Melee level 85 PvP sets

[LyskaWF]

Why is melee being forced to take expertise as a stat? It's on our shoulders: http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/60437/v...ked-spaulders/
I'm not sure what the equivalent would be for casters (spell pen past the cap? spirit?), but I feel pretty comfortable saying that no one gems or enchants for expertise. Why are we required to have that instead of something useful like mastery while all casters get is haste, hit, crit and mastery(on two pieces)? Most of us have a good chunk of expertise from talents we would take in a PvP spec anyways. I guess this is yet another way of helping out those casters that have had such a hard time playing wizard cleaves =[

Melee:
Crit
Hit
Haste
Mastery
Expertise

Casters:
Crit
Hit
Haste
Mastery
Mastery

[Underskilled]

Casters have to gem and enchant for spell pen, we don't.

[LyskaWF]

Some of us do. That doesn't change the fact that expertise is not a desirable stat.

[Spondoo]

If we can reforge that shit then I don't care.

[LyskaWF]

Even knowing that you can only reforge 40% of a stat? I don't know about you but I'd rather have an extra 95 mastery than expertise...

[Swizzle]

Wow, and just when I thought people had run out of inane things to complain about. Don't like that expertise piece? Don't think you need the stat? Find an off-set item and use it instead. Also, there is only one melee class, the DK, which would have any reason to gem/chant for spell pen.

[fizikz]

I love expertise as a pvp stat, as long as they don't give us too much, I'll be happy with it. even casters have some dodge, right? and melee who have parry too, it'll be twice as effective against.

I hate getting dodged/parried on a very critical attack, especially something like a stun if I'm on a rogue/feral. with strength increasing parry for all classes now... I think it will be more valuable than you think. I'd rather have less RNG like miss/dodge/parry than do a bit more damage.

[LyskaWF]

Why is that an insane thing to complain about? It's not like the stats ever change. How would you feel if you got spell hit capped by wearing any four pieces of t11 gear and then Blizzard went and put hit on every trinket, weapon, ring, and neck? (Yes, I'm aware that the item budgets on trinkets and such won't be including hit.)

We know that in Cataclysm we, as DPS, are going to be much more responsible for keeping ourselves up and less reliant on healers pumping heals into us. Therefore, resilience gear is always going to be better (maybe changing in late content patches of Cataclysm). Wearing an offpiece is probably never going to be worth it.

Yeah, you're right - sorry. If you forget about enhancement shaman and feral druids (I believe they go for 75 for cyclones?), DKs are the only melee class that need to gem for spell penetration.

---------- Post added 2010-10-26 at 03:56 AM ----------

I hate getting dodged/parried on a very critical attack, especially something like a stun if I'm on a rogue/feral. with strength increasing parry for all classes now... I think it will be more valuable than you think. I'd rather have less RNG like miss/dodge/parry than do a bit more damage.

That's fair coming from a rogue or warrior, I suppose. But what about the enhancement shaman and DKs that do half magic damage? The point is that it's one of, if not the last stat most of us want. Why not let us gem for it if we want it?

[Swizzle]

Inane (adjective): lacking sense, significance, or ideas; silly.

In other news, I completely forgot about 1 spec but last I checked ferals don't gem for spell pen.

[fizikz]

if it's only on shoulders, I think enh and DK's can suck it up. as stated before, you can reforge to get 40% of it to a different stat. it's only ONE piece of gear. it may not be ideal, but neither is crit for some classes, and pvp rings have always been crit/hit, and the main stat on almost every piece of set gear has been crit(besides spirit for healers)... less than ideal? yes. still worth it for the resil/stam? yes.

PS: AFAIK, a lot of ferals do go for (or used to anyway) 75 SP for cyclone against motw/mage armor

"whynot let us gem for it if we want it" because no one gems any secndary stat (except maybe hit -.-) for pvp. it's all str or SP(int), as much as you can get of it.

really I think you're blowing this way out of proportion... it's one piece of gear, and with reforging, only 60% of a secondary stat on it...

[Arka90]

I love expertise as a pvp stat, as long as they don't give us too much, I'll be happy with it. even casters have some dodge, right? and melee who have parry too, it'll be twice as effective against.

To me that expertise is close to useless, since for the setup I'm planing on runing (for arena) and have been runing for most of TBC and WotLK, it has always been best to go for enemy caster to lock down the damage (heavy armor team). Casters dont parry, dodges proc overpower (which is my strongest hiting attack atm), though, they could dodge at the same time as I get a TfB proc, but the chance of that happening is low with caster's low dodge chance (and due to being unable to dodge when casting, hit in the back or stuned). If I do go for a melee anyway, it's mostly to peel them off my healer, and players cant dodge / parry attacks from behind anyway, so it's even useless there.

EDIT: Should say that even for the rated BGs in cata (though I dont get anything from them with my arena ratings), I'm most likely going to be runing around in a group with those same friends I do arena with, and because of that my targets in rated Bgs would be the same.

[Speaknoevil]

I need expertise for my Backstab/Ambush abilities.

[mtr]

It is just another example of careless design from an unexperienced developer who never played serious pvp. I'd rather have hit, because I'm going to cap it anyway. But expertise is serious business.

But that's ok, we're just going to find offset pieces in shoulder slots; They do not represent two thousands of personal rating anymore anyway.

I need expertise for my Backstab/Ambush abilities.

And this.

[talitu]

It is just another example of careless design from an unexperienced developer who never played serious pvp. I'd rather have hit, because I'm going to cap it anyway. But expertise is serious business.

But that's ok, we're just going to find offset pieces in shoulder slots; They do not represent two thousands of personal rating anymore anyway.


And this.

no , no its not. early tiers in each expansion always have the least perfect stat allocation, it allows each set after to be made "better" expect the second set to be over perfect and see people bitching and whinning they cant get any of the secondary stats they need.

it amazes me how people refuse to learn from the past ><

[Speaknoevil]

We have heard no mention of stat improvement on further gear.

We are basing this on information that's available.

And based on the aforementioned, the whole idea is absurd.

PS. As a melee you should never be using your abilities from the front. [exception was gouge (BUT NOT ANYMORE)]

[Dethric]

I have some vague memory of blizz saying that they don't want the first tier of the expansion to be perfectly itemized and you just gain some statpoints with an upgrade. Might have something to do with it.

Also, a dodged execute/lava lash/eviscerate might cost you the match, so exp isn't that bad

[Speaknoevil]

They have a back.

Backs negate that factor of RNG.

[mtr]

They have a back.

Backs negate that factor of RNG.

In some fast paced games you may decide to use certain ability from the front, just because you're kited like crazy and do not have pvp trinket and rogue is going to vanish in couple of seconds and reopen you.

Though I did experience some stupid RNG kidney dodges from warlocks and priests, but then again, those were like 0.001% of matches and they usually did not cost me a victory.

As for itemizing, melee pvp sets always had crit as a secondary stat.

[Hunger]

you will be happy if u think that u may hit once or twice more instead of dodging..ppl usually forget whats usefull until they read a bit between the lines of things

[Deleted]

Wow, and just when I thought people had run out of inane things to complain about. Don't like that expertise piece? Don't think you need the stat? Find an off-set item and use it instead. Also, there is only one melee class, the DK, which would have any reason to gem/chant for spell pen.

Ferals need spellpen aswell. Resisted cyclone says hello.

Enhancement need spellpennaswell. Resisted Lightning Bolt says hi.