1. #4721
    Old God conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    psychologically teams will be more inclined to go for it, which I see as a negative
    Lol no they wouldn't. That would never happen. Coaches are petrified of change and breaking groupthink. Just look at the complete unwillingness to go for 2 points prior to the 4th quarter or go for 4th downs ever. Cleveland has lost two games this year, Dallas and Philly, because of their coaches terror of going for 2 prior to the 4th quarter. a 5 point lead is functionally identical to your chances to win as a 6 point lead. If you are up by 5 and have the option to kick an extra point or go for two, going for two is the right choice even if you only convert like 28% of the time since your opposition is in a nearly identical hole whether it is 5 or 6 points. Carolina has blown at least two games this year because of their refusal to go for 4th and 1 late in games. It cost them in the Atlanta game, it cost them a couple weeks ago. The miniscule field position gained by punting is worthless compared to the potential in running out the clock. Carolina has one of the best running games in the league and won't make those obvious choices.

    NFL coaches aren't going to suddenly be more inclined to go for it. Just look at the fascinating levels of stupidity in places like Cleveland, Buffalo, Carolina, Oakland, etc. where they are so risk averse it literally loses them games because they can't make those decisions correctly. There are only 3-4 teams who would see the advantage the rules gives them and exploit it as much as possible, New England, New Orleans, etc. the smartest teams in the league on the sidelines.

    The QB penalties are another issue altogether. They wouldn't drastically increase with the rule anymore than expected. The NFL needs to address them in general, not hold of changing rules because of the fear that more incidents might pop up. The refs need to start judging intent and viciousness of hits, and not have all the contact under one blanket and judge a grazing of the helmet on an unstoppable attempt to block the pass (the play that cause Seattle to lose to Miami) different from a guy trying to tear a QB down by the head (See: Ndamukong Suh's career).

    You can't do much to change automatic 1st down penalties unfortunately. Roughing the passer you can tighten up and make correct calls sure, but you can't do anything about pass interference or defensive holding. If you change those to 5 yards and no automatic 1st you will get defensive backs just tackling guys if they get a step on them to have a do over play. It is kind of like last week when a player got horse-collared to prevent a touchdown. That play should be an automatic touchdown rather than half the distance to the goal which ended up being two freaking yards. There is no elegant solution to fix the penalties on pass interference since granting an automatic touchdown would be nonsense and impossible to judge since who knows if the player would have caught the ball. The only inbetween would be a 10 yard penalty and an automatic 1st which still doesn't address the auto 1st issue.

    I suppose the answer is better officiating or more review.
    Last edited by conscript; 2012-12-06 at 10:18 PM.

  2. #4722
    Fluffy Kitten Pendulous's Avatar
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    By the way, how many head to head contacts get people concussions on kickoffs, compared to wide receivers getting jacked by defenders on EVERY pass play? Where's those numbers to support the idea that killing kickoffs would make the game safer? Actually, how much better is a punt going to be if people are charging at a punt returner the same way?

    Dumbest. Idea. Ever.

  3. #4723
    Old God conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendulous View Post
    By the way, how many head to head contacts get people concussions on kickoffs, compared to wide receivers getting jacked by defenders on EVERY pass play? Where's those numbers to support the idea that killing kickoffs would make the game safer? Actually, how much better is a punt going to be if people are charging at a punt returner the same way?

    Dumbest. Idea. Ever.
    From a pure physics standpoint, the punt is much much safer. On a kick, there is no buffer to prevent guys from gaining speed. The kickoff guys and the return block guys start yards apart from each other and are going full bore before contact. On a punt, contact is being made to slow down guys at the line of scrimmage with the possible exception of the gunners if the team is lined up for an all out punt block. The only contact issue you really have on punts is when a guy is a fucking moron and doesn't fair catch while a free running gunner is coming right at him.

    This is slightly out dated, but it shows that kickoffs have a substantially higher rate of injury than any other play in the game. This was prior to last year's changes which already dramatically reduced the injuries on kickoffs.

  4. #4724
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by conscript View Post
    Lol no they wouldn't. That would never happen. Coaches are petrified of change
    but thats just it, change is thrust on them

    and teams that are always bad are bad for a reason, and you're naming one of the reasons, but for the non-incompetents, this is something you can more easily scheme for, a play to net 15 yards, rather than kick the thing and hope your guy comes out of the scrum with the ball, since it seemingly depends more on skill, coaches who believe they and their players possess that skill will be more inclined to go for it, especially when they know there's more skill on the offensive side of the ball than on the defensive

    what you're saying about QB rules is how I feel, in terms of priority, fix that shit then move on to the next thing, the game is broken, if you touch the guy's head trying to bat down a pass, its 15 yards, I don't want to watch a game where the QB gets to hide in some immunity bubble, so lets not add more weird rules when the fundamental game you are promoting, the passing game, is broken

    but these penalties do not crop up on onside kicks, there is much smaller risk of the referees critically interfering with such an important play, maybe I'm arguing minutiae, but like I said, thats my peeve, and such a major rules change would see plenty of scrutiny

  5. #4725
    The Chargers are finally firing Turner and Smith reportedly at the end of the season. This should've happened like how many years ago?

    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100...at-seasons-end

  6. #4726
    Fuck, Denver may not be able to waltz to a third division championship next year.

  7. #4727
    Old God conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wombinator04 View Post
    The Chargers are finally firing Turner and Smith reportedly at the end of the season. This should've happened like how many years ago?

    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100...at-seasons-end
    Remember that time the Chargers fired a coach coming off a 13-3 (14-2? i forget) season and then outside of one year the replacement coach made the team worse and worse every single season. Good times. I'll believe the Chargers are firing him when I see the story that he has been fired lol. This should have happened 2 years ago.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 07:06 PM ----------

    Dean Spanos came out and said the reports are completely false and that he hasn't shared his thoughts about Norv and Smith with anyone.

  8. #4728
    Immortal Vetali's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by conscript View Post
    Remember that time the Chargers fired a coach coming off a 13-3 (14-2? i forget) season and then outside of one year the replacement coach made the team worse and worse every single season. Good times. I'll believe the Chargers are firing him when I see the story that he has been fired lol. This should have happened 2 years ago.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 07:06 PM ----------

    Dean Spanos came out and said the reports are completely false and that he hasn't shared his thoughts about Norv and Smith with anyone.
    What? lol.

    Fucking getting my hopes up again. Norv Turners neck grosses me out.

  9. #4729
    Oh, yes. Please don't fire him!

  10. #4730
    The next rule change they should do is to change the extra point-2 point conversion. All extra points should now be 40 yd FGs and all 2 point conversions should be from the 5 yard line. This would make the play once again somewhat exciting rather than another boring automatic.

  11. #4731
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    and then they could scatter mines underneath the field at random, but QBs will have a censor in their helmet to prevent them going off of course

  12. #4732
    Old God conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    and then they could scatter mines underneath the field at random, but QBs will have a censor in their helmet to prevent them going off of course
    They are going to have a censor in their helmet? Is he going to be blacking out random parts of the field he finds offensive blocking the QBs vision or beeping out every curse word a player or coach yells out?

    That was a joke, but it came across like a grammar dick. Imma leave it anyways.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 08:15 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Jibjabb View Post
    The next rule change they should do is to change the extra point-2 point conversion. All extra points should now be 40 yd FGs and all 2 point conversions should be from the 5 yard line. This would make the play once again somewhat exciting rather than another boring automatic.
    I don't know about the 40, but I would be willing to compromise and say spot the ball at the 13 making it a 30 yarder.

  13. #4733
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    there's no such thing as a grammar joke, only grammar dicks

  14. #4734
    Old God conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    there's no such thing as a grammar joke, only grammar dicks
    Brutal.

    Denver is only up by 10 at the end of the 1st quarter with the ball in the red zone. Step it up Broncos. Manning is technically on pace for 600 yards in this game though.

  15. #4735
    Fucking pathetic. Broncos are doomed if they can't get touchdowns in the red zone.

  16. #4736
    Herald of the Titans Skarsguard's Avatar
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    Ehh Raiders I was listening to SVP today on the radio and they had a segment on that said if the raiders would have drafted the guy after their draft pick they would have gotten like Megatron,Fitzgerald,and Aaron Rogers god raiders suck for draft picking players.

  17. #4737
    Well it was a win and the Defense played great, but Jesus Christ. You can't go fucking 2/6 on touchdowns in the redzone against a defense like Oakland's. Denver may have a great record, but they do not look like a team that can contend with the Texans or Patriots.

  18. #4738
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    the Raiders aren't to blame for everything, they got a lot of praise when they drafted McClain and that hasn't worked out well either

    but the trouble is that most of the time they don't even have a pick, if only they had known that unstoppable Tebow steamroller was gonna take the division last year they could've saved a couple picks instead of blowing them on Palmer

    if you want to give them crap for anything, they had 2 first rounders in 2002, 17 and 23, Ed Reed went 24

    taking Fitz in 2004 would've been big too, they'd just lost Tim Brown and were about to lose Rice, having to rely on Jerry Porter is not a solid plan and that's went things started going south for them 2002-2004

  19. #4739
    Now that I think about it the NFL should take the XFL's Scramble to determine who gets possession. Its infinitely better than the damn coin flip which is purely luck and can cause teams to win or lose all because of its outcome (like what happened to my Bears this week)

    Confused what Im talking about? Take a look

    Id love to watch each team with a specialist for that in order to decide possession. Imagine the drama in overtime games.

  20. #4740
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    the first time they ever ran the scramble the guy got injured, I was tempted to jokingly suggest it because it is the DUMBEST FUCKING IDEA EVER

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