The Cat Guide - 4.3

[Elunedra]

oke i missed that modification then.

[Selverein]

1 Str is still > 1 AP

I'm not even sure what you're trying to say there.

Agility will remain ahead of Strength, even moreso now that Strength will give only 1 AP per point. What I was really asking is if the ilvl difference will make the Strength weapon better because of weapon damage gain despite the Agility loss.

Using the current RSV mentioned in the first post, halving Strength's because of the upcoming change, this is what I'm getting.

Sulfuras i397:
888.3 DPS x 5.02 = 4,459.3
446 Str x 1.225 = 546.4
333 Crit x 1.09 = 363
262 Mastery x 1.29 = 338
Total 5706.7 deeps points

Fandral's i391:
839.8 DPS x 5.02 = 4,215.8
460 Agi x 3.24 = 1,490.4
311 Crit x 1.09 = 339
299 Mastery x 1.29 = 385.7
Total 6430.9 deeps points

Of course the RSV's are likely to change, but 700 DPS is kind of a large bridge to gap. Am I missing something?

[Duilliath]

Weapon value will go up due to changed modifiers on Mangle/Shred

[Selverein]

Ah, you're right, completely forgot about that. I still remain skeptical, though. :/

Out of curiosity I replaced its 5.02 value with 10 (which I find highly improbable because the Shred buff isn't that big) and Fandral's still comes out on top, everything else staying as it is. I suppose we'll see when new RSV are found.

[Duilliath]

Well, truth be told, I didn't plug it into anything. On account of me not caring which is better. I do mind that the gap in iLevel will mean that we'll be behind further as a similar iLevel weapon would be a substantial boost to our DPS.

Then again, not like Blizzard appears to give a lot of thought to DPS-parity, considering Firelands again features a boss which will screw Melee over (the final boss, at that).

//edit: post 667, the neighbour of the beast?

[Elunedra]

I'm not even sure what you're trying to say there.

i mean that the 500 str on the weapon still gives a lot of AP, and that string is still better then secondairy stats :P

[Selverein]

Ah, then yes it's true. Strength will still be worth more DPS than secondaries as they are. But significantly less than agility with the nerf to AP conversion. Strength will almost be completely out of the window in terms of useful primary stats.

And since the secondaries are roughly the same on both weapons, it's really down to agility versus weapon dps from what I can see.

[Heywes]

Patch notes look like they have gone backwards for us feral kitties to me, or am i miss reading?

[Tygroen]

I see some very slight nerfs, but it looks either like a, tooltip fixes, or b, an attempt to solve scaling issues? I think?

[Elunedra]

seems an improve to scaling

[Deleted]

Can anyone give a more detailed explanation to why do you not think it’s NOT necessary to reach hit cap? I’ve been looking around the net to try and get articles on hit cap, but different articles have been saying different things about hit cap, I can see why expertise is not necessary as us cats are not going to be standing infront of the boss (however, A LOT of cata encounters require us to be in front of the boss at some point), but surely missing would add delays to our already complicated rotation.

[Elunedra]

Can anyone give a more detailed explanation to why do you not think it’s NOT necessary to reach hit cap? I’ve been looking around the net to try and get articles on hit cap, but different articles have been saying different things about hit cap, I can see why expertise is not necessary as us cats are not going to be standing infront of the boss (however, A LOT of cata encounters require us to be in front of the boss at some point), but surely missing would add delays to our already complicated rotation.

no we cant, it has been simualed whit the mew kitty dps simulator.
it has also been simulated that the difference between a hit / exp capped and a not capped feral is < 100 dps loss, so yeh there are a lot of moment where you do go infront of bosses so cappnig exp might verry well be worth it.

also also exp & hit are equal in value from behind a mob as you attack can miss or be dodge. from in from exp is twice the value of hit (and exp get higher then mastery) becase your attacks can be dodge , parryed and miss

[Deleted]

Can anyone give a more detailed explanation to why do you not think it’s NOT necessary to reach hit cap? I’ve been looking around the net to try and get articles on hit cap, but different articles have been saying different things about hit cap, I can see why expertise is not necessary as us cats are not going to be standing infront of the boss (however, A LOT of cata encounters require us to be in front of the boss at some point), but surely missing would add delays to our already complicated rotation.

Long and short of it is that hit and expertise are not worthless, but they aren't good stats. They do get progressively better as gear improves (because a missed 25k Shred is more of a damage loss than a missed 24k Shred) but unless I'm mistaken they don't get near Mastery, Haste or even Crit this tier. In heroic raid gear hit/expertise might get closer (I'm not that far yet), but I still doubt they're very good.

The reason hit and expertise are bad is because a missed or dodged attack doesn't really matter. Because an attack that doesn't land doesn't charge the full energy cost, we can just try again the next GCD. Auto-attacks can miss obviously, but as they're only a minor part of our damage the damage bonus hit gives us there is inconsequential.

[Elunedra]

i think it was simcraft or some other simulation website where it showed 372 hc geared feral whit hit & exp caps did 60 less dps then the non capped version ;P, considering there are indeed bosse where we got tobe infront it mgiht actualy be woth getting exp capped.

also on the reason hit & exp are bad, it is mainly for 2 reasons:
a missed specail attack (such a shred) refund 80% of its energy and during the GCD we regen enough to do the same attack right 1 sec after.
rip & rake can be clipped so if you start to refresh a rip whne there are 2 secs left, if it fails you try again when there is 1 seconds left and if it fails again you try it when there is 0 secs left.
so you get 3 chances to refresh it while maintaining a 100% uptime, the chance to miss 3 times on a row is significantly low

[Duilliath]

i think it was simcraft or some other simulation website where it showed 372 hc geared feral whit hit & exp caps did 60 less dps then the non capped version ;P, considering there are indeed bosse where we got tobe infront it mgiht actualy be woth getting exp capped.

Erm. No. Problem isn't that Expertise is worth less than Crit/Haste or Mastery, it's the when attacking in front the expertise cap moves up enormously due to the parries you'd be trying to negate.

[Mithfin]

Expertise becomes the best secondary stat for the "frontal fights", 'till the dodge cap. Yes, better then mastery.

[Elunedra]

yes thats what i meant :P and there are indeed quite some fights outthere. so if you arent all hardcore and you want ot use the same gear on all fights i gues getting exp capped aint bad :P

[Duilliath]

yes thats what i meant :P and there are indeed quite some fights outthere. so if you arent all hardcore and you want ot use the same gear on all fights i gues getting exp capped aint bad :P

I have no issue with your suggestion of getting expertise or it not being worthless. I do mind your wording. Going for the Exp Cap is
1) next to impossible in your regular gear
2) stupendous when reforging every single piece of gear to it.

Feel free to call it soft cap or anything, but the way you put it sounds like you're suggesting the hard cap, which is just silly (and naturally the exp value drops by half when past the dodge cap).

[Elunedra]

ofcourse, i though it was clear that i meant the soft cap not the hard cap lol.

[Deleted]

Made a post about our dps in 4.2, please show your support

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...1590602?page=1