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  1. #21
    I'll take "Reliably breaks fear when I need it" over "Might break fear if it ever gets around to it" any day of the week. This change is something even the high and mighty "PRO" shamans should understand.

    Wanting a mechanic (read GIMMICK) where you have to "Creatively" hide a totem is absurd. What's more, it prevents you from using other just as useful totems. Long live Earthbind

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Turbodymoman View Post
    You gotta be kidding me, how do you want to stop a priest or affli lock from blowing your totem up and fearing you the same second? Great locks or priests can, bads won't even try to melee tremor down. So it's actually a great buff for 'pros'.
    you know, when you see them raising their hand to wand it, or walking up to hit to melee it, it is a good sign that they're gonna stomp your totem. a good shaman can replant totems right before they're destroyed. i can guarantee you it's done fast redropping your totem set than it is for your enemy to go for the next stomp.

    i've did my part in a 2k+ 3s team and plyed many fear teams. it happened not rarely that i still got feared, and stayed in it. sometimes because my totem was to far away, or not getting me out of the fear in time, sometimes i could not react fast enough. but in general i was able to break out of more than one fear/minute.

    so for a really good shaman, it's a major nerf.

    if blizz really insists on putting this dump change through, they should make tremor unattackable and reduce the cd to (at least) 45 seconds, or better, 30.
    another sollution would be to make a new cooldown, allowing us to use a call of the spirits/ancients/elements while cc'd/stunned.
    i wouldn't mind a separate ability with a 2 minute cooldown doing what they to give us. if tremor is to strong, add a (little) cooldown like 5-10 seconds, but give it decent health, 20k or something.

    and in terms of hard counters: purge or tremor are not more op than any cc with no cd (fear/poly/tornado), long stuns, immunity's against anything (seal of freedom, bubble, iceblock, shapeshifting ) long disarm effects (10 seconds), spellsteal, stealth or new undispellable earth shield.

    to those who say tremor/purge are op, tend to forget their op abilities, and take them for granted.
    Last edited by Omanley; 2011-01-15 at 01:41 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angoth
    I'm sorry that Blizzard won't just gift wrap awesome in a cup and let you drink your fill.

  3. #23
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    you know, when you see them raising their hand to wand it, or walking up to hit to melee it, it is a good sign that they're gonna stomp your totem. a good shaman can replant totems right before they're destroyed. i can guarantee you it's done fast redropping your totem set than it is for your enemy to go for the next stomp.
    My god. Just wait for tremor to pulse, then fear and destroy the totem? You won't be able to do anything even with those whole 'reflexes of a good shaman'. Whole argument over a moot point. Pro opponent level by the way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    so for a really good shaman, it's a major nerf.
    Sure. Read above.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    if blizz really insists on putting this dump change through, they should make tremor unattackable and reduce the cd to (at least) 45 seconds, or better, 30.
    Unnecessary. If you got feared once, you won't get feared twice. If you do, you're doing something wrong. Instant fears got cooldown, and casted ones, well, you're an enhancement shaman for a reason. If you can't manage to interrupt/ground two fears in a row you should be feared, really. Plus if you break a fear once while feared(and thats how tremor works now), dr's kicking in. Think about that too.

    It is true, tremor totem is there for a reason. But don't forget fear is as well. The 6-sec duration is not that big of a problem, I'd rather be worried about the 10y range.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    and in terms of hard counters: purge or tremor are not more op than any cc with no cd (fear/poly/tornado(Willy-Willy perhaps? Sorry, couldn't resist)), long stuns, immunity's against anything (seal of freedom, bubble, iceblock, shapeshifting ) long disarm effects (10 seconds), spellsteal, stealth or new undispellable earth shield. (it's a nerf actually, no dispell protection)

    to those who say tremor/purge are op, tend to forget their op abilities, and take them for granted.
    Well if everyone is OP it's balanced I guess.

    Each class has their own niche and skills that define their playstyle. Listing how class' ability used in a certain situation is OP does not really lead anywhere. He's got X, you got Y, and the whole balance matter goes well beyond that. As for purge, it was much too strong. The other thing is, they overnerfed it. And I'm still waiting to see priest's dispell nerfed from 2 buffs to 1 as well.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by wtbLeto View Post
    My god. Just wait for tremor to pulse, then fear and destroy the totem? You won't be able to do anything even with those whole 'reflexes of a good shaman'. Whole argument over a moot point. Pro opponent level by the way.
    You can still kick fear, you know? You're true though, at least for instant fears/death coils.

    Quote Originally Posted by wtbLeto View Post
    Unnecessary. If you got feared once, you won't get feared twice. If you do, you're doing something wrong. Instant fears got cooldown, and casted ones, well, you're an enhancement shaman for a reason. If you can't manage to interrupt/ground two fears in a row you should be feared, really. Plus if you break a fear once while feared(and thats how tremor works now), dr's kicking in. Think about that too.
    As a destro warlock, you can setup two fears w/o being interrupted twice. death coil and shadow flame
    As a afflic warlock, you can setup two fears uninterrupted as well, improved howl of terror and death coil => fear
    There is also fel hunter silence... does it affect wind shear? im not sure atm.
    I'm not sure about demo warlocks at. at least they got death coil, but i think fel guard can also knockback to allow for another fear.
    There's also the possibility of a team with more than one fearing class.
    So there are situations where the instant destroyability 1min cd ability could come in very unhandy.

    I dont know if you commented at lower cd at any point, looks mostly like ractions to undistroyability to me.
    And you're right about the low range ofc. How are we supposed to get our mates out of fear now?


    Well if everyone is OP it's balanced I guess.

    Quote Originally Posted by wtbLeto View Post
    Each class has their own niche and skills that define their playstyle. Listing how class' ability used in a certain situation is OP does not really lead anywhere. He's got X, you got Y, and the whole balance matter goes well beyond that. As for purge, it was much too strong. The other thing is, they overnerfed it. And I'm still waiting to see priest's dispell nerfed from 2 buffs to 1 as well.
    Yes, purge was to strong. However we had to rely on that op'ness. Unless they allow ALL of our procs to work on shielded targets, and give us something like adecent stun/silence(maybe not obtainable for resto to avoid balance issues), enh has nothing up their sleave anymore.

    And please excuse my ignorance in regards to willy-willy. I'm german so there doesn't ring a bell for me ^^.
    And my intetion was not to whine about other classes, just to point out that abilities like purge are all over the place. There's a reason shamans did not dominate through purge in wotlk. Ele dominated with OP burst mainly, and shaman in general were taken because of bl. Other classes have a huge chunk of nice stuff, for us it's comprimated into a few good things, which just now got stomped.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angoth
    I'm sorry that Blizzard won't just gift wrap awesome in a cup and let you drink your fill.

  5. #25
    Deleted
    Just a quick response as I'm kinda busy last days

    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    You can still kick fear, you know?
    I don't know. How do I kick fear as enhancement? To respond to the real question, you were talking about instant cast fears like 'the moment just before they raise their hand to destroy the totem and cast fear' What was all that talking for if you meant castable fears? They do not cast fear faster than they raise their hand. Or whatever.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    As a destro warlock, you can setup two fears w/o being interrupted twice. death coil and shadow flame
    As a afflic warlock, you can setup two fears uninterrupted as well, improved howl of terror and death coil => fear
    There is also fel hunter silence... does it affect wind shear? im not sure atm.
    In most of such cases the previous tremor wouldn't help as well. The answer would be we still got trinket, and most importantly, teammates.

    I'm 90% sure it does, that's really one of the few cases when the previous version would be able to help you through a cc-chain as tremor can be dropped while silenced, but it would still be unreliable (slow pulse ratio, it can get destroyed before it even pulses).

    There was a thread about how a RNG dependent spec enhancement is. The old tremor was so unreliable due to slow pulsing that it just added to the pile of randomness. I don't know about anyone else but I'd prefer much more a reasonable defensive cooldown than just another tool that is too bad to actually do its work most of the time. You're right that the cooldown could've been about 10-15 sec shorter, but hey, I guess we can't have everything.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post

    Yes, purge was to strong. However we had to rely on that op'ness. Unless they allow ALL of our procs to work on shielded targets, and give us something like adecent stun/silence(maybe not obtainable for resto to avoid balance issues), enh has nothing up their sleave anymore.

    And please excuse my ignorance in regards to willy-willy. I'm german so there doesn't ring a bell for me ^^.
    And my intetion was not to whine about other classes, just to point out that abilities like purge are all over the place. There's a reason shamans did not dominate through purge in wotlk. Ele dominated with OP burst mainly, and shaman in general were taken because of bl. Other classes have a huge chunk of nice stuff, for us it's comprimated into a few good things, which just now got stomped.

    Willy-willy is a australian name for a tornado, I guess you meant cyclone Sorry for pointing it out though. The reason why purge wasn't so dominant all throughout wotlk is that people (priests especially) had loads of often autoproccing crapbuffs .That, with the I guess 30% or 35% dispell resist talents all the healers had, took forever to get rid of to get to the important buffs. It was the buff and dispel change along with low mana cost that made purge so overpowered. Once again, they overnerfed it though, and enha will be still able to spam purge throughout bursty moments thanks to shamanistic rage. Pop SR, purge like mad. Just with not the same effectiveness.

    I know that you're afraid of getting robbed once again. I feel your pain, I've been enhancement since late vanilla. I just know we shouldn't be balanced around unbalanced skills, and I guess that this change along with the disappearance of bloodlust from arenas makes us turn in a good direction.

    And it was supposed to be short. Damn

  6. #26
    I was discussing this with a guildie a couple days back, and we came to the conclusion that it's both a buff and a nerf, and therefore it's neither as well. It's more a change of playstyle - yes there are situations where you'd prefer the old tremor totem, and situations where you'll prefer the new tremor totem, and these will vary from player to player.

    To me, however, the Tremor change makes a lot of sense because it's an auto-ticking dispel, along the same sort of lines as Cleansing Totem, which Blizzard has specifically said they want to avoid. Assuming a PVE situation (for ease of example) Tremor Totem USED to be an automatically ticking removal of fear, charm and sleep. In PVP the only reason it wasn't an automatic thing is because people destroyed it, which led to the situation where you had to keep putting tremor down every time it was destroyed. This micro-management of totems was tedious for some and for others defined Shamanistic good play.

    Like a lot of changes, it will come down to who can adapt to it most, I can certainly see many advantages to a fear break, but I think the biggest improvement for me is that this will allow me more free GCDs against fear teams to use Earthbind and Stoneclaw (for the shield).

    I think that Enhance shaman have always been stuck in that support role which never fully developed in WoW as in other games - we provided lots of buffs and protection to our team-mates (Herolust, Tremor, Grounding, Cleansing, Purge, Totems) but in many cases this became our downfall - our support abilities were so good that we got balanced around them, mainly because a lot of them empowered others rather than just ourselves. By stripping back some of this support, I hope that we can actually be balanced better because of it.

  7. #27
    I like the new idea but the CDs to long...30 sec CD 6 second duration?
    s5-2.4k s6-2.2k s7-2k s8-2.1k
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yybvdzSgUQ4 Haters man...

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by ShamanWiz View Post
    I like the new idea but the CDs to long...30 sec CD 6 second duration?
    1 minute cooldown for what is essentially a second PVP trinket doesn't seem too unreasonable. Tremor Totem is not meant to be a hard counter to fear - it's to get you out of ONE fear, the rest is up to you, l2wind shear and grounding.

  9. #29
    It's Will of the Forsaken, with fear only. It's a buff. The Old Tremor never worked..ever!
    I registered on MMO-Champion and all I got was this lousy signature.

    I'm a cynic. Deal with it!

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