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  1. #1

    Healing - Does Cata want all healers to change specs? Priest's especially!

    Hello MMO community,

    I am writing this post to just release some anger and the urge to respec to shadow, and just see generally if anyone else is feeling the same way. (Especially the priests)

    When Cataclysm mechanics were annouced I was very happy to hear that it would be going back to the idea of "regen" being an issue, to the point where mana pools had to be watched, Mana potions were your best friend and you were not ending fights on above 90% mana. Was very happy and decided to roll my priest in my guild for Cataclysm.

    I leveled to 85 and now, I HATE IT. Why did blizzard think that it would be a good idea to increase our mana costs by 8 times, increase our mana pools by about 40%, but keep our heals the same as they were in WotLK, with a tiny SP increase. Then they added hp doubling and tripling in some cases and then put up the damage of mechanics by 3 times. We, as healers, have to pay for every mistake that the DPS/tanks make and it is just stupid. A dps stands in the fire(which in WotLK should be the thing people have learnt not to do >.<") we have to heal them but with our terrible mana costs and low mana pools / regen make this stupid, we then have to worry about the tank getting owned and us going oom. If we have to heal a DPS, then the tank is taking a lot of damage and we might have to resort to "emergency spells" that have quick casts and HUGE mana costs. Blizzards answer, oh just don't heal the DPS, reality of this happening, they die we wipe because dps is not high enough.

    I played my priest in WotLK and admittly regen then was, lets just say not a completely important thing, but at least then, our healing was effective. Now my mana efficient heal is healing for less then 10% of the tanks hp. My heal doesn't actually heal, it just reduces the amount of damage coming in basically. (i.e 9k hit on tank, 7.5k heal within that time you have 1.5k damage on the tank) but there is no actual healing going on. This gets even worse when they get hit hard by a mechanic of a boss or something along those lines and then you have to cast bigger heals, which still heal for crap all but just use 10% of your mana pool to do so. This is just silly.

    The amount of heroics I do where we wipe because of DPS failing is just terrible to, because if they make mistakes we cannot heal them or we go oom so then we have to let them die / something has to be sacrificed. Then blizzard decide to make healing classes terribly unbalanced. A conversation with a guild paladin went like this the other day:

    Paladin: Lol healing is fine, regen is good, I love healing.
    Me: For priests it is terrible, regen is crap and healing just becomes such a chore.
    Paladin: Pfft, your probably just playing it wrong, you know you have to use mana efficient spells right?
    Me: I am not an idiot. Of course I do, but it just is not enough. Regen is still terrible.
    Paladin: Link me your spells and I will compare them to mine.
    Me: How is it going...? *thinks to myself, he is playing the most OP healing class ATM >.>"*
    Paladin: Oh wow dude, your spells costs 20% more mana then mine and heal for 20% less then mine.
    Me: Well that explains why I keep getting kicked in heroics for Paladins....
    Me: Umm what is your mana pool?
    Paladin: 82k
    Me: *inspects gear* Wtf!, i have a 2% extra mana meta gem you dont, i have way better gear then you and you still have 10k more mana then me.
    Paladin: Hmmm, I wondered why everyone was complaining guess Paladins are just the best healers....
    Me: /facepalm *runs to the priest trainer to go shadow* >.>"

    After this took place I saw a thread on here I believe about the most OP healers and guess what it was Pallys on top and Priests on the bottom, but a post then caught my eye and it basically said, "Well when you give my paladin a glyph so that 20% of my heals cost no mana cost and another move WoG that does 20% of my healing that requires no mana, you kind of have to expect us to heal better then most classes." Yes, My head hit the desk....

    Point I cannot seem to understand here, is how did Blizzard thing for a moment that this was fair on healers? Because I can tell you being an average item lvl of around 340 I am STRUGGLING to complete a heroic each day, it is really stupid. Also to people who say "do guild runs and it would be easy" not everyone has the luxury of being about to go into guild runs, or having guildies on at the time they can spare to do heroics. Also why would a guild take me when the holy pally wants to go >.>"

    I really am over Cataclysm healing already and it has been a week.... This is really sad and I think it needs to be fixed up asap. Buff Spirit regen. buff our heals as priests, and make mechanics for dps 1 shot the morons, not oom the healer so the healer looks bad.

    Just did a heroic ToT before I completed this, I get in at the first boss, we pull, tank is up fine, everything fine, adds come out, dps start ccing then attack the cc, then breaking it and what do you know within 5-10 seconds the whole group is dead. 25 wipes later and 300g worth of repairs we get the instance done and I can go away and be happy with my 70 valor points. Only problem is, we needed 4 kicks, an average ilvl over 340 from most people, 300g, 25 wipes, 2 hours and I got no drops, so now I have to do this over again to try and get an upgrade. Spent 8 hours heroicing yesterday for no upgrades. Healing In cataclysm fun, WHAT WHERE YOU THINKING BLIZZARD!

    Anywayz see what the MMO community thinks, if you agreed by all means put a comment, if you dont agree and are just going to say stupid things that are "ideal situations" or "get better people" dont bother replying on it, Also if you are a pally and say "healing is fine" You have just proved this post so dont bother either.

    I am sure I cannot be the only one feeling this way, and now I am stuck, do I really wanna play this broken class/role in Cataclysm or do I play another class/role and enjoy the game? Will it get better I do not know, will Blizzard fix it, wait Blizzard fixes things? So I am torn between what I want to play and the enjoyment and sanity I want when playing World of Warcraft.

    Kind Regards,

    Nisroc =]

    TL;DR: Why are healers being punished so much, buff the healers like priests who are just so stupidly effected by the changes, at the end of the day, regen isfine, but if you have appropriate gear, use the correct stratergies then the only thing holding you back shouldn't be because priests are going oom to fast because of overblow mana costs and terrible regen mechanics.
    Last edited by Niscroc; 2010-12-14 at 10:07 AM.

  2. #2
    I have done heroics now both as a paladin healer and priest healer (disc), it is indeed harder now but I have noticed a few things.

    I've done some runs with the guild and these have been smooth, then I have done some with randoms and these have really been a mixed bag. Some have gone well while some the DPS or tank fails in different ways which means you will run out of mana quickly. For me it also took some time to adjust and change the way I healed and thought about healing.

    While it can be annoying at times I have to say that I like the changes, part of the problem is that people got used to a cruise mode in Wrath, where it didn't really mattered how you healed or how much overhealing you did. With time it will get better, getting a few epics will also help.

  3. #3
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    As a tank I have to say that I don't mind having a priest heal me they seem to do a fine job, I do however notice that there mana pools are on the low end and they have to drink more than some other healers I've run with. My suggestion to you is if you like being a healing priest (whether you are holy or disc) is stick with it... Cata has only been out a week and I'm sure tons of bug fixes and tuning are incoming you just need to be patient.

  4. #4
    I have 2 healing priests as friends, and they are complaining as well.
    Mana costs are really, really high in comparison to the heals you throw out. Its like you heal for the same amound as 80..

    Altho, they did managed to keep their mana higher, when they werent spamming everyone to full hp everytime, and just put some hots on who need it.
    I think they aint complaining now anymore, only after running with our other friend (resto druid) who was barely below 80% mana (in shit gear) they did complain again :P

  5. #5
    Yes. I believe all the points so far have been very valid ones. I believe that this has all effected the way I have seen the priest as a healer. Dps making terrible mistakes is not fun as a healer in general, i just find we pay so badly for it now.

    I think Blizzard need to do something about this because I am just gearing up because my guild needs me, not because I am having fun, i want to have fun in WoW again during this expansion, not be worse of then in WotlK were boredom levels repeatly doing icc hit over 9000.

    Priests do seem crap compared to every other healer at the moment quite badly Yes.

  6. #6
    Deleted
    Think someone only played wotlk and not tbc...

  7. #7
    Deleted
    Well tbh i like how your first comparison is against a paladin rather than say a druid.

    Paladin healing at the moment isn't OP, Priest's at the moment need to be sorted out and buffed to bring them on par. Yes i am a Paladin, Yes I am Holy and No I don't think were OP now, I actually think for once blizz hit quite a nice balance for us. Were still strong single target but we do have a few AoE heals.

    As I have said Priest's I think need a boost.

    There is also the thing of getting used to "not" having everyone at 100% health all the time, which is rather awkward as a healer.

  8. #8
    You have to realize that you're doing heroics. While being 2 weeks into a new expansion. They're supposed to be HEROIC. They're supposed to be HARD. There is no reason whatsoever to compare WotLK faceroll-heroics with the Cataclysm heroics.
    Everybody is supposed to give 110%, with CC, tanking cooldowns, healing cooldowns. That's just the way it works when you're running heroics. Deal with it, you can't expect to finish an HEROIC instance within 8 minutes like you used to.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Nremron View Post
    Think someone only played wotlk and not tbc...
    No, I have played since Vanilla so you can just throw that one out the window. As for the other comment, thank you for being a reasonable paladin healer. Yes you are correct it may not be a case of Paladins being OP as much as priests needing to be brought up to par. Saying this, paladins are OP compared to priests but whether they buff priests or reduce other heals i dont mind, just make it balanced to make it more fun again.

    ---------- Post added 2010-12-14 at 09:03 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Njay View Post
    You have to realize that you're doing heroics. While being 2 weeks into a new expansion. They're supposed to be HEROIC. They're supposed to be HARD. There is no reason whatsoever to compare WotLK faceroll-heroics with the Cataclysm heroics.
    Everybody is supposed to give 110%, with CC, tanking cooldowns, healing cooldowns. That's just the way it works when you're running heroics. Deal with it, you can't expect to finish an HEROIC instance within 8 minutes like you used to.

    I clearly did not say anything about the fact that WotLK heroics should be like these, niether did i say that I wanted them to be done in 8 minutes, so I do not know why you are saying these random numbers and ideas and trying to impliment them negatively towards what I am saying seeing that they are made up and therefore void. Going oom when I am using Shadowfiend, and Hymn of hope and the like is not very balanced. Also yes they are heroics, but seeing that Blizzard suggested 333 ilvl for heroics and lets you in at 329 ilvl and I am 340 i should not be struggling to complete one everyday. Please think before you post,

    thank you.

  10. #10

    Shammy PoV

    From a shaman's point of view, mana managment is painful at the moment, if water shield drops off without noticing you are screwed, if not running with a pally for might then we loose our most efficient heal, not to mention loosing resistances which means that the heal is even more needed. Having to drink after every pull doesn't exactly enamor the rest of the group to us.

    I have no freedom in what talents I choose, instant cast ghost wolf is so tempting but I need those points in the resto tree.

    However, the biggest problem is iLevel boosting for tanks, go into a heroic with a tank wearing half greens but can still get in because they have cloth blues hiding in their bag is a sign things aren't going to work out well. Add in the impatient DPS who are starting to make it into heroics and the run will break up its just a matter of how far you can get before it does. Also the delay between a DPS standing in fire and the healer going OOM means it's very hard to make the DPS understand that something they did a couple of minutes ago is why we wiped.

    I'm going to keep healing, it's what I have done since vanilla, but it is damn frustrating. A couple of tweaks and I'd be happy, maybe a glyph for water shield that stops the last orb from being triggered so you don't loose the passive mana part as it keeps falling off but when it is on one orb you can't get procs from heals or being hit.

    I guess better gear will help until then I might have to avoid PuGs which is a shame.

  11. #11
    Deleted
    OP could do with a TLDR lol

  12. #12
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    I agree that priests are one of the worst healers atm, though i still love the healing. I actually thought of respeccing to shadow because healing was way to easy in Wotlk, but now with the challenge im in love again,sadly this is not the case for all of us:/

    Just have to point out, that the manapool and manaregen cannot be compared to Wotlk yet, since none have full raid gear with enchants/gems.

  13. #13
    Deleted
    i play a preist mostly for pvp but if guild is running an alt raid i will chuck her in, Hai just wanted to chuck my tuppence worth in to the pool, they are saying these changes are to make healers do more rather than just spam there highest quickest heal errrr was that not pallys doing this during Wotlk? so now the whole community has to suffer for holydin nubness. now i cast my mind back to patch 4.1 was it when the shall we say slight changes happened to most classes but not a gr8 deal except it seemed finally that blizz had finally brought holydins into line. check forums 48 hours later 150 pages of posts pallys qq'ing like a bunch of nubs, hence 12 hours later they got major boosts inc. and have been loling since all other healer classes i think at that point were thinking no real probs here until they dinged 85 it seems

    my perspective on pre cata raiding as a holy healer, now they say Because peeps jus spam there highest quickest heal pallys maybe but my preist flash heal never came up within the top 3 healing abilities usually went:
    CoH> PoM > PoH > then Flash Heal !! this was my analysis of my last raid icc 10 as my preist pre cata 2 tier 9 for mending, 2 bit tier 10 i think 5400 gs 7k hps Using every heal in my arsenal at the right time place etc. armory is down at the moment so cant link my char.
    not tried my preist in cata due to having to work away during the week and zerging my main Dk tonk/dps to 85 last weekend.. but tbh reading from the many posts i have been reading i dont think there will be much point in playing her . thats me tuppence guys
    WTB moar qq lets get qqing like the holydins

    and here we go nubbadins try to defend themselves well after doing about 15 pug runs last weekend the only healer class who managed to keep my grps up all the time without going oom was erm pallys yeh thats right.
    Last edited by mmoc50bf40230e; 2010-12-14 at 10:13 AM. Reason: pally nubb holydins

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Dungfish View Post
    OP could do with a TLDR lol
    Done Hope it helps :P

  15. #15
    Deleted
    If you heal that baddie standing in the fire then yer dumb as fuck..
    let the bastard die so he can L2 not stand in the bloody fires..

    and if you QQ about wiping then go play minesweeper..
    YER SUPPOSED TO WIPE DAMNIT!!

    but yeah... mana costs are ALOT higher and you dont heal for anymore than you did in wrath EVEN with more Spell power now.
    the amount of healing you do should be buffed to the extreme.. as a resto druid I dont heal for anymore than I did in wrath.. and even tho I have a pala tank I have a hard time keeping him up at time due to him havinh 120k health and me only healing for about 27k with healing touch..
    15k with Nourish ( if I get a lucky crit heal ). and I always keep lifebloom on him only letting it slip if he loses health to fast but even then i have to oom using healing touch to save him..

    and no.. as a healer now you job aint to keep everyone at 100% like it was in wrath your job is to keep people alive ( yes even that can be hard )

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Mishnara View Post
    If you heal that baddie standing in the fire then yer dumb as fuck..
    let the bastard die so he can L2 not stand in the bloody fires..

    and if you QQ about wiping then go play minesweeper..
    YER SUPPOSED TO WIPE DAMNIT!!

    but yeah... mana costs are ALOT higher and you dont heal for anymore than you did in wrath EVEN with more Spell power now.
    the amount of healing you do should be buffed to the extreme.. as a resto druid I dont heal for anymore than I did in wrath.. and even tho I have a pala tank I have a hard time keeping him up at time due to him havinh 120k health and me only healing for about 27k with healing touch..
    15k with Nourish ( if I get a lucky crit heal ). and I always keep lifebloom on him only letting it slip if he loses health to fast but even then i have to oom using healing touch to save him..

    and no.. as a healer now you job aint to keep everyone at 100% like it was in wrath your job is to keep people alive ( yes even that can be hard )
    To the first bit of what you said, yes but a lot of fights if you let dps die, you dont down bosses because it slows the fight down dramatically and then you go oom so much quicker :P

    Second part, I dont mind wipes, but not because the fact healers are just pathetically underbuffed (well apparently paladins are fine) and because we go oom way to quickly.

    Third part, yep, this is what i find stupid.

  17. #17

    Totally agree

    Man i am right there with you. I am a holy healing priest, have been since BC. I am enjoying how fights are difficult now, but every point u made is right, everything is based on healers ( 95% of every fight is reliant on healing ). My heal doesn't even do 10% of the tanks health, only way i can heal a decent amount above the damage being taken is to use our "oh shit" heal which is flash, and that costs as you pointed out, a SIGNIFICANT amount of our mana. I agree in every aspect, even with chacra to help balance it, we are insanely undertuned at the moment, and seeing as how druids and paladins (mainly paladins) as hybrid (utility) class's are out healing us/ healing easier then as as a class that was specifically designed to heal, i feel we are in need of a definate buff! Good post man, agree 100% .


    Also as a note to other replies, i can't speak for OP but i personally do not mind wiping in heroics at all, i find it rather interesting to have to actually bust my ass in fights (as should everyone). But what OP is trying to say, is if every tard doesn't know what he is doing, we fail as a result of their incompetence. Take the first boss in heroic SFK (forgot name, sorry). As a healer i should ONLY be healing the tank, i put down a well for the dps to help em when they need, but if the dps don't interupt correctly, or something is mis-timed and they don't use the well, then i am forced to use a heal such as circle of healing, now why not a majorly big deal, that fight is so INSANELY dependent on healers on the end (last 20%) that any lil bit of mana wasted out of place is the end, a few unneeded heals burn just enough mana so when 20% comes and he is aoeing the group, i barly have enough mana to heal everyone once with my flash, which is really required in that phase due to the high damage. (especially if it was mistimed and couldn't top everyone up b4 hand).
    Last edited by Wuteverdude; 2010-12-14 at 10:18 AM.

  18. #18
    I was disc when I first hit 85, I hated it.. but I am now holy and i've finally grasped mana management. My mana regen is wonderful now, to the point where people in the group compliment my healing and gasp at my mana regen. I dont' mean to sound self absorbed but it really is just a gear issue.

  19. #19
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by marukale View Post
    From a shaman's point of view, mana managment is painful at the moment, if water shield drops off without noticing you are screwed, if not running with a pally for might then we loose our most efficient heal, not to mention loosing resistances which means that the heal is even more needed. Having to drink after every pull doesn't exactly enamor the rest of the group to us.

    I have no freedom in what talents I choose, instant cast ghost wolf is so tempting but I need those points in the resto tree.

    However, the biggest problem is iLevel boosting for tanks, go into a heroic with a tank wearing half greens but can still get in because they have cloth blues hiding in their bag is a sign things aren't going to work out well. Add in the impatient DPS who are starting to make it into heroics and the run will break up its just a matter of how far you can get before it does. Also the delay between a DPS standing in fire and the healer going OOM means it's very hard to make the DPS understand that something they did a couple of minutes ago is why we wiped.

    I'm going to keep healing, it's what I have done since vanilla, but it is damn frustrating. A couple of tweaks and I'd be happy, maybe a glyph for water shield that stops the last orb from being triggered so you don't loose the passive mana part as it keeps falling off but when it is on one orb you can't get procs from heals or being hit.

    I guess better gear will help until then I might have to avoid PuGs which is a shame.
    get poer auras dude to tell you when your shield is dropping off

  20. #20
    From a resto druid's PoV I can say:
    Druid isn't even better. I'm in Ilvl 325 gear and go non-heroics every day, but I get oom on every pull and need to drink, just because of too high mana costs and low-healing spells.
    Blizz just needs to fix a few things, before playing a healer can be fun again.

    My opinion on this...
    EU-Aegwynn (A):
    [Emkáy] - 85 Night Elf ♀ Druid (Resto / Feral(Cat)) - mainchar
    [Emkàý] - 85 Gnome ♂ Mage (Fire / Frost)
    [Êmkay] - 85 Dwarf ♂ Warrior (Prot / Fury)

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