Cataclysm World First Kills, Wowstead, Hotfixes, Launch Videos, Trial, Blue Posts

[bloodwine77]

Real men raid 25 man raids.

You keep telling yourself that. There is no individual skill difference between 10-man and 25-man raids. The only real difference is that there are higher odds of mouth-breathers in a 25-man raid and you have to manage them. Hell, the joke back during the days of 40-man raiding is that it took just as long to form and setup the raid as it does to actually work on the content.

In simpler terms, 25-man raids are only harder in the sense that you have more people to manage and more points of failure.

Personally, I've retired from 25-man raiding and prefer to do 10-man raiding with a smaller group of like-minded, fun people and there is a lot less drama and issues because usually everybody is on the same page.

In the end, WoW is a social game. Some people might prefer running with bigger packs while others might prefer smaller cliques.

[critch]

On a side note I'm surprised none of resident conspiracy theorists have jumped in yet to declaim the horror of MMO-Champ advertising a new Curse service on the front page. Surely someone must believe this is the end of the world and that it's clearly the first step to MMO-champ just becoming a giant page full of ads? Come on guys, entertain me :-)

There'd probably be some kind of outcry if they had linked to a website that, you know, worked.

[Sneek]

Real men raid 25 man raids.

real man raided 40 man raids

There are no real man in wow anymore

[smokii]

tbh i'd be a lot more impressed if they hadn't cleared all this content on the beta - why did blizz think it was a good idea to have hard mode raid testing on the beta?

seems like the only real challenge for these top flight guilds is going to be sinestra

[Deleted]

Until someone who cleared both 10 and 25 men confirm that their difficulty is exactly the same, I will still assume that 25 is harder than 10 (OS3D was an exception in WotLK).

[Shawnacee]

Wow. to the videos. O.o lol. I thought i was into the game too much but I dont know if its a good think or bad thing im not THAT obsessed with it. lol.

[Kuja]

Until someone who cleared both 10 and 25 men confirm that their difficulty is exactly the same, I will still assume that 25 is harder than 10 (OS3D was an exception in WotLK).

Sounds simple enough. 25 has 15 more people and even if one of them fails at boss tactics, it's often a wipe for the entire group. So more players, more chances of failing. And usually some people have crap dps and those aren't chosen for 10 mans

[Shinshiva]

25 mans are for mouth breathers that only want loot. If you cared about lore and shit you wouldn't give a damn how big your group was: you'd still be having fun.

[Granyala]

As a guess they nerfed it. Those were particularly difficult add packs without a lot of CC. Not impossible, but fairly difficult. We wiped on them a couple times in a Random that was overall quite good and cleared the rest of the instance with minimal wipes, we just had limited CC.

Why? Pact of Darkness can be interrupted (at least on normal, don't know about heroics). Absolutely no normal mode 5man needs any CC anyway...

[wigg1es]

Hey look. There's still no one caring about world firsts. Stop wasting front page space.

[Scot]

You keep telling yourself that. There is no individual skill difference between 10-man and 25-man raids. The only real difference is that there are higher odds of mouth-breathers in a 25-man raid and you have to manage them. Hell, the joke back during the days of 40-man raiding is that it took just as long to form and setup the raid as it does to actually work on the content.

In simpler terms, 25-man raids are only harder in the sense that you have more people to manage and more points of failure.

Personally, I've retired from 25-man raiding and prefer to do 10-man raiding with a smaller group of like-minded, fun people and there is a lot less drama and issues because usually everybody is on the same page.

In the end, WoW is a social game. Some people might prefer running with bigger packs while others might prefer smaller cliques.

You can go ahead and keep believing that because Blizzard tells you to. I SERIOUSLY doubt that 10 and 25 man can ever be tuned to the exact same difficulty. I like that they share loot because I really don't have time/the desire/patience to deal with 24 other people making stupid mistakes, but I don't delude myself into thinking that they actually are the same difficulty. 25 mans are what competitive raiding guilds should be doing.

[fangless]

You keep telling yourself that. There is no individual skill difference between 10-man and 25-man raids.

stuff

Tell me with a straight face that 10m LK was as difficult as 25m. You can't, because it isn't true. Many portions of the fight were basically not an issue with less people.

The entire challenge of raids is trying to get people to minimize points of failure. Boss mechanics take maybe 5 minutes to learn and execute. But to get everyone to do their task IS the challenge. So, naturally, more people = harder to do said task without someone screwing up. Then there are situations like 25m LK, where the mechanics of the fight are different when you're in the 25m version. Valkryies are pathetic in 10m, as there's one single target. No need to group up at all which can be tough when you're doing it near a defile timer. That part of the fight is not challenging anymore, and it makes the two versions completely different.

-shrug-

People continue to say that the smaller raid group is the better raid group. Eventually we'll end up with 3 player raids. EXCITING.

[Kepi]

the only reason Ensidia is even doing 10m is because they know paragon would have been in the for front of the progression and they just didnt want to get showed up. In any case there is no reason why a competitive raiding guild should even be doing 10m progression especially one with the caliber ensidia claims to be.

[Doctus]

Tell me with a straight face that 10m LK was as difficult as 25m. You can't, because it isn't true. Many portions of the fight were basically not an issue with less people.

The entire challenge of raids is trying to get people to minimize points of failure. Boss mechanics take maybe 5 minutes to learn and execute. But to get everyone to do their task IS the challenge. So, naturally, more people = harder to do said task without someone screwing up. Then there are situations like 25m LK, where the mechanics of the fight are different when you're in the 25m version. Valkryies are pathetic in 10m, as there's one single target. No need to group up at all which can be tough when you're doing it near a defile timer. That part of the fight is not challenging anymore, and it makes the two versions completely different.

-shrug-

People continue to say that the smaller raid group is the better raid group. Eventually we'll end up with 3 player raids. EXCITING.

Fang - You're right of course, but that expansion is over. Its in the past. This a new game now with new direction.

[TaanSpot]

And Paragon takes the lead!! Heroic: Omnotron is down!

[DrgnDancer]

Why? Pact of Darkness can be interrupted (at least on normal, don't know about heroics). Absolutely no normal mode 5man needs any CC anyway...

It can be interrupted on Heroic too, but the first pull in the instance has two of those guys, plus one of the fire throwers (who cast WAY more often than the cool down on any class' interrupts). You can only interrupt so many things, and there are a lot of things to interrupt. Like I said it's not impossible, but it's quite challenging. Pact of Darkness ticks for 20K-25K AOE on Heroic, the fireballs hit for around 20K-25K (and even with all interrupts on that guy he's going to get some fireballs off, let alone assigning two people to the Darkcasters). At least a tick of Pact is going to get off no matter how quick you are... Anyway, we got it, but it took several tries to get all the pieces in place, so I rather doubt they buffed it.

[Karot]

Actually, it's easier to carry people in 25-mans. More hands to "share the load". "Real men", as someone so eloquently put it, are not 25-man raiders, as if the size of your raid determines your value as a person. (Yeah, you forgot about the women.) The simple fact is, that you raid whatever the f*** you like to raid, whichever is more fun for you. Neither one is "better" or "more challenging". From my personal experience, the only challenges to 25-man raiding are filling the spots with competent, like-minded players that you don't need to hold hands with and carry through the content. Oh, and staying connected and running on a slow machine are pretty annoying hurdles. 10-mans are more friendly, more close-knit, and everyone HAS to pull their weight. From what I've experienced, there's little to no drama over loot, and it's easier to find mistakes and correct them. Wiping on 10-man is fun. Wiping on 25-man is a headache. Just my two copper, take it or leave it as you will.

[Deleted]

Hey look. There's still no one caring about world firsts. Stop wasting front page space.

yea actually a lot of people on mmo champion care about world first so please stop wasting "commentar-space"

[bajerman]

"0:10 of first vid" Is it just me or does Mike Morhaime look like a hobbit?

[Siorra]

Those vids were pretty epic, all those people cheering and stuff .. and nice that Mike plays the guitar

He's actually the bassist for the Tauren Chieftains (or whatever their crazy name is now)

Also, anyone else find those videos kinda cringe worthy? I'm as geeky as the next WoW player over, but something about nerd-gatherings that make me feel a little ashamed of myself. :P