Destro Complexity

[Deleted]

Are you sure about that? Destro isn't difficult to play at all, maybe annoying, but not difficult. I doubt it's a l2p issue for him, if anything wouldn't that make it one for you?

I will be the first one to say that pulling off destruction perfectly in a busy encounter is VERY challenging for me, then again I am the kind of player that has a hard time allowing himself to miss even one stack of pyroclasm. I dont feel ashamed to try to squeeze out everything.
Difficult is the wrong word, surely. Engaging and sophisticated fits rather well though.

Certainly not annoying, It is crazy fun. Again, sounds like a l2p issue to me, I dont know.

everything in this game has to be seen relatively. And destruction is one of the more complex specs in the game, in fact warlocks as a whole offer one of the more unforgiving playstyles, quite a bit more difficult to pull off perfectly than most things in this game.

if you just roll with it, destro can be close to the faceroll it has been in the past.
Still, just just because you lack the ability - or the will - to play the spec at a certain level of perfection does not make it "easy" when used properly. That is why I call l2p issue here, which I admit sounds too harsh, and I probably did not mean it that way.
I took issue with the way he worded his opinion because it can mean only two things: Either improper use of the spec which disqualifies anyone from judging its complexity, or trying to make himself look good which really doesnt add anything at all to the discussion except making him look like a snooty d-bag.

[Deleted]

Just as a note, ISF does not benefit your pets cast time bc it does not give you 15% haste, it gives you 15% faster cast speed (look at the buff it gives you) I have around 1100 haste and with 3/3 dark arts my pet still has 1.59 cast time of Firebolt.

[nocturnus]

Always fun to see other locks laugh at destro and when they try it they can't get past the 11k mark while I'm pushing 18k sustained dps (with heroic hitcap).

Opinions are opinions but I can personally play affliction semi-afk with good numbers while I have to be glued to my screen to do insanely well as destro. Demo is a complete joke altogether ^^

For me destro is the moest challenging spec ingame and most definately the most fun lock spec.

Whoever claims destro = mage obviously never - ever, played mage before.

[Jenerena]

Always fun to see other locks laugh at destro and when they try it they can't get past the 11k mark while I'm pushing 18k sustained dps (with heroic hitcap).

Opinions are opinions but I can personally play affliction semi-afk with good numbers while I have to be glued to my screen to do insanely well as destro. Demo is a complete joke altogether ^^

For me destro is the moest challenging spec ingame and most definately the most fun lock spec.

Whoever claims destro = mage obviously never - ever, played mage before.

Everything about this post is arrogant. It just has 'I'm such an awesome player cos I can do 18k sustained damage with the most complex spec in-game' written all over it, and makes you look like a bit of an ass, to be honest.

[nocturnus]

Everything about this post is arrogant. It just has 'I'm such an awesome player cos I can do 18k sustained damage with the most complex spec in-game' written all over it, and makes you look like a bit of an ass, to be honest.

Why thank you very much! You do know that only very insecure people experience confident people as arrogant, right?

Your posts generally reek of incompetence, so I guess we're even.

[Euphoric]

Always fun to see other locks laugh at destro and when they try it they can't get past the 11k mark while I'm pushing 18k sustained dps (with heroic hitcap).

Opinions are opinions but I can personally play affliction semi-afk with good numbers while I have to be glued to my screen to do insanely well as destro. Demo is a complete joke altogether ^^

For me destro is the moest challenging spec ingame and most definately the most fun lock spec.

Whoever claims destro = mage obviously never - ever, played mage before.

SS or it doesn't happen.

[Vaez]

during heroism I spike to 18k pretty easily, I usually sit around 12-14k depending on the fight. I haven't reforged my gear for max heroic dps, ie spirit to a useful stat.

Destro is actually quite complex now. Weaving in ISF and corruption while maximizing backdraft is a challenge, but setup your ui with power auras or a timer and its not terrible to pin down. I'm pretty happy with the changes they've made, though I wouldn't mind if corruption was dropped from the rotation..it just feels wierd to use it in a fire spec.

[Euphoric]

during heroism I spike to 18k pretty easily, I usually sit around 12-14k depending on the fight. I haven't reforged my gear for max heroic dps, ie spirit to a useful stat.

Destro is actually quite complex now. Weaving in ISF and corruption while maximizing backdraft is a challenge, but setup your ui with power auras or a timer and its not terrible to pin down. I'm pretty happy with the changes they've made, though I wouldn't mind if corruption was dropped from the rotation..it just feels wierd to use it in a fire spec.

you're saying "spike to 18k"....he's claiming 18k sustained dps....big difference. Again I'll wait for superman to post his screenshot (unphotoshopped). But then again, sustained dps in a screenshot is impossible - so you know what - I'll just chalk it up to him being full of sh!t.

[Zoots]

Why thank you very much! You do know that only very insecure people experience confident people as arrogant, right?

Your posts generally reek of incompetence, so I guess we're even.

I'm not going to comment on your dps. However your posts typically you either directly insult the people you are replying to, or you make veiled insults while putting yourself on a pedestal of doing very good. Such things typically are bad ways to get your point across or be helpful, because it's human nature to react negatively to such tones of manner. It has nothing to do with insecurity.

[CJack14dt]

Always fun to see other locks laugh at destro and when they try it they can't get past the 11k mark while I'm pushing 18k sustained dps (with heroic hitcap).

Opinions are opinions but I can personally play affliction semi-afk with good numbers while I have to be glued to my screen to do insanely well as destro. Demo is a complete joke altogether ^^

For me destro is the moest challenging spec ingame and most definately the most fun lock spec.

Whoever claims destro = mage obviously never - ever, played mage before.

Confident people are admired because they are noticed while silent, arrogant people are hated because they need to proclaim.

[Drakhar]

Opinions are opinions but I can personally play affliction semi-afk with good numbers while I have to be glued to my screen to do insanely well as destro. Demo is a complete joke altogether ^^

Not sure if serious...

On topic though: I got bored of Destro reeeeaaall fast in WotLK, but I'm loving it now. Instead of that terribly stoic 4 button rotation, the addition of the SoulFire proc, Improved SoulFire, Shadowbolt debuff, Bane of Havoc, Corruption being viable, more CDs, and Soulburn earned Destro it's spot back for me.

[Jenerena]

Why thank you very much! You do know that only very insecure people experience confident people as arrogant, right?

Your posts generally reek of incompetence, so I guess we're even.

Your last point was only written to try to wind me up, but it failed. Besides, you were actually supporting my comments in the hit rating thread no? You made yourself look even more of an ass actually. Pointing out that someone is arrogant doesn't make that person insecure.

You're just full of ****, basically. Stop digging yourself into a hole. You only say demo/affliction are a joke/too easy so you can big yourself up for doing so well with destro. If it wasn't that way, you wouldn't say anything.

[nocturnus]

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B2K...Y2U5OTdj&hl=en

I'm not putting myself on a pedestal. I state facts, that's simply what I do. Think I'm an ass? Fine. I'm a well informed ass though.

English isn't hard, you could've notices I said FOR ME demo is a joke and aff a faceroll. Feel free to disagree. Jen I still think most of your threads are ignorant. Stop assuming stuff and do some research. You can continue calling me arrogant and shedding your disbelief on the numbers I say I do, but at least, you'll be well informed. This counts for everyone.

Oh btw, We didn't have the whelps on that kill but the 2 (imo) hardest dragons. So no aoe.

[Aristeides]

Well: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/3...?s=5737&e=5988

I agree that Destruction has gained a lot of subtlety in Cataclysm and I find it interesting to play though I still prefer the feel of Affliction and will continue to main spec it. IMO Affliction is not a faceroll (and neither is Demo for that matter but I can't speak from personal experience) and with ISF is on par in terms of complexity as Destruction. Find the specs that suit your playstyle and work to master them. They each have something different to offer and I appreciate that.

[Boyiee]

Yeah I'm not sure why anyone is questioning DPS. It's pretty easy in 5mans to do 14k+ dps on bosses, dont you think with full raid buffs that number could be a little higher? However, there is no reason for anyone to be jerkoffs.

[Byronorpheus]

Well: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/3...?s=5737&e=5988

I agree that Destruction has gained a lot of subtlety in Cataclysm and I find it interesting to play though I still prefer the feel of Affliction and will continue to main spec it. IMO Affliction is not a faceroll (and neither is Demo for that matter but I can't speak from personal experience) and with ISF is on par in terms of complexity as Destruction. Find the specs that suit your playstyle and work to master them. They each have something different to offer and I appreciate that.

Heya, small time poster here, I just had a question about the graph there. It has your number one dps ability (37.5%) listed as "Other". Is this a boss mechanic or just a glitch in the log or what?

Also, decidedly happy to see most people not taking the asshole bit lying down. Knew there was a reason I liked these boards.

As to destro's complexity. ISF is probably the biggest "new" slice of the pie. Well that and the bane system, it's hard to grind out the difference between a bane and a curse after four years >.> . I'd say slightly more complex than wrath but... still interesting and rewarding.

[Buf]

I thought DS was bugged too until I read the tooltip more carefully. It's for increased critical _damage_ so with entry level stats our terrible crit rates mean that chances of burning through the charges by critting are rather low. Also note that it only affects cast time spells ie. Soul Fire, Incinerate, Shadow Bolt, Chaos Bolt.

On topic though, I'm finding destro's complexity much more enjoyable than Wrath. There's various cds and DoTs to keep track of and coordinating all of them is a welcome challenge. It kinda does bring back the nostalgia of early wrath Aff rotations and it's rewarding when done well.

As for my rotation I usually open with:
CoE>CoD>Soul Fire (hard cast)>Immolate>Corruption (to fill in the delay til Conflag)> Conflag > Chaos Bolt > Incinerate filler.

From there my priorities are:
Maintaining Immolate (via Fel Flame) > Maintaining ISF > Conflag > Shadow Flame (if in range) > CoD (without clipping) > Corruption (between 2nd last and last ticks) > Chaos Bolt > Incinerate

I try to fit in Shadowflame by moving towards the mobs while casting instants - the Coe>CoD and Corr>Conflag opening parts are good opportunities to continue edging closer. Also try to use Fel Flame for extending Immolate right after cast time spells sub ~5 secs and most importantly before hard Soul Fire casts (when SBurn is on CD) if it looks like Immo will expire very close to SF being cast.

When moving a lot from beams etc going nuts with Fel Flames when other instants are on CD help with ensuring that when I can stop again Immo's duration is less of a concern for that much longer (max duration is still 15 secs though!)

refresing your immolate with just fel flames is a huge loss of dps and a gcd the dps from immo is well worth the recast.the only time fel flame should be used is when on the move and you can't stop to keep the buff up. I would also say sb sf to start because the haste buff is up that much longer and you have higher burst. and Shadowflame is good to use if you don't have to move to use it. Using corr and fel flames to justify moving is just a waste of mana. Destro is not hard per say, but i think it was made alot more interesting. Unfortunatly just like all the other expansions, once gear gets higher affliction will take over for top spec. But for the moment Destro rules!

[Aristeides]

Heya, small time poster here, I just had a question about the graph there. It has your number one dps ability (37.5%) listed as "Other". Is this a boss mechanic or just a glitch in the log or what?

That is an idiosyncrasy of the way the world of logs displays ability breakdowns in the tooltip view. Here is the expanded view of the abilities I used: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/3...?s=5737&e=5988. "Other" in this case is a catchall for the other sources of damage in the fight (ie Shadowfury, the direct hit portion of Shadowflame, Burning Embers, etc.)

[Byronorpheus]

Ok, thanks for clearing it up. I'm not typically that boned up on that type of log. Given the metric ton of shit we do, should be expected.

Also, just another bit too since someone was kind enough to remind me about the "Demon Soul" tooltip-

Mine also says (Or at least I hallucinated it drunkenly one night) that it only boosts the critical strike damage bonus of "Destruction Spells you Cast that have cast times". Which really nerfs its utility quite a bit. I think *that* may be a bug more than anything, because that means the bonus would ONLY apply itself to hard immolate refreshes, chaos bolt, incinerate, and hard soul fire reapplications. I'm not even sure at the moment if it can trigger off of an instant cast soul fire given by Soul Burn or Empowered Imp.

Edit: Just logged in to verify- Indeed it reads "... the critical damage bonus of cast time destruction spells".

I'd need some hardcore verification on the other stuff that I listed, but that means it's pretty much ONLY going to trigger off of CB or Incin crits. And it's a HUGE dps loss if you happen to crit with Immolate refresh with it up.

[Zaros]

People who say they are pulling 15k+ dps can you please link armories. I'm pulling aruond 9 - 11k dps on most raid bosses and 12k on Heroic bosses. (I am 1% (Raid buffed) below hitcap and gearing up as we speak.) I'd love to see what kind of stats you've got to pull these kind of numbers.

I was unaware of the corruption inclusion in our rotation and feel very ashamed but other than that i don't think that counts for 4k dps haha.. Thanks guys

*Edit* Armory included: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...elzaros/simple

Wand/Trinkets just havn't had any luck whatsoever.