Flexible Raid Lock System in 4.0.1

[Heltoray]

idiotic idea to implement this with 4.0 imo. Why not just wait until cataclysm?

goodbye 10-man gold runs...

the system itself is ,,ok", but why now?!

<Mod Edit: Simple answer. Test the system with lots of people whilst its only really ancient ICC raiding, find the bugs and fix them before new raiding starts>

[Scripts]

Anyone know or think they know how this is implemented? If I already killed marrowgar and join a raid about to kill marrowgar what happens?

Not allowed to join that raid because I already killed marrowgar?
Am I ported out when Marrowgar is engaged?
Am I allowed to "fight" marrowgar but not receive loot?
Is Marrowgar no longer in the instance for this raid because I killed him before?
Other?

You cannot join a raid group that hasn't killed marrowgar, is how I'm reading it. If, however, the raid group you join has killed marrowgar and Lady D, and you do boat with them, then you are locked to Lady D and Boat. This is, of course, assuming that you killed Marrow on regular.

Lets say you kill marrowgar on heroic, have disconnect issues, etc., and can't continue with that group. You then join the same raid group above a couple of days later at boat (and its a different raid ID than your original group) because you need the badges/bored/etc. They see your achievements, and say "OMG, A Kingslayer, Turn on Boat for us!!!!" You'll have to tell them, "Sorry, no dice. I killed a heroic boss already this week with a different group." They will then say, "Thanks for nothing, jerk" and kick you from the group.

[Kingsonz]

I believe they use ICC for explanation only. Since 90% of mmo-champion readers knows the order of the bosses in ICC, using them as examples are great.

Reread the first paragraph of the blue post.

[sidebar]

this is by far the worst idea they had in a long long time... getting rid of raid id´s accomplishes nothing but to make finding pugs even more complicated

It will be easier for normal modes all around. Heroic Modes will be easier as well, as you have a pool of players that were not available before ... the ones that got saved to a fail normal run. It will also be easier to fill heroic modes with people that don't care about heroics and they will join knowing they can go back to normals once you fail.

Overall, it will be easier to fill raids with these changes, once you actually think about it instead of knee jerk it.

"what you have 3 bosses down? sry but we killed only 2"

RL's with partial raids will be posting their link of progression, so anybody wanting to know, can click on the link and see. So there won't be back and forth like your assuming.

... AND you can not invite people who did heroic bosses if you intend to kill one

Yes, but only if you have downed heroic bosses and want to continue doing heroic bosses. But, it will still be easier then filling now. Why? Cause now you can't fill with ANYBODY that has killed ANY boss in ICC. After the change, all the people that killed normal bosses in ICC will be able to join your raid (as long as they are not further along).

So overall the only "stupid" thing around here are the people posting knee jerk reaction stating things are stupid without first thinking it through, or asking questions.

[Deleted]

nice changes

[Pryo]

Cool idea imo

[Wickedpissah]

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...1&pageNo=7#134

The loot system's not changing for ICC, only the lockout features.

[Rentonie]

they should not bring this out for patch 4.0.1, or everything gets screwed up

I agree this should not be brought out in ICC and RS. Let us run it the way we want till Cata so that we can get the gear we want. Some guild regardless of the expansion coming out are still trying to kill HM LK 25 and I think this will just kill it. I think its cool that they will be doing this in Cata but not right now.

[Llamda]

Death of the 25 man raid IMO - and yet Bliz will still have to put a lot of time into them. Why bother with 25s - just a lot of extra hassle.

[Arlor]

>> Another key change is that if you join someone else's raid in progress, you are no longer locked to that raid after merely zoning in.

Haven't decided about how I feel about this rest, but this change is soooooo overdue. It's gotten to the point where I won't enter an instance in a PUG until every other player is inside. So many times the leader will say "let's go," and people start zoning in, and then three people d/c or leave group before the first pull. Ugh.

[sidebar]

idiotic idea to implement this with 4.0 imo. Why not just wait until cataclysm?

goodbye 10-man gold runs...

the system itself is ,,ok", but why now?!

It's a great idea actually, putting aside the whole "test it before cata" thing.

What is the biggest change this is bringing about? Time being free'd up. Today you kinda/sorta/have to run stuff twice for your main char. After the patch, you only run it once. This causes an issue where you have more time on your hands.

Most of us have alts that don't get enough play time. *Ding* ... those alts are now going to get more play time. Sucks if you have a single char and extra time today cause you will have more free time in the very near future.

And that is why I think this is great ... more play time for my alts. Beside the fact that I am pretty tired of running the content anyways. I counted my runs of gunship the other day on my chars ... 130+ times I have done that encounter.

[Sydien]

I understand that some people don't progress as quickly as others, but complaining about how this will change your farming of year old content is just silly. Clock is running out, simple as that. I find screaming into a pillow rather effective. Also, strong drink and narcotics.

As for the new system, I think it's fine and dandy. Opens up more accessibility. Probably won't affect my raiding at all. Other than people not understanding it.

[Grubby]

I read the wall of text and I still find it confusing, but sure it will make sense when in use

[sidebar]

Lets say you kill marrowgar on heroic, have disconnect issues, etc., and can't continue with that group. You then join the same raid group above a couple of days later at boat (and its a different raid ID than your original group) because you need the badges/bored/etc. They see your achievements, and say "OMG, A Kingslayer, Turn on Boat for us!!!!" You'll have to tell them, "Sorry, no dice. I killed a heroic boss already this week with a different group." They will then say, "Thanks for nothing, jerk" and kick you from the group.

Actually, I think you could turn on Heroic at that point, based upon what was posted. You join a group with 24 other people that have not downed a boss on heroic, you, as the newly appointed RL and keeper of the sacred heroic raid ID should be able to turn Heroic bosses on / off from that point forward as long as nobody else has a heroic boss id for that run.

Right? at least that is how I read it. You just can't *mix* heroic boss id's. I am starting to think of it as an STD in that you can share your STD with others that don't have an STD yet, you just can't share yours with others that have their own STD :-)

[Scot]

I love all the people talking out their ass about how loot will work when this is implemented in 4.0.1. Are you all wotlk kiddies who have no idea how a pre expansion patch works? Raid bosses downed after them are meaningless. They don't need to rebalance 10 man fights if they drop 264 gear because it doesn't matter. Once 4.0.1 comes out the only reason for raiding is to get better leveling gear. That is unless your guild wants to be "that guy" who puts in their recruitment that they downed H LK but forgets to mention it was post 4.0.1 like many guilds like to do with KJ and 3.0.

[rayden54]

So, until they implement the balanced loot system, my alt will be forced to raid 25-mans ONLY because they drop better loot.

They need to keep the 10 and 25 man raids separate until they reach the point where the raids are designed to be merged.

[Cragox]

this is so amazing, looking forward to it!

[Millennía]

So do 10 man heroic and 25 man heroic ICC drop ilvl 277?

<Mod Edit: NO!!!>

[Adyssa]

I said earlier that I agreed with others that the system should allow you to kill any boss repeatedly, but only be eligible for loot/points on your first kill, but having thought further on this I've come up with ways that it could be heavily exploited. This is especially true for the more hardcore guilds.

The best players could sell themselves to other guilds, especially tanks and healers. Having trouble on that final boss? Whisper the best guild on the server and see if a tank a healer would be willing to help for a few thousand gold. Or, they could form up 9 man groups and sell the last spot, running the person's fresh raid ID for them. Need a few items off the first 4 bosses? Pay a guild to run you through, all drops guaranteed to be yours.

Having thought of these scenarios, I can understand why Blizzard is avoiding this.

[Rezman]

I do not like this. So much for my attempts on Heroic Lich King 10man and doing the normal weekly 25man guild raids. Thanks Blizzard.