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  1. #81
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    The current system isnt just balanced around lvl85 stats, its balanced around lvl85 abilities. Most classes miss one thing or another for atleast 1 spec, if not all specs, that will make them far more powerful at 85, meaning that without them, obviously they are going to be underpowered, else with them they will be overpowered.

    tbh, if it pisses you off THIS much quit? No-one forces you, or any other QQers in the world to play. Sure critism is good, and Im not saying anyone not 100% happy with the game should quit, but your way to aggressive about it.

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurmwhale View Post
    i'm just pointing out a truth here, [...] i'm [...] retarded.
    interesting read.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by conscript View Post
    Stop your hostile douchebaggery. I know it is hard to make it through maintenance downtime when WoW is your entire life. Go watch Price is Right or something and stop crying on these forums.
    I LOL-ed in RL ... but it makes sense.

  4. #84
    Old God conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starskee View Post
    Do yourself a favor and don't publicly condone greedy and unjust practices, just in the name of 'good business'. Good business means earning profits bymaking those who give you money happy. Not a complicated concept. What is happening here is making profits by any means they find convenient, this is wrong. Opportunism just leads to people being used as stepping stones.
    I like your small town, public relations concept of what good business means. Good business hasn't meant that in decades, if ever. Good business is doing right by your investors, stockholders, and upper tier management. Sure good business may mean doing right by your customers if you own a store in a town with a population of 5000, but that isn't what it means on a corporate scale.

    Also you should go Google "monopoly" and look up what it means. Blizzard in no way has a monopoly over the video game industry or even the MMO market. If they did, there wouldn't be dozens of other MMOs operating, some fairly sucessfully, and more MMOs released every month. Microsoft had a monopoly when it controlled 95% of all computer operating systems. Blizzard has never even had close to that kind of stranglehold on the market. They are like Coke or Pepsi Cola. Competitors exist and some are quite successful for long periods of time, but Coke and Pepsi are the driving force of the market even though they don't have a monopoly. Nothing is stopping consumers from seeking other products if they don't like Coke or Pepsi though just like nothing stops people from looking to other games besides WoW. That doesn't exist in a monopolistic state.

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Undefetter View Post
    tbh, if it pisses you off THIS much quit? No-one forces you, or any other QQers in the world to play. Sure critism is good, and Im not saying anyone not 100% happy with the game should quit, but your way to aggressive about it.
    Dude you play an easy as hell 2 button class that requires no skill whatsoever and honestly needs to be nerfed (needed it before patch to be perfectly honest see: Wrathful Gladiator Arena Statistics). Shut up.

  6. #86
    Correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't "mastery" kinda help with balance in the long run? I haven't bothered to look at the PVP sets (if they are even out) but is it wrong to guess that PVP sets won't have mastery rating? Meaning skills can be balanced (prior to additional mastery rating) at level 85 so that PVP will be more balanced. Then any imbalance in healing/dpsing/tank in a PVE environment can be adjusted through tweaks to the extra mastery you'll get from mastery rating on PVE gear?
    That's how i'm looking at it. If a skill is too OP in PVP, they can nerf if, then adjust how addition mastery plays into that classes role to keep them from being nerfed in PVE? Or even change the mastery all together to balance things out.
    Hopefully it works that way and results it a well balanced end-game for everyone.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by chunx0r View Post
    i was kinda ok with ur port until this. I am pretty sure that if you are saying "yeah stuffs messed up but 85 will fix it" you are assuming classes will in fact scale differently.
    Gear will scale differently though, way more stamina (Equal amounts over all armour-types and specs) and more other stats, mastery will crop up as something other than reforged stat too, so we're using half of the Cataclysm-skills (the new talent ones, not the trainable ones) without the gear to compensate for it in PvP, so yeah, for 1.5 months PvP is borked, same as it was in the end-days of vanilla and BC, there's a bit of a trend forming...

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurmwhale View Post
    thx for telling me theres hundreds of topics sayiing this, now point me to them idiot. bet you can't since there aren't any other topics that are saying the obvious more than a lot of morons like you spouting how everything right now is balanced for 85 :P

    its just dumb how a lot of you make up shit just to apologize for blizzard, and its constant here. be f'in real, thats all i ask instead of constantly making up whatever excuses you can for them.
    Orrr, instead of QQing how everything is unfair, L2PLAY your class, learn how to tank stuff in PvP, get used to the skills they gave us and look for possible applications for the future spells. Take Priests for instance, that Smite heal is one of the most well rounded talents they gave us, in Arenas and PvP we no longer have to stop burst damage to heal our partner, why? Because Smite heals for 100% of the damage dealt, now you 5 stack Evanglisem and pop Archangel + Power Infusion, you just got back all your wasted Mana, and now heal for 115% of Smite with a 20% + Haste cast time with a 20% reduced Mana cost... Burst... anytime Blizz does something they know their will always be a counter, they just leave it up to the players to find the way, look at the way Hydra plays, I learned from him, Dispels can be game breaking, so what do I do? I go completely offensive with my dispels before my partner opens, I get our KT nekkid then we burst, I fear the CC target, he follows with a Blind, I follow with 2 MC's, he Gouges... oh look Fear is back up, KT is dead cause he was nekkid the whole time and had no heals, or if need be, I would play more defensive with the Mana Burns and the force the healer to go try and LoS the Burns then Fear then burst... its called... learning your class's strengths and weaknesses against other classes. I know I can't beat a halfway decent Sub rogue, so what do I do? I fight the best Sub rogue on the BG over and over to learn. Simple when you know how to do it.

    When life gives you lemons, fuck it and bail - wise brother.

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by seam View Post
    How DARE Blizzard give us abilities that are prepared for level 85 2 months ahead of time so that we can get the hang of it?!

    HOW DARE THEY!?!
    You, sir, made my morning.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by mysticx View Post
    Gear will scale differently though, way more stamina (Equal amounts over all armour-types and specs) and more other stats, mastery will crop up as something other than reforged stat too, so we're using half of the Cataclysm-skills (the new talent ones, not the trainable ones) without the gear to compensate for it in PvP, so yeah, for 1.5 months PvP is borked, same as it was in the end-days of vanilla and BC, there's a bit of a trend forming...
    Do you people not read?

    The game isn't balanced at level 85 either. Everyone has about the same health pools in pvp and armor and that is the problem because melee does shit damage and casters dominate the scene just like they do now.

    Ergo, the problems we are having right now at level 80 on live in fact do exist at level 85. Ugh don't respond to the thread if you can't be bothered to read the replies. ><

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurmwhale View Post
    i'm just pointing out a truth here, and a over-stated lie/copout by so many who frequent these forums.

    i'm not exactly blaming Blizzard too much since they couldve either kept all of this stuff on Test and worked it letting us play in the same old stale WoW, or let us play with the new stuff on live, where i guess i prefer the latter(altho i really miss the balance we JUST had tbh). i just expect people to be real to the situation and not makeup whatever BS they can, and repeat it like its true.

    ---------- Post added 2010-10-19 at 02:24 PM ----------



    guess you're the noob that just started playing WoW at 4.01 so i think you should stfu noob. if you have a memory at all of Lich King people said the same shit here, and it turned out completely wrong and imbalanced at 80. keep straw manning it tho like the retard you are, i for one am wiser than your pea brain group think brainwashed mentality.

    you have to be EXTREMELY NAIVE or retarded to think all of this right now would be balanced at 85. which one are you? i'm guessing retarded.
    And thats why Enoesiiw has Astral Walker right? Yup he started at 4.01 alright! Dang your a smart player... oh wait your a Hunter my bad, hows that 3 Trap shot working for ya?

    When life gives you lemons, fuck it and bail - wise brother.

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Teamshelby View Post
    And thats why Enoesiiw has Astral Walker right? Yup he started at 4.01 alright!
    He got his Astral Walker Achievement just over 2 weeks Ago. Moron. He also has very few heroic achievements, and the ones he does have were recent.

    I.E. he is a scrub. Congrats.
    Last edited by Bucky Mclachlan; 2010-10-19 at 03:59 PM.

  13. #93
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurmwhale View Post
    actually i'm stating something that MOST people here haven't realized yet, or against what they currently believe(that everything comes together so perfectly at 85). there is a reality and wishful thinkiing of what they're told. i choose reality. but people get butthurt over that...
    Dude, most people know that level 85 is still rough, that's why there are still beta tests. Most people also know that after we hit 85 and they get much much more data and feedback there will be more finetuning.
    THAT though, does not mean that the numbers as they are now (pre-hotfixes) are the rough numbers for level 85, which is still being tweeked and will be more tweeked after release.

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky Mclachlan View Post
    He got his Astral Walker Achievement just over 2 weeks Ago. Moron. He also has very few heroic achievements.

    I.E. he is a scrub. Congrats.
    Rofl, I had to work all summer during raid times when Ulduar was in content.

    My Guild did Algalon because they wanted the title. Buuuut I did get Starcaller before 4.0.1.

    At least I have the balls to put my armory in my signature.

    Don't judge my ability as a player based solely on my achievements, I make do with what I can get on my server. If you want a comparison, NO ONE on my server has Light of Dawn. There's just too many BRs; they scared off all the good players. All that's left are a handful of decent players, so we have to fill the raid with baddies and that just makes it hard to progress in a casual guild. If I wanted I could easily transfer to a better server and get into a Light of Dawn guild, but then I would be leaving my RL friends behind. It's my decision to stay, and thus I have to suffer for it, but at least it's my decision.

    I am curious as to what Heroic achievements you're talking about.

  15. #95
    This may have already been said (I didn't quite wade through all the QQ), but one of the things that keeps me playing is the fact that the game is always in flux. Classes are constantly getting buffed and nerfed, and each time they do, I get to go through all the math to decide which stats are best for which char/spec and optimize accordingly. Granted most people don't love math quite like I do, but if wow just balanced itself and then sat idle I'd get bored with it crazy fast. I have to wonder if blizzard knows this and likes to stir up a bit of controversy every so often with an excessive buff or nerf here and there.

  16. #96
    that hotfix was my bad Somarlane's Avatar
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    Re: Game is not balanced around lvl 80 is a copout for poor current balance

    NOTE: Since it is very difficult to discern tone from text, I'm going to write this - this post is not intended as snarky, sarcastic, a put-down, a troll, I'm-better-than-all-of-you or anything other than genuine. But if you want to interpret as such, well, I can't stop you.

    Dear original poster:

    You had an argument. Not a new one, and it was/is expressed in tones that aren't conducive to thoughtful, exploratory debate - but an argument.

    Employing personal attacks destroyed whatever credence you had left from me, especially when you called someone a f*****, and violate the community guidelines. You have over 1000 posts created, so I also assume you ought to know better. It is behavior like such that contribute to the toxicity of a community.

    I hope you take the time during your incoming ban to ponder your actions (and also to relax because that much stress cannot be healthy). Posting non-constructively doesn't do anyone any good, especially to the one posted it. This statement also applies to all those who attack you, egg you on, or just simply are taking advantage of the situation for their own shenanigans.
    Originally Posted by Daeleht (Blue Tracker)
    Post constructively
    or I'll press some different buttons next time.
    Quote Originally Posted by Banzhe View Post
    ...I buy an mmo-rpg I expect varying content with social interaction at the heart of it,
    not a twisted version of Diablo meets facebook!
    Perfect summations of my feelings on CRZ - why I want to like it but can't.

  17. #97
    Pretty certain that Blizzard understood PVP balance would not be in place at level80 when they released the patch.. Thus why competitive PVP is not going on. 4.0.1 is much like 3.0.x was. It is a patch designed to allow players to re-learn their class and playstyle.
    That being said, true balance will never be achieved in a game where you have multiple classes featuring varying game style/mechanics. The best you can hope to attain is a happy medium that allows enough of your population to play with relative enjoyment.
    Your post over all, however, leaves alot to be desired... and it's not very clear what you actually hoped to achieve. I'm inclined to believe that "most" of the people who take the time to read WoW sites and research the game have a fair enough grasp on the issue of "balance" to understand that it may never truly happen. As such, your bitter responses and theory of "brainwashing" would be better served in trade chat... Who knows, you may have a guild named after you.

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurmwhale View Post
    same thing people said in early lich king who QQ'd about pallys, dk's, etc. and funny enough Blizzard still had to do a TON of nerfing to those classes thoughout lich king even at 80 to bring them down.

    fact is so many people are brainwashed to whatever blizzard tells them(especially on mmo champion) they don't realize how much of a work in progress everything is all of the time.

    its just a lame copout to pretend everything is going to come together at 85 as things currently are. people need to stop saying that. guarantee there would be MAJOR issues at 85 if we were playing in it assuming equal scaling...
    /run google translate QQMOAR to English

    "Im mad that I can not own all classes in pvp in a GCD like others can in this buggy and crazy time between now and 85."



    Thank you for sharing this with us OP.

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky Mclachlan View Post
    He got his Astral Walker Achievement just over 2 weeks Ago. Moron. He also has very few heroic achievements, and the ones he does have were recent.

    I.E. he is a scrub. Congrats.
    Your sooo right lol he must be a scrub, darn scrubs! Who sir are you? Might I ask? The point is he got his title before 4.01, so therefore hes not that much of a scrub, plus hes only missing 4 groups of those dungeon achievements, I don't raid cause I don't like it, and I don't have many PvP points cause I work, and go to college. I would say instead of QQing and calling us all brainwashed, read up before you speak, its like what your momma used to say, "Look both ways before you cross, then look again." I wonder why she said that? Maybe because you could be hit be a car coming around a corner you missed before? Same thing applies here, maybe when Cata comes out life will be full or grander and the grass will truly be greener, or it could be a total train wreck and needs more work, regardless, I will play this game because I like it, I won't QQ and be all "but, but, but ... my class" or "But, but, but ... this class ..." just chill out take some time to think your class and how you could improve it... maybe send Blizz a written letter or email? QQing gets you nowhere, it does however get more angry, you see one thing wrong then you see everything wrong...

    When life gives you lemons, fuck it and bail - wise brother.

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Aliok View Post
    NOTE: Since it is very difficult to discern tone from text, I'm going to write this - this post is not intended as snarky, sarcastic, a put-down, a troll, I'm-better-than-all-of-you or anything other than genuine. But if you want to interpret as such, well, I can't stop you.

    Dear original poster:

    You had an argument. Not a new one, and it was/is expressed in tones that aren't conducive to thoughtful, exploratory debate - but an argument.

    Employing personal attacks destroyed whatever credence you had left from me, especially when you called someone a f*****, and violate the community guidelines. You have over 1000 posts created, so I also assume you ought to know better. It is behavior like such that contribute to the toxicity of a community.

    I hope you take the time during your incoming ban to ponder your actions (and also to relax because that much stress cannot be healthy). Posting non-constructively doesn't do anyone any good, especially to the one posted it. This statement also applies to all those who attack you, egg you on, or just simply are taking advantage of the situation for their own shenanigans.

    stfu you idiot. its funny how you all gloss over all of the noobs attacking me early on, where i respond in kind. i wouldn't have attacked ANYBODY if they didn't attack me for posting this, which IS a legit thread, no matter how you all want to pretend "nobody really thinks everything will be balanced at 85"....considering people are saying that ALL OVER THE FORUMS acting like its perfect Utopia of balance when we hit it.

    if i'm banned it just goes to show how the ignorant, group think of the typical mmo champion poster is catered to here, and how little freedom there is in calling that out. i don't find a more sheep-like mentality on any other WoW forum than here, and its especially laughable there were so many mages in the mage forums giving the Blizz company line of "we have so many more possibilities now in specs" when we're all forced to the bottom of the tree and can only go into 2 top tiers of another, where its almost straight forward cookie cutter specs. so many people here just do not think for themselves whatsoever, and don't even bring that shit about how "nobody really thinks everythings balanced at 85" when thats all everyone is acting for any/all current QQ. the state we're all currently playing in, and will be playing in for months.

    one last thing is its the same EXACT thing going on that happened in Lich kiing and its funny how none of you even remember how that went down. i also don't get why so many pve'ers comment here on the pvp forums...
    Last edited by Spurmwhale; 2010-10-19 at 04:35 PM.

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