NFL updates/news

[Neazy]

No... I was agreeing with you. That's why I said he once called Sanchez an elite QB. That's all the facts you need to support your argument.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/stor...wins-big-games

To be fair that's an old article and Sanchez had just come off of winning 4 road playoff games. At the time, that was tied for most road playoff wins by a starting QB in the history of the NFL (since surpassed by Eli Manning this past season). He's actually played well in the playoffs, too: in 6 playoff games that he went 4-2 in he has a 60.5% completion percentage, 9 TDs, 3 INTs, and a 94.3 rating. And it's not like he only played bad teams either. He has playoff wins against the Chargers the year they had 13 wins and the Colts with Peyton. The losses were to the Steelers and to those same Colts the year before.

Not trying to defend Rex because he is an idiot. But Sanchez could do great things in the right situation.

[Amsden]

To be fair that's an old article and Sanchez had just come off of winning 4 road playoff games. At the time, that was tied for most road playoff wins by a starting QB in the history of the NFL (since surpassed by Eli Manning this past season). He's actually played well in the playoffs, too: in 6 playoff games that he went 4-2 in he has a 60.5% completion percentage, 9 TDs, 3 INTs, and a 94.3 rating. And it's not like he only played bad teams either. He has playoff wins against the Chargers the year they had 13 wins and the Colts with Peyton. The losses were to the Steelers and to those same Colts the year before.

Not trying to defend Rex because he is an idiot. But Sanchez could do great things in the right situation.

Yeah he has had good moments but he has never been elite. Peyton and Brady are the only 2 modern QBs I would give that title to.

[Skarsguard]

Yeah he has had good moments but he has never been elite. Peyton and Brady are the only 2 modern QBs I would give that title to.

Rodgers and Brees deserve that title as well.

[Deleted]

Rodgers and Brees deserve that title as well.

I guess it depends on what you define as elite. I would agree that Rodgers and Brees are elite QB's, but not as elite as Manning and Brady are.

[draynay]

argh people are throwing around the word "elite" and there isn't even a terrible game on tonight, the week is so long!

[conscript]

I guess it depends on what you define as elite. I would agree that Rodgers and Brees are elite QB's, but not as elite as Manning and Brady are.

I don't think Brees is there, but I think Rodgers has put himself on that level this season. He is doing the exact same thing that Brady and especially Manning are famous for. He is building stars out of receivers considered to be nobodies. James Jones, Randy Cobb, etc. are all establishing themselves as legit NFL receivers in the absence of Jennings and Nelson to the point that Jennings doesn't even expect to be back with the Pack next year. Oh ya and Rodgers is doing it without even a partial running game just like Manning and Brady did. The Packers have had a back go for 100 yards once in the last three seasons, back in 2010.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 10:47 AM ----------

argh people are throwing around the word "elite" and there isn't even a terrible game on tonight, the week is so long!

Don't worry, just two more days until you can watch the Falcons slaughter the Lions and wear their pelts.

[Neazy]

If Peyton's elite, Brees has to be elite. They have the same number of rings and Brees has had better stats in the years since he's been with the Saints. Peyton's having a better year this year for sure, but if we go back to 09 I'd take Brees.

But Rodgers is better than both of them right now. The guy had 45 TDs and 6 INTs last year, and this year he's got 32 vs. 8. Only Brady is (slightly) better than Rodgers this year.

[Badpaladin]

A rare sighting, an actually interesting and well-written NFL.com article about Von Miller and Aldon Smith.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100...er-is-superior

[buck008]

So I haven't been checking in for a couple days and missed this. But someone honestly said that Peyton Manning is better than Joe Montana, and this person wasn't laughed off of the internet? With my Giants in mid-implosion, I can't stomach football news/chat as much, someone needs to take care of this stuff in my absence. We're going to ignore the fact that in terms of yardage and TD's comparing the stats of a modern QB to any other era is like comparing home run numbers from the steroid era to numbers outside that era? Also, the point of playing in a sport is to win the whole thing. In team sports, an individual's achievements can get marginalized (when it's convenient for the discussion) because winning is a team effort. When someone wins a bunch of rings, it stops being coincidence. So it's not the ultimate end of any discussion of greatness, but it's in the discussion.

Anyway, once the Giants finish melting down and I have to watch the Washington Redskins play a real playoff game and get killed, maybe I'll calm down. Also, I think the Cowboys cut ties with Romo because he's been there for like 6 years. If they were going to win with him, they would have already. Maybe there isn't anyone obviously better around, but they already aren't making the playoffs. With Romo they just come painfully close. You know what the difference between that and being the worst team in the league? Draft position. It's why Dallas is always 8-8.

[Jibjabb]

I dont like how QB is the only position where Super Bowl Rings plays such a significant impact on their ranking of their greatness. The QB isnt playing by himself, all Brady's super bowls were when he was playing MUCH worse cause his defense was much better. Its just a rediculous argument.

[conscript]

Anyway, once the Giants finish melting down and I have to watch the Washington Redskins play a real playoff game and get killed, maybe I'll calm down. Also, I think the Cowboys cut ties with Romo because he's been there for like 6 years. If they were going to win with him, they would have already. Maybe there isn't anyone obviously better around, but they already aren't making the playoffs. With Romo they just come painfully close. You know what the difference between that and being the worst team in the league? Draft position. It's why Dallas is always 8-8.

Well good luck to Dallas tanking for the roughly 20% shot that there is a legit NFL QB at the top of the draft.
2012- There were three (one fell to the third round because of height)
2011- Cam Newton, arguably based on his second year struggles. Gabbert and Ponder went next. They are both somewhere between meh and awful.
2010- Sam Bradford, yet to look like a franchise guy. Next QB taken was Tim Tebow...
2009-Matt Stafford, injury prone, able to produce with literally one receiver. If Megatron isn't producing he looks like shit. Sanchez was next, awful.
2008- Matt Ryan, decent. Joe Flacco, the definition of mediocre
2007-Jamarcus Russell. Lol

So in the past 6 drafts, and remember there are 0 for sure franchise guys in this draft according to every analyst, there have been three, maybe four guys who you can look at right now and say that is the guy for their team and THREE of those guys were in last years draft. I wouldn't take Newton, Stafford, Bradford, Tebow, Gabbert, or Ponder over Romo. Hell I wouldn't even have to think about it for half a second before I said no on almost every guy on that list. Why on Earth would the Cowboys sacrifice a guy who is absolutely a top 10 NFL QB for the opportunity to maybe, possibly tank their way to a true franchise guy in 2-5 years? It would be beyond retarded. Hell even having a franchise guy doesn't guarantee you a ring ever.

I think the list of top franchise QBs in the league would be: Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Luck, RG3, and maybe Matt Ryan. You could make an argument for the Manning bros being in that group as well (although that didn't stop Manning from getting dealt) and maybe Wilson. Those are the group of guys that their team is dead set with and wouldn't even consider replacing at this point. Romo is comparable to pretty much every single guy in that list.
2011: 5th in TD passes, 7th in yards, 3rd in comp%
2010: Missed 10 games. Completed nearly 70% of his passes for 1600 yards and 11 TDs when healthy. Carry that through for the year and he is 1st in comp%, 6th in TDs, and 5th in yards.
2009: 10th in comp%, 3rd in yards, 9th in TDs.

The Cowboys do not need to cut Romo and tank the team to try and draft an elite QB. THE COWBOYS HAVE AN ELITE QB. Guess who leads the NFL with 5 4th quarter comebacks this year? Tony Romo. Guess who has NINE in the past two seasons? Tony Romo. Guess who have NINE game winning drives in the past two seasons? Tony Romo. Guess who has a better INT% (2.8%) than Eli Manning, Brees, and Luck? Tony Romo, and this is a down year. He was 4th in the damn league last year in INT% and 5th in TD%. The entire premise of the dump Tony Romo argument is so completely unrealistic. There is zero evidence to suggest that Romo isn't a great QB and that the Cowboys need to act like he is the problem. He isn't. Never has been (except on the FG snap he dropped). Their defense disappears. Has for years. Their running game is a joke with constantly rotating pieces thanks to injury or non-performance. Their best receiver is a headcase. Their second best receiver popped up out of nowhere thanks to Tony Romo! So no, the Cowboys don't need to cut Romo. They need to cut Garrett, Ryan, get a fucking GM, and start to build a team around the elite QB wearing their damn jersey rather than coveting the idea of what could be is only they had a Brady or Rodgers or if they stumbled into a high pick. You know what could be with either of those guys and the current lineup of knuckleheads running that franchise? 8-8, 9-7, maybe a wild card and a first round loss.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 03:46 PM ----------

I dont like how QB is the only position where Super Bowl Rings plays such a significant impact on their ranking of their greatness. The QB isnt playing by himself, all Brady's super bowls were when he was playing MUCH worse cause his defense was much better. Its just a rediculous argument.

Tom Brady's three best seasons:
2011: 39 TD, 12 INT, 5235 yards, lost the Super Bowl in which his team mustered 17 points
2010: 34 TD, 6INT, 3900 yards, lost in the AFC divisional round
2007: 50 TD, 8INT, 4800 yards, lost in the Super Bowl in which his team mustered 14 points

So in two of the most prolific statistical seasons EVER, Brady's TEAM scored a combined 31 points in two playoff games. And people want to say it is all about the QB lol. (Oh ya and if you remove the two most anomalous seasons from there, Brady has incredibly similar career numbers to Tony Romo)

[Jibjabb]

The Cowboys do not need to cut Romo and tank the team to try and draft an elite QB. THE COWBOYS HAVE AN ELITE QB. Guess who leads the NFL with 5 4th quarter comebacks this year? Tony Romo. Guess who has NINE in the past two seasons? Tony Romo. Guess who have NINE game winning drives in the past two seasons? Tony Romo. Guess who has a better INT% (2.8%) than Eli Manning, Brees, and Luck? Tony Romo, and this is a down year. He was 4th in the damn league last year in INT% and 5th in TD%. The entire premise of the dump Tony Romo argument is so completely unrealistic. There is zero evidence to suggest that Romo isn't a great QB and that the Cowboys need to act like he is the problem. He isn't. Never has been (except on the FG snap he dropped). Their defense disappears. Has for years. Their running game is a joke with constantly rotating pieces thanks to injury or non-performance. Their best receiver is a headcase. Their second best receiver popped up out of nowhere thanks to Tony Romo! So no, the Cowboys don't need to cut Romo. They need to cut Garrett, Ryan, get a fucking GM, and start to build a team around the elite QB wearing their damn jersey rather than coveting the idea of what could be is only they had a Brady or Rodgers or if they stumbled into a high pick. You know what could be with either of those guys and the current lineup of knuckleheads running that franchise? 8-8, 9-7, maybe a wild card and a first round loss.

I am standing up and applauding this post. Tony Romo is a really good QB. He gets so much shit that is undeserved. If you honestly look at him statistically over the last 6 seasons or so he has ran loops around Eli Manning and Big Ben but cause their TEAM was better they get all the credit and Romo gets all the blame.

[conscript]

I am standing up and applauding this post. Tony Romo is a really good QB. He gets so much shit that is undeserved. If you honestly look at him statistically over the last 6 seasons or so he has ran loops around Eli Manning and Big Ben but cause their TEAM was better they get all the credit and Romo gets all the blame.

This is the best endorsement I can give for Tony Romo. I am a Lions fan. We have a QB who threw for over 5,000 yards last year. He is absolutely the driving force for the team's offense and some could argue he is a franchise guy.. Would I trade Matt Stafford for Tony Romo?

In a fucking heartbeat.

[Vetali]

Tony Romo does pretty well for getting a platter of shit from Jerry Jones and the coaching staff.

[Pendulous]

So I haven't been checking in for a couple days and missed this. But someone honestly said that Peyton Manning is better than Joe Montana, and this person wasn't laughed off of the internet? With my Giants in mid-implosion, I can't stomach football news/chat as much, someone needs to take care of this stuff in my absence. We're going to ignore the fact that in terms of yardage and TD's comparing the stats of a modern QB to any other era is like comparing home run numbers from the steroid era to numbers outside that era? Also, the point of playing in a sport is to win the whole thing. In team sports, an individual's achievements can get marginalized (when it's convenient for the discussion) because winning is a team effort. When someone wins a bunch of rings, it stops being coincidence. So it's not the ultimate end of any discussion of greatness, but it's in the discussion.

Anyway, once the Giants finish melting down and I have to watch the Washington Redskins play a real playoff game and get killed, maybe I'll calm down. Also, I think the Cowboys cut ties with Romo because he's been there for like 6 years. If they were going to win with him, they would have already. Maybe there isn't anyone obviously better around, but they already aren't making the playoffs. With Romo they just come painfully close. You know what the difference between that and being the worst team in the league? Draft position. It's why Dallas is always 8-8.

I wasn't the first to compare Manning to Montana, and I was trying to prove he wasn't overrated.

The draft thing would make sense if it actually mattered that the top draft picks made a difference. Ask Tom Brady, arguably one of the best ever, if draft position makes a difference.

[Neazy]

I don't have anything meaninful to add to this but I just wanted to say:

I wouldn't take Newton, Stafford, Bradford, Tebow, Gabbert, or Ponder over Romo. Hell I wouldn't even have to think about it for half a second before I said no on almost every guy on that list. Why on Earth would the Cowboys sacrifice a guy who is absolutely a top 10 NFL QB for the opportunity to maybe, possibly tank their way to a true franchise guy in 2-5 years? It would be beyond retarded. Hell even having a franchise guy doesn't guarantee you a ring ever.

You wouldn't take Newton over Romo???? That's crazy talk.

If we add rushing yards and TDs to their stats over the last two years, we get:

Newton: 8855 yards, 60 TDs, 27 INTs, 59.1% completion

Romo: 8548 yards, 55 TDs, 26 INTs, 66.5% completion

Almost identical stats with Romo being more accurate. And I'd argue that the Panthers have a way worse supporting cast for their QB than the Cowboys have for Romo. Once you factor in that Cam is younger and gets better in big games (see: both Falcons games this year, both primetime games this year and his first pro game last year) while Romo gets worse (see: his 3 bad playoff games compared to 1 good one) taking Cam is a no brainer.

[Skarsguard]

The one thing about Romo over any QB and I mean any is that they don't play on the Cowboys. Cowboys are the Lakers and Yankees of the NFL they are under a microscope 24/7 they have probably the most fans nation wide. I mean I have been to New Orleans you see saints apparel and you see Cowboys apparel I bet its the same in every city. To the point every interception he throws is like another QB throwing 3 INT's because people pay more attention to him. Most teams wouldn't mind a Tony Romo I could probably name 15 teams right now that would take him.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 07:02 PM ----------

I don't have anything meaninful to add to this but I just wanted to say:



You wouldn't take Newton over Romo???? That's crazy talk.

If we add rushing yards and TDs to their stats over the last two years, we get:

Newton: 8855 yards, 60 TDs, 27 INTs, 59.1% completion

Romo: 8548 yards, 55 TDs, 26 INTs, 66.5% completion

Almost identical stats with Romo being more accurate. And I'd argue that the Panthers have a way worse supporting cast for their QB than the Cowboys have for Romo. Once you factor in that Cam is younger and gets better in big games (see: both Falcons games this year, both primetime games this year and his first pro game last year) while Romo gets worse (see: his 3 bad playoff games compared to 1 good one) taking Cam is a no brainer.

There is no way I would take that head case Newton over Romo. Teammates seem to like Tony Romo so to other players in the league most people do not like Newton which goes a long way esp in the locker room.

[Amsden]

Well good luck to Dallas tanking for the roughly 20% shot that there is a legit NFL QB at the top of the draft.
2012- There were three (one fell to the third round because of height)
2011- Cam Newton, arguably based on his second year struggles. Gabbert and Ponder went next. They are both somewhere between meh and awful.
2010- Sam Bradford, yet to look like a franchise guy. Next QB taken was Tim Tebow...
2009-Matt Stafford, injury prone, able to produce with literally one receiver. If Megatron isn't producing he looks like shit. Sanchez was next, awful.
2008- Matt Ryan, decent. Joe Flacco, the definition of mediocre
2007-Jamarcus Russell. Lol

So in the past 6 drafts, and remember there are 0 for sure franchise guys in this draft according to every analyst, there have been three, maybe four guys who you can look at right now and say that is the guy for their team and THREE of those guys were in last years draft. I wouldn't take Newton, Stafford, Bradford, Tebow, Gabbert, or Ponder over Romo. Hell I wouldn't even have to think about it for half a second before I said no on almost every guy on that list. Why on Earth would the Cowboys sacrifice a guy who is absolutely a top 10 NFL QB for the opportunity to maybe, possibly tank their way to a true franchise guy in 2-5 years? It would be beyond retarded. Hell even having a franchise guy doesn't guarantee you a ring ever.

I think the list of top franchise QBs in the league would be: Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Luck, RG3, and maybe Matt Ryan. You could make an argument for the Manning bros being in that group as well (although that didn't stop Manning from getting dealt) and maybe Wilson. Those are the group of guys that their team is dead set with and wouldn't even consider replacing at this point. Romo is comparable to pretty much every single guy in that list.
2011: 5th in TD passes, 7th in yards, 3rd in comp%
2010: Missed 10 games. Completed nearly 70% of his passes for 1600 yards and 11 TDs when healthy. Carry that through for the year and he is 1st in comp%, 6th in TDs, and 5th in yards.
2009: 10th in comp%, 3rd in yards, 9th in TDs.

The Cowboys do not need to cut Romo and tank the team to try and draft an elite QB. THE COWBOYS HAVE AN ELITE QB. Guess who leads the NFL with 5 4th quarter comebacks this year? Tony Romo. Guess who has NINE in the past two seasons? Tony Romo. Guess who have NINE game winning drives in the past two seasons? Tony Romo. Guess who has a better INT% (2.8%) than Eli Manning, Brees, and Luck? Tony Romo, and this is a down year. He was 4th in the damn league last year in INT% and 5th in TD%. The entire premise of the dump Tony Romo argument is so completely unrealistic. There is zero evidence to suggest that Romo isn't a great QB and that the Cowboys need to act like he is the problem. He isn't. Never has been (except on the FG snap he dropped). Their defense disappears. Has for years. Their running game is a joke with constantly rotating pieces thanks to injury or non-performance. Their best receiver is a headcase. Their second best receiver popped up out of nowhere thanks to Tony Romo! So no, the Cowboys don't need to cut Romo. They need to cut Garrett, Ryan, get a fucking GM, and start to build a team around the elite QB wearing their damn jersey rather than coveting the idea of what could be is only they had a Brady or Rodgers or if they stumbled into a high pick. You know what could be with either of those guys and the current lineup of knuckleheads running that franchise? 8-8, 9-7, maybe a wild card and a first round loss.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 03:46 PM ----------


Tom Brady's three best seasons:
2011: 39 TD, 12 INT, 5235 yards, lost the Super Bowl in which his team mustered 17 points
2010: 34 TD, 6INT, 3900 yards, lost in the AFC divisional round
2007: 50 TD, 8INT, 4800 yards, lost in the Super Bowl in which his team mustered 14 points

So in two of the most prolific statistical seasons EVER, Brady's TEAM scored a combined 31 points in two playoff games. And people want to say it is all about the QB lol. (Oh ya and if you remove the two most anomalous seasons from there, Brady has incredibly similar career numbers to Tony Romo)

I agree the only way we lose Romo anytime soon is if he decides to become a FA and go somewhere else.

---------- Post added 2012-12-21 at 12:11 AM ----------

This is the best endorsement I can give for Tony Romo. I am a Lions fan. We have a QB who threw for over 5,000 yards last year. He is absolutely the driving force for the team's offense and some could argue he is a franchise guy.. Would I trade Matt Stafford for Tony Romo?

In a fucking heartbeat.

How about Dez Bryant for Megatron?

[conscript]

How about Dez Bryant for Megatron?

Lol hells naw. I'd rather have the guy who is flat out a better receiver and is a completely down to earth guy than the idiot who owes several hundred thousand dolllars to jewelers from shit he bought before being drafted, is banned from a mall, and needs a team provided escort.

[Skarsguard]

Lol hells naw. I'd rather have the guy who is flat out a better receiver and is a completely down to earth guy than the idiot who owes several hundred thousand dolllars to jewelers from shit he bought before being drafted, is banned from a mall, and needs a team provided escort.

Dez is in the same boat as Newton they are headcases. Dez of course is more off in the deep end but yeah. How many receivers in the first round did the Lions take before they got Megatron.