chance at marks is in 25 man

I suspect that is highly unlikely. They would also have to rebalance all the ICC 10 fights to be equal difficulty with the 25 man ones which I suspect they are not going to do.

[Imhullu]

Just fyi, all these Questions were already answered.
There are no separate 10/25 Achievements, just one version.
10 man difficulty = 25 man = Same gear
and who the fuck cares about stupid mounts/titels.

We are still talking WOTLK here bud, we know they were answered for cataclysm, but this post is saying the changes will be implemented for the last patch of WOTLK, when there still are separate 10/25 achievements, there are still separate 10/25 gear and many people do care about mounts and titles.

Some guilds can only raid some of the 25 man on heroic, so of course they will want to do that, but then also later in the week go back and will raid the 10 man and get many more bosses down on heroic. With this system it seems you can only choose to do one version on heroic, and get "locked out" of the rest of the bosses on heroic if you have to do one normal.

[Nij]

TLDR Version:

Normal: you get locked per boss

Heroic: Same old way. with option to downgrade your lockout to normal

[Ferledon]

Just fyi, all these Questions were already answered.
There are no separate 10/25 Achievements, just one version.
10 man difficulty = 25 man = Same gear
and who the *uck cares about stupid mounts/titels.

Unlike gear, our mounts titles stay w/us.

Back on topic, Love this change

[tusker]

My head is hurting.

Geez, can they make this more complicated or what?

Specifically what was complicated about the post? It seems rather straightforward to me. There's a few questions left unanswered, but other than that examples are given to help illustrate what they're doing. If you had specific questions about what they're doing someone here might be able to answer

[Failmuffins]

Not sure if I like the heroic restrictions... looks great for normal modes though.

[Bucky Mclachlan]

Waitwaitwaitwaitwaitwaitwait.....wtf is this?

Does this mean I won't be able to finish my Glory of the Icecrown Radier (10-Player) now? Or will all of these achievements be merged?

My meta was going to be completed next reset. : \

Also if 10 and 25 share the same lock out, does this mean that my raid will get Light of Dawn for killing heroic LK in 10 player? Because my guild has had that one farm for some time....

[Spotnick]

Hey wait a minute, this goes live with 4.0.1? meaning I can't work on my 10 man drake and do my 25 alt run anymore on my alt? WTF.

[Dreadnor]

One reason i find the Heroic Restriction suitable is because of the implications behind Flexible Raid Lock System and Server Firsts. In Cataclysm, the achievements of Server First: SO-and-SO are on the HEROIC versions of that boss. Not only that, but the achievement is shared between both 10 man heroic version of boss X and 25 man heroic version of boss X.

so if a guild does heroic bosses 25 man, then they stop at the last guy cause they cant down it, they break the raid up into 2 10 mans, but cant do the 10 man heroic mode of the remaining boss. The Heroic Restriction forces that the achievement for Server First: SO-and-SO be done within the same lockout, and not by means of any group-merging or group-breakdowns.

im pretty sure this is why they are enforcing the Heroic Restriction, and their logic is sound to be. It hurts the puggers out there a little, but keeps the hardcore guilds in check so that the achievement is given properly to one, single, lockout.

[Chronoless]

Just fyi, all these Questions were already answered.
There are no separate 10/25 Achievements, just one version.
10 man difficulty = 25 man = Same gear
and who the fuck cares about stupid mounts/titels.

I think he is wondering about RS and ICC, i know in Cata the loot for 10/25 will be the same, but like me i want to know if they are doing this with ICC and RS, or they are keeping the loot as it is but with the new Flexible Raid? most likely it look like this. Which i do think it is still a good idea, for now, because if blizzard made the loot the same for RS and ICC, what level would it be? 251 or 264? and if they take one out, what would happen to the people who have the others?

[Alianthos]

I am ABSOLUTLY sure gear will stay the same as it is now, in ICC 10 / 25.
The equalization of gear will only happen in Cataclysm.

There's gonna be toooooo many QQ if Arthas only drops 251 weapons while killed in 25's. Unless they put all 25 loot in 10m raid, but that would be BEYOND stupid.

All in all, I like it.

[xnickybx]

This does have some downsides.

My own guild has has a 25 man raid during the week and runs two 10 man groups on the weekends. One of the 10 man groups has killed LK10HC, the other is still working on it. Now we are basically going to be screwed. If we want to continue with our regular 25 man raids then it means half the guild will never be able to get a LK 10 HC kill. They will always be saved to the 25 man raid. After a lot of time and effort this leaves a lot of our guild members in an awful position. Either give up on the LK10 title altogether or bring a bunch of alts into the 25 man raid and gimp our potential for progression there.

This is pretty much a lose lose situation for us. "Flexible" indeed.

Man, I can't believe blizzard wasn't thinking of your guild's ICC run when designing this system.

You're guild has had almost a year to do whatever it is you are trying to do in ICC. Suck it up.

[Tsudots]

So if I understand this correctly as soon as 4.0.1 hits my Sunday 10 man hard mode group is going to be finished because everyone will be locked to 25 during the guild's normal Tues-Thurs raids?

If thats the case then I'm glad I already got my 10 man drake lol

[Deleted]

I'm pretty sure loots will remain separate from 10 to 25 so the achis.
@Genju: go find a good doctor.

[Baeki]

Great changes

[Sellest]

bb my spot in raid, and think bb my guild. Now the friends from guild will be playing 10 men only and good players but not real life friends of guild leader will be left behind.

BB having to raid 25 with bunch of morons just because you want best possible gear, now I can have fun with friends in smaller size to achieve same rewards

just pointing out different view

[Deleted]

BB having to raid 25 with bunch of morons just because you want best possible gear, now I can have fun with friends in smaller size to achieve same rewards

just pointing out different view

I think u missed the fact that loots will still be different in 10 and 25 men (ICC and RS).