[TV] The Walking Dead (*Spoilers*)

[Wyattbw09]

Carol is a monster and she was justly kicked out. Hell, he spared her life for old times sake.

I have to admit, in a show like TWD in which one of the major if not the major premise of the show is the valid breakdown of morality I am surprised given the shady and unethical actions of all the major characters over the course of the last three seasons I am shocked that people are so quick to throw around words like monster.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Did anyone else see on the Talking Dead that Adam Savage from Mythbusters will be on the after-show next week?

[Deleted]

Carol is a monster and she was justly kicked out. Hell, he spared her life for old times sake.

Ricks done worse.

[Ciddy]

why do people think carol would team up with the govenor?
carol doesnt wanna kill all the people in the prison

I think the idea is that she'll get mad at Rick for kicking her out and want revenge. Personally, I don't see that happening at all. Her personality change this season is definitely showing, but I don't think she's gone full-on crazy, or at least nowhere near crazy enough to team up with the Governor. In her eyes, she put a quick end to the suffering of two people who were already doomed to die and prevented the sickness they had from spreading. She's starting to become a female version of Shane, and I kinda like that.

I'm still gonna be interested to see what happens when/if Tyreese eventually finds out it was her. In his current mental state, there's no telling what he could do.

[Dasffion]

Just because Carol was weak doesn't mean that she was incompetent. Carl killed someone who was was from a deceptive group that was trying kill him. His actions were out of childish ignorance. Rick simply ignored someone who wasn't in their group. Looting the guy after is no different than what they've been doing. Carol murdered people in their group, emphasis on their group, and then tried to cover it up. Rick killed someone in their but that was completely out of self defense. Carol decided she was going to start euthanizing people without any input from the group or the people she killed thus she had to go.

You act like those people didn't pose a threat to the group. Yes she should have talked it over with the counsel but at that time it was a smart move. It didn't stop the spread but it very well could have.

[Kelimbror]

Ricks done worse.

Orly? Please tell me the last time he actively murdered two people in cold blood, initially lied about it/hid it, then expressed zero remorse about it afterwards. B/c you know, that's what actually happened.

It didn't stop the spread but it very well could have.

This is the most irrational logic I've ever heard. Hitler tried to make the human race better by murdering non Aryans. It didn't work, but it very well could have. Should we have let Hitler have more of a go at it? We could have missed out on a great opportunity!

[Dasffion]

Orly? Please tell me the last time he actively murdered two people in cold blood, initially lied about it/hid it, then expressed zero remorse about it afterwards. B/c you know, that's what actually happened.

This is the most irrational logic I've ever heard. Hitler tried to make the human race better by murdering non Aryans. It didn't work, but it very well could have. Should we have let Hitler have more of a go at it? We could have missed out on a great opportunity!

Lol had to Godwin's law it huh? Not even close to relatable

[Zdrasti]

This is the most irrational logic I've ever heard. Hitler tried to make the human race better by murdering non Aryans. It didn't work, but it very well could have. Should we have let Hitler have more of a go at it? We could have missed out on a great opportunity!

If you're going to insult someone's logic, it helps if you don't turn around and fail hardcore yourself.

OT: The group gave Rick plenty of time and room to deal with his rather significant issues. Carol on the other hand held it together until just recently. I think it's wholly unfair of Rick to not help her out and give her a chance to work through her issues.

[MatadorMedia]

Rick & Carl both killed people who were enemies, not allies. The only gray area really being Shane but that was a life & death situation. Killing an outsider is a completely different context than Carol killing people within the group. The entire reason they are grouped together is for survival, so it was an ethically bad decision to kill her own group members.

I don't think that makes her a monster though; really she just euthanized two people who were already dying. If there is anyone to compare her to it would be Daryl. He shot Dale in the face and killed him, so Dale would die before turning into a walker. No one cared. The difference there is that Carol did not have the consent of the two people she killed while Dale kind of leaned into Daryl's gun.

Carol was starting to get too kill-or-be-killed over non-threatening situations. She acted too quickly. I don't know if banishing her from the group was the right call but Rick is definitely in a tough position because he can't protect her from Tyrese.

[Dasffion]

Rick & Carl both killed people who were enemies, not allies. The only gray area really being Shane but that was a life & death situation. Killing an outsider is a completely different context than Carol killing people within the group. The entire reason they are grouped together is for survival, so it was an ethically bad decision to kill her own group members.

I don't think that makes her a monster though; really she just euthanized two people who were already dying. If there is anyone to compare her to it would be Daryl. He shot Dale in the face and killed him, so Dale would die before turning into a walker. No one cared. The difference there is that Carol did not have the consent of the two people she killed while Dale kind of leaned into Daryl's gun.

Carol was starting to get too kill-or-be-killed over non-threatening situations. She acted too quickly. I don't know if banishing her from the group was the right call but Rick is definitely in a tough position because he can't protect her from Tyrese.

You don't think that someone carrying a communicable disease that they have no way to treat and no cure for is not as much of a threat as a kid with a gun? You're right. It's a much bigger threat.

[Kelimbror]

Lol had to Godwin's law it huh? Not even close to relatable

Yes, killing of innocents is so non-relative. It's hilarious knowing the 'defense' to a statement meant to provide insight into how ridiculous the original point in question was. Thanks for proving my psychic powers are still in tune. The point was it was irrational, much like what I followed with. Take a hint.

[Deleted]

They were going to die regardless, to inhibit infection she destroyed their bodies. Guess which other disease this has a parallel to in the series? It's a very smart juxtaposition to draw a line with, considering the show is almost entirely about human behavior in a post apocalyptic environment.

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Yes, killing of innocents is so non-relative. It's hilarious knowing the 'defense' to a statement meant to provide insight into how ridiculous the original point in question was. Thanks for proving my psychic powers are still in tune. The point was it was irrational, much like what I followed with. Take a hint.

It is when one is in an entirely fictional context and the other is one of the worst atrocities in human history. Entirely disrespectful and unrelated comparison, even if it weren't taking lives to save more lives is completely different from massacring an entire population of people because of personal ideology...

- - - Updated - - -

Orly? Please tell me the last time he actively murdered two people in cold blood, initially lied about it/hid it, then expressed zero remorse about it afterwards. B/c you know, that's what actually happened.

Carol didn't kill in cold blood, she killed them to defend the healthy members of the group. Similar to how Rick killed the two others in Season 2 episode 8, Nebraska.

[Immitis]

they had no way of truly containing the virus, they had no way of treating them, they have no idea what they have or what medicine they need, all that medicine daryls group got? could be completely fucking worthless because it could be no use against what they have.

you cannot say what carol did was wrong.

when carl shot that boy it wasnt wrong either. you can say the boy was surrendering but we have no way of knowing that, and its not like they were out in the middle of nowhere and found the boy, they were actively under attack.

this is the apocalypse, not happy fun times present day.

will the medicine work? probably because when the govenor attacks the prison with a giant tank they cant exactly be on the road with sick people, either they are gonna be cured or the sick will be left behind. but what carol did was right, it might not have been nice, it might not have been pretty, but it was right.

not to mention carol killed them painlessly.

pretty much all the people who got the sickness first are dead now anyways if anything carol gave them a nicer death

[Deleted]

Orly? Please tell me the last time he actively murdered two people in cold blood, initially lied about it/hid it, then expressed zero remorse about it afterwards. B/c you know, that's what actually happened.

Killed the two guys in the bar.
Killed Shane.

All threats to the group, the two infected were also threats, would have likely died.

And like someone else in the thread has already pointed out, she's running on the same logic that Carl's done, and Rick has done in the past, cept because she's not related to Rick, she doesn't get away with it.

[Deleted]

I think Rick's issue is she didn't go through the council/him first. The last person with that attitude tried to kill him remember?

[Deleted]

I think Rick's issue is she didn't go through the council/him first. The last person with that attitude tried to kill him remember?

She was on the council. Rick wasn't, he wanted to be a farmer and stay out of running the place, and yet as soon as someone makes a decision that he doesn't agree with its a quick lolbanished for Carol.

[PACOX]

Killed the two guys in the bar.
Killed Shane.

All threats to the group, the two infected were also threats, would have likely died.

And like someone else in the thread has already pointed out, she's running on the same logic that Carl's done, and Rick has done in the past, cept because she's not related to Rick, she doesn't get away with it.

The three people you mentioned were completely out of self defense...Carol euthanized people without any input from the group of the people she killed and what was she going to do afterwards, continue to kill and burn people? Burn down the whole wing of sick people. Rick had to take her with him because you simply couldn't trust Carol anymore. Like Shane she had developed a very cold mindset and stopped really caring for the living, only those who met her cold standards. Mentally she's a living zombie, no amount of humanity exist within her just the drive to survive the next sunrise.

You can't say that she is using Carl's logic because Carl is an impulse driven child no one can really be sure if the dude that Carl shot was actually legit or not, Carls fault was that he reacted too quickly. Rick is very particular about killing the living, especially those within the group unless they were trying to kill you. Carol violated this rule and even when Rick was talking to her about it she still wanted to hide it from the group as if that was going to fly. Carol behavior had been a pattern of secrets and rash decisions, she was definitely a threat to the stability of the group and had to go. She was pretty much emulating Shane.

[Immitis]

now you are just jumping out of control.

carol wasnt going to burn down the whole sick ward. theres a difference between killing two people and killing a whole cell block of people, those two were the only ones known to be sick she thought she was containing the threat.

not to mention theres no way she would ever be able to do it without people finding out.

she isnt cold and lifeless. she was doing what she thought was right, and had the sickness not spread nobody here would be saying otherwise.

[Deleted]

Think about it like this.

Remember how rick said in the end that he wouldn't want to be close to her if everyone else died and it was just rick, carl and her left for example?
If she can kill 2 groupmembers because they're sick and has a chance to turn into walkers then she's raw enough to do other stuff for "the good of the group".

Imagine if they're running, they get split up, carl and carol go to the same place. They run into a house in a corridor, carl cuts himself and gets stuck with his leg, he manages to pull loose in the last second carol helps him to his feets but he can't run anymore. Walkers are closing in. KABLAM CAROL KICKS CARL IN THE GROIN AND RUNS FOR IT!!

After all, it was likely that both of em would have died if she didn't leave him there. I mean, if she acts on her own, without saying anything she doesn't fit in the group. The group survives as a group, you cant have lonewolfs inside a group. The fact that she didn't tell rick about it from the start and tried to hide it, only to later admit to it but seem 'careless' of it, like it was nothing. That shows us she can't be trusted. If she's done this once she can do it again, acting on her own without consulting anyone because she thinks it's better for the group.

And to a last point that i will say is Tyrese... Think he's just gonna drop it? I mean sure if rick agreed to it they could think of something like.... blame it on someone who has already turned, since he can't do nothing towards a dead walker... But if the truth EVER were to come out, both rick and carol would be in his crosshairs.

OOOHHH AND YEAHH!! Remember those 3 questions he asks random people?
How many people you kill?
How many zombie you kill?
Why you kill theese people?
Carol basically killed 2 guys cause they were sick and she thought they were gonna turn. THOUGHT. It wasn't certain, yet she wanted to contain the virus, buuut she killed em in cold blod. Or well, not killed. Murdered is a better word for it.
They were no threat to anyone in their cells (Except for the airborne virus) but she keeled em!


She might aswell open up that big cellblock where all the sick people are and kill em off. You know, to make sure no one else gets sick. Let's start with glenn.

TL;DR - If she goes behind the group leaders back, she can't be trusted. Remember his 3 questions he asks to strangers. She a mad murdered now. Carol the ripper.

[Immitis]

you cant compare those type of things to a disease.

you can fight zombies, you can fight a guy with a gun, you can fight an animal.

you cant fight a disease. they have one doctor whos sick himself so he cant think straight, and they have a vet, they are in a prison and have no way of knowing what they have or how to treat it, they have no way to access medicine and they cant quarantine it.

this isnt an enemy you can run from, this isnt an enemy you can outsmart or outgun.

you either get rid of it before it spreads, or you die.